Dinghy brakes or not?

[Jayco-noslide]

I'm hesitant about this topic because I will probably get lectured but I'm wondering how many of you flat tow with no supplemental brakes? My situation is a 30 ft motor home towing a 2700 lb. Chevy Sonic. I think I'm legal if under 3000 lbs. To me it seems to stop as well or better than my former rig of a 25 ft. 5th wheel towed by a half-ton truck, with the trailer having brakes. I know that every inch less that 1 can stop is important but, let's face it, stopping distance is going to be longer with any RV set-up brakes or not. I'm brakeless mainly I guess because of cost but also inconvenience of another thing to mess with. Just wondering if I am a group of 1 or many?

[irishtom29]

Lantley wrote:

Towing without brakes in the OP's scenario is negligence and illegal in most places.

Cite the law as it applies to the OP in "most places".

Here in Florida a trailer under 3000 pounds need not have brakes. But a 2 axle towing vehicle and trailer under 3000 pounds must be able to stop from 20mph in 40'. So the OP is good in Florida. Now Florida isn't most places but It's a place, and one rife with RVs pulling cars.

[Lantley]

Your really asking a silly question. You know the answer. You need brakes.
Towing without brakes in the OP's scenario is negligence and illegal in most places.
If something goes wrong and someone gets hurt I hope you are content and can accept your actions.
Why would you want to tow without brakes? For the savings? Really!

[mowermech]

If you plan on visiting Montana, be sure you are familiar with:
MCA 61-1-101 Definitions, especially para. 82
MCA 61-9-304, Brakes required on all wheels, EXCEPTIONS, especially para (2)
MCA 61-9-312, Performance ability of brakes, especially para (4)

What are the LEGAL requirements in YOUR state?
You really should KNOW the applicable laws!

[Dutch_12078]

The laws of physics apply in all states...

[Bumpyroad]

DutchmenSport wrote:
Go to a Home Depot or a Lowe's home center and look around the parking lot at the vehicles and utility trailers the locals are using. Most utility trailers are well under the 3000 pound limit and don't have any kind of brakes. Just walk by and see if any of them have a break-away cable or a battery connected to run the break-away. I bet they don't.

Not to be a smart A$$ here, but if they don't require break away, why should your toad if it's total weight is under 3000 pounds???? Unless there is a specific law written requiring towed vehicles to have operational breaks while in tow? Check with your DMV?

those rental utility trailers are designed for local deliveries, not cross country travel on interstates.
and the OP should check with the DMV in all of the states he will be towing.
bumpy

[Bumpyroad]

what does the RV's owner's manual say about towing? if over xxx lbs. do they recommend brakes on a toad. just because you didn't read that or pay attention, the lawyer for the person you hit will. I think it is foolish to tow something without a braking or brake away system.
bumpy

[EsoxLucius]

Famous last words; "All is good...", "I don't think..."

[lanerd]

DownTheAvenue wrote:

lanerd wrote:
It's really simple logic.

and/or loos of insurance coverage.

It is a matter of physics, not logic.

The insurance carrier cannot deny coverage unless it specifically states in the policy vehicles without supplemental braking are not covered, if the driver of the vehicle is breaking any law there is no coverage, or words to that effect. The insurance carrier cannot just deny coverage because a vehicle could not stop quick enough. That doesn't make sense.

You have taken my statement completely out of context. The "logic" statement referred to the following:

It's really simple logic. If both vehicles have brakes, the emergency stopping distance will be shorter "than" if only one has brakes.

Ron

[lanerd]

Posted By: gbopp on 08/17/16 09:55am

lanerd wrote:

If both vehicles have brakes, the emergency stopping distance will be shorter if only one has brakes.

I don't think that is what you wanted to say? /

Should have proof read it before I submitted it.:S


Of course I meant:

It's really simple logic. If both vehicles have brakes, the emergency stopping distance will be shorter "than" if only one has brakes.


Thanks for catching that for me.

Ron

[DutchmenSport]

Go to a Home Depot or a Lowe's home center and look around the parking lot at the vehicles and utility trailers the locals are using. Most utility trailers are well under the 3000 pound limit and don't have any kind of brakes. Just walk by and see if any of them have a break-away cable or a battery connected to run the break-away. I bet they don't.

Not to be a smart A$$ here, but if they don't require break away, why should your toad if it's total weight is under 3000 pounds???? Unless there is a specific law written requiring towed vehicles to have operational breaks while in tow? Check with your DMV?

[Leeblev]

I wasn't going to respond, but......
Do yourself a favor and review the states you may wish to visit's braking requirements. As previously said, some states require braking for VEHICLES over 1500 lbs and some 3000 and some none. Note that I said VEHICLES. If you check the Vehicle Code in those states, you will find they say something like "towed vehicle", not "MOTOR VEHICLE". Since CA requires a towed vehicle over 1500 lbs to have brakes, I never had an issue because I understood they were required.
I would never listen to anyone who says: "I been towing for 50 years without brakes and never had a problem". Good for him. Doesn't mean you won't 1/2 mile from home.
I have towed with a 3/4 ton Diesel, a 4700 International diesel with disc brakes and a 36' Motorhome on a Freightliner chassis equipped with airbrakes. I have towed with a tow dolly and 4 down. I am presently towing a Ford Ranger 4 down (weighs 3300 lbs) equipped with air applied brakes. Everything I have towed had a breakaway switch. Common sense says you don't want any toad getting free and passing you down the hill!
I have experienced brake fade on the 3/4 ton towing a 5er with exhaust braking. I Never had a problem with the International because it was designed to stop much more than the GVW of my vehicles. I have noted that in my MH I CAN tell the difference with the supplemental braking on my toad disconnected. (Not on purpose, I assure you)
IMHO, if you tow something on a dolly or 4 down, you need a breakaway and supplemental braking to be safe. I will tow nothing without supplemental brakes.
Make a good decision now and you won't have regrets later!

[dons2346]

Case sited to us during a recent FMCA seminar. Guy was towing with the coach and the toad had no aux brake system. A kid ran a red light and T-boned the coach. Kid's daddy was a hot shot lawyer so the case went to court as to responsibility. Coach driver lost because there wasn't an aux system in the toad.

My coach weighs about 30,000 loaded and I tow a Jeep GC. I have towed with and without my aux brake and I can definitely tell the difference in stopping distance and effort.

[DownTheAvenue]

lanerd wrote:
It's really simple logic.

and/or loos of insurance coverage.

It is a matter of physics, not logic.

The insurance carrier cannot deny coverage unless it specifically states in the policy vehicles without supplemental braking are not covered, if the driver of the vehicle is breaking any law there is no coverage, or words to that effect. The insurance carrier cannot just deny coverage because a vehicle could not stop quick enough. That doesn't make sense.

[jk31668]

i had a master tow dolly w/o brakes. in the interest of safety and not knowing where we might go i ordered the brake parts from the master tow online catalog and then had a local rv mechanic install them. total cost was under $400. this also makes selling the dolly easier down the road. jmho.

[mowermech]

Yes, of course, obey the law.
MOST states do NOT have any law requiring brakes on a towed motor vehicle.
MOST states DO, however, have laws requiring brakes on a TRAILER. Many states have a legal definition of a TRAILER that does NOT match a towed motor vehicle.
Many states (and the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards) (FMVSS) have a braking performance law that states a combination of vehicles must be able to stop within a certain distance (usually 40 or 45 feet), from a certain speed (usually 20 MPH) on a level, dry, clean, hard surface.
The laws requiring a breakaway system also apply to trailers, not towed motor vehicles in many states.
Yes, common sense tells me that a braking system on a towed vehicle is a good idea.
Common sense also tells me that if such a braking system is an absolute necessity, in the Nanny state of today, there WOULD be a law requiring such a system, and there would be standards that would have to be met by the manufacturers, and the systems would be thoroughly tested and approved by an independent testing agency. The Insurance Institute for Highway Safety would be all over the issue like stink on a cattle feedlot!
All that having been said, I towed vehicles on dollys, and Jeeps four down, for many years (including many trips over the Continental Divide) without a braking system of any kind. In all those years, I never had to make an "emergency stop" when towing.
I have done considerable research into the laws of my state, and the only law I have to worry about is the Braking Performance Law (MCA 61-9-312).
Other states, of course, may be different, and Reciprocity Agreements do not apply AFAIK.