Tow Vehicle for 22,000 Pounds Plus

[Texas_Roadrunn1]

Is anyone towing 22,000 lbs. plus? If so, what are you towing with? Which rear end, what kind of mileage do you get? Do you have any tips? Have you pulled in the mountains, any problems? Thanks so very much for your help.

[RustyJC]

transamz9 wrote:

No sir, I tow at 28,000 combined. I completely understand all the pluses and minuses of the gears. With my set-up I lock it in 5th and have vary few downshifts @ interstate speeds. I'm not telling the OP to get 3.42's I'm saying 3.73's would be fine.

Which is precisely my point. When towing, you effectively don't have a 6 speed transmission. You have a 5 speed transmission with a taller 1st gear as compared to a truck with 4.10s. If you like to operate that way, that's fine - your money and your choice. Is the truck capacity optimized operating that way? No.

Since the 3.73s fall between the 3.42s and 4.10s, here's the problem. If we all agree (as we seem to) that 1750 RPM @ 65 MPH is a sweet spot for towing on the interstate, with 3.73s 5th gear will be too low and 6th gear will be too high.

There's a reason why Ram GCWR ratings increase so markedly as axle ratios step from 3.42 to 3.73 to 4.10.

Rusty

[Cummins12V98]

transamz9 wrote:

rhagfo wrote:

transamz9 wrote:
If you are planning on drag racing get the 4.10 if not the 3.73 will be more than enough gear an better all around gear.

If pulling a 23,000# 5er 4.10's are nice to get rolling, and hills.

Like I said before, I pull with 3.42's and yes there is a difference but I have never had an issue " getting going ". I have actually had my traction control kick in a couple times on damp roads taking off at lights that are on hills. Be leave me, 900 lbft of torque has no problem getting 23000 moving or keeping it moving.

I don't think we are talking modified trucks here. 900TQ is not stock for your truck. I can't remember do you have 68RFE or Aisin?

[transamz9]

RustyJC wrote:


What does your 5th wheel weigh? You're apparently talking about 23,000 lb GCW since you're towing with a SRW truck. The OP is probably going to be in the 32,000 lb GCW range once he's loaded with everything.

If it were me and (like the OP) I were going to tow a 22,000 lb 5th wheel, I think I might listen to those of us who are pulling the late model DRVs and other 5th wheels in the OP's weight range. But, that's just my opinion....

Can you do it with 3.42s? Yes - Cummins12v98 did, but notice when he changed trucks, he went to 4.10s. I've towed with 3.54s in a 2nd generation Ram - biggest mistake I ever made! That's why I ran 4.10s in the 2002 Ram as well as in the 2011.

With the 4.10s and the double overdrive 68RFE or Aisin (both have almost identical 6th gear ratios), 65 MPH in 6th gear is ~1750 RPM, so 6th gear is useful for towing, downshifting on grades is minimized, driveline stresses are lessened for a given wheel torque, you have the advantage of 6 versus 5 useful gears for towing and a lower overall 1st gear ratio which eases torque and heat loading on the torque converter, etc.

Rusty

No sir, I tow at 28,000 combined. I completely understand all the pluses and minuses of the gears. With my set-up I lock it in 5th and have vary few downshifts @ interstate speeds. I'm not telling the OP to get 3.42's I'm saying 3.73's would be fine.

[Cummins12V98]

Texas Roadrunner wrote:
Thanks so much for your help, folks. This is really helpful information. Haven't heard much about the Ford 350 duallys. Anyone with experience pulling a really heavy fiver?

Do your self a favor and look the other way! Go to a full timers RV park and you will see mostly RAM's, GM's then not a lot of Fords. Same goes for Independent RV haulers.

CP4 pump warranty denial is enough to stay away!

[Cummins12V98]

transamz9 wrote:

Texas Roadrunner wrote:
Cummins 12V,

Thank you so much for your help, this is just the kind of information we need. We really appreciate the help. Wish we could go with the 373 rear end but we probably should go with the 410, shouldn't have any issues if we do that. The gas mileage will probably be not quite as good as we could get with the 373, but it is the sensible thing to do. We were averaging 10.5-11 with the Denali pulling our 36' MS. Thanks again!

If you want the 3.73's I'd say go to it. I tow 20,000 (28,000) combined with 3.42 an run some pretty steep grades on the back roads around lakes and never one time felt I needed more power.

I would agree with you up to 28K combined the 3.42's work well. My 11 HO had 3.42's I towed in 5th at 60 with rpm's about 1,750 the same as 4.10's in 6th at 60. The only issue I had was getting the load rolling on a grade. Up to 28K get the 3.42's with the AISIN you will be very happy. Over that forget the 3.73's and go AISIN and 4.10's.

It really makes a HUGE difference with the 4.10's and AISIN getting the load rolling with a HEAVY load.

[Cummins12V98]

Texas Roadrunner wrote:
Cummins 12V,

Thank you so much for your help, this is just the kind of information we need. We really appreciate the help. Wish we could go with the 373 rear end but we probably should go with the 410, shouldn't have any issues if we do that. The gas mileage will probably be not quite as good as we could get with the 373, but it is the sensible thing to do. We were averaging 10.5-11 with the Denali pulling our 36' MS. Thanks again!

Towing heavy I really don't think the 3.73's would do better than the 4.10's since the 4.10's are really in the sweet spot at 1,750 at 60 in 6th. Solo the 3.73's would get a bit better but at this level who really cares?

You are welcome!

[RustyJC]

transamz9 wrote:

rhagfo wrote:

transamz9 wrote:
If you are planning on drag racing get the 4.10 if not the 3.73 will be more than enough gear an better all around gear.

If pulling a 23,000# 5er 4.10's are nice to get rolling, and hills.

Like I said before, I pull with 3.42's and yes there is a difference but I have never had an issue " getting going ". I have actually had my traction control kick in a couple times on damp roads taking off at lights that are on hills. Be leave me, 900 lbft of torque has no problem getting 23000 moving or keeping it moving.

What does your 5th wheel weigh? You're apparently talking about 23,000 lb GCW since you're towing with a SRW truck. The OP is probably going to be in the 32,000 lb GCW range once he's loaded with everything.

If it were me and (like the OP) I were going to tow a 22,000 lb 5th wheel, I think I might listen to those of us who are pulling the late model DRVs and other 5th wheels in the OP's weight range. But, that's just my opinion....

Can you do it with 3.42s? Yes - Cummins12v98 did, but notice when he changed trucks, he went to 4.10s. I've towed with 3.54s in a 2nd generation Ram - biggest mistake I ever made! That's why I ran 4.10s in the 2002 Ram as well as in the 2011.

With the 4.10s and the double overdrive 68RFE or Aisin (both have almost identical 6th gear ratios), 65 MPH in 6th gear is ~1750 RPM, so 6th gear is useful for towing, downshifting on grades is minimized, driveline stresses are lessened for a given wheel torque, you have the advantage of 6 versus 5 useful gears for towing and a lower overall 1st gear ratio which eases torque and heat loading on the torque converter, etc.

Rusty

[transamz9]

rhagfo wrote:

transamz9 wrote:
If you are planning on drag racing get the 4.10 if not the 3.73 will be more than enough gear an better all around gear.

If pulling a 23,000# 5er 4.10's are nice to get rolling, and hills.

Like I said before, I pull with 3.42's and yes there is a difference but I have never had an issue " getting going ". I have actually had my traction control kick in a couple times on damp roads taking off at lights that are on hills. Be leave me, 900 lbft of torque has no problem getting 23000 moving or keeping it moving.

[rhagfo]

transamz9 wrote:
If you are planning on drag racing get the 4.10 if not the 3.73 will be more than enough gear an better all around gear.

If pulling a 23,000# 5er 4.10's are nice to get rolling, and hills.

[Texas_Roadrunn1]

Thanks so much for your help, folks. This is really helpful information. Haven't heard much about the Ford 350 duallys. Anyone with experience pulling a really heavy fiver?

[transamz9]

If you are planning on drag racing get the 4.10 if not the 3.73 will be more than enough gear an better all around gear.

[RustyJC]

You really won't regret the 4.10s with the double overdrive automatics. Towing heavy, more gear is better.

Rusty

[Me_Again]

I have driven CUMMINS dually with the 4.10's. With double overdrive 5 and 6 gears. The difference on the road it minimal. Where the 4:10 come into play it getting the load moving from a stop.

Ron stopped at the bottom of a slightly uphill on ramp on I-5 with 4 of us in the truck full of pizza and as we merged onto the highway we were doing over 90 MPH. I should go repeat it in my SRW 3500 with 3.42's.

Ron, ready for pizza again this spring? Chris

[transamz9]

Texas Roadrunner wrote:
Cummins 12V,

Thank you so much for your help, this is just the kind of information we need. We really appreciate the help. Wish we could go with the 373 rear end but we probably should go with the 410, shouldn't have any issues if we do that. The gas mileage will probably be not quite as good as we could get with the 373, but it is the sensible thing to do. We were averaging 10.5-11 with the Denali pulling our 36' MS. Thanks again!

If you want the 3.73's I'd say go to it. I tow 20,000 (28,000) combined with 3.42 an run some pretty steep grades on the back roads around lakes and never one time felt I needed more power.

[Texas_Roadrunn1]

Cummins 12V,

Thank you so much for your help, this is just the kind of information we need. We really appreciate the help. Wish we could go with the 373 rear end but we probably should go with the 410, shouldn't have any issues if we do that. The gas mileage will probably be not quite as good as we could get with the 373, but it is the sensible thing to do. We were averaging 10.5-11 with the Denali pulling our 36' MS. Thanks again!