Stolen Catalytic Converter

[Catch_the_Visio]

My catalytic converter was stolen on last week from my 2003 Coachmen, Ford V10. Any suggestions on where to get one from, replacement, cost, ect? So frustrated. Had a trip planned for this weekend, now cancelled.

[Grit_dog]

"Try to find a (new) old style 5 gal "Jerry Can". Feds = no mas several years ago. Must have new style "spill proof" (ha ha) spout."


This is probably a bigger travesty than stolen cats!

But there's plenty of fuel cans out there that pour well still.
For home and jobsite use, hard to beat plain old metal safety cans.
As OSHA/L&I doesn't allow plastic fuel cans in construction, or without flash arrestors, those are the go to for jobsites.
Race jugs are also plentiful and frankly far easier and faster to dispense fuel out of than most old school plastic fuel jugs.
And they are also sold under the guise of "liquid" containers "not to be used for gasoline" wink, wink, at most farm supply stores and real hardware stores.

[Gdetrailer]

Jarlaxle wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:

ferndaleflyer wrote:
If you have no emissions inspections who knows or cares if you have a straight pipe. I have 2 pickups that haven’t had converters in years.

Most states have SOME "form" of checking/testing emissions, operating without ALL emission related equipment in place AND operating can be a hassle.

Myself, I am lucky to be just outside a county that DOES do full emissions testing, my county only requires the safety inspection mechanics to merely check to make sure cats are not missing.

As far as a vehicle operating fine without Cats, you obviously do not have a newer modern emission system or you have chipped your vehicle to bypass emissions.

OPs system is on a 2003 V10, 2003 typically will only have upstream O2 sensors which are before the cats, it may appear to "work fine" without cats but the reality is without having the back pressure of the cats those sensors will report back to the engine computer INCORRECT oxygen levels. The upstream O2 sensors are what the engine computer uses to detect the fuel mixture information. This WILL affect the fuel trim which can lead to an overly "rich" fuel mixture or an overly "lean" fuel mixture. This results in burning excessive fuel (dropping mileage) and if overly lean the engine will run excessively hot and possibly damage the engine.

Many vehicles sold specifically for California before 2003 CAN have upstream AND downstream O2 sensors and without a cat in place and operating it WILL cause a check engine light to stay lit..

I know emissions systems were changed between 2003 and 2006 and our 2006 5.4 V8 had BOTH upstream and downstream O2 sensors and I can assure you, ANY malfunction of the upstream or downstream 02 sensors CAN AND WILL affect the engines performance and mileage plus set the check engine light.. Been there, done that..

As far as cats, generics are not all that expensive considering the cost of a vehicle, we paid less than $250 per cat for generics (2006 5.4 had TWO cats, one for each bank).. The generic replacements work fine, we had no issue with them..

OPs 2003, the thieves may have done the OP a favor, that is within the yrs of cats known to suffer with the rattle of death in which the internal cat structure would fail and start rattling until it clogs..

Everything back to 1996 has a downstream O2 sensor-it was required by OBD2.

Nope.

That was phased in.

Depended on the vehicles GVWR and year..

I CAN assure you, my old '97 and 2003 F250s I had only had a UPSTREAM O2 sensor.

The 2003 had OBD2 PORT but did not have full implementation of all OBD2 functions. I could plug in a OBD2 code reader, but code reader would only show the functions of OBD1 on that yr and only upstream O2 sensors showed.

The 2006 F250 had BOTH..

'97 and 2003 F250s were 2V 5.4 and 2006 F250 was 3V 5.4

F150s got dressed up with upstream and downstream O2 sensors before the F250s as they were not under the GVWR exception..

[Gdetrailer]

wa8yxm wrote:
CATs are a very expensive precious metal.. IF you have a planned trip this weekend I'd file with insurance and install a bypass pipe for the planned trip. When your insurance settles replace the CAT

note; some engines do not run properly without the cat and of course it's illegal to replace with bypass pipe save for testing.... Which is why I say carry a copy of the theft report and the insurance claim submission if you travel that way.

As far as CATS being "expensive" that depends on the size.

Typical auto cats may only 1-5 grams of Platinum, larger CATS on truck engines can have as much as 10 Grams.. Current wholesale price of Platinum is average $38 per gram..

So a cat could have $38-$380 worth of Platinum.. However, the thieves are not getting NEW prices for stolen CATS, they are going to get considerably less than "mixed metal" scrap prices unless they can break it down to just the Platinum..

We had to replace both CATS on our old 2006 F250 that clogged due to the rattle of death which had TWO CATS, the cost for aftermarket was $250 per CAT and the labor was $120.. The OEM CATS would have been $500 each and well over $500 for labor at our local Ford Dealer..

And you ARE correct that without the CATS in place, engines TUNED for them do not run as well as they should when they are not present. Without the CATS the O2 sensors see a different OXYGEN LEVEL in the exhaust flow which dilutes and alters the exhaust. ECU will then adjust the fuel trim to accommodate the new readings.. This often ends up with the ECU ADDING more fuel than needed. The result is an over Rich fuel mixture which wastes fuel, reduces performance and mileage (you CAN have too much fuel).. If ECU can no longer add enough fuel trim to satisfy the O2 readings then it triggers a check engine light because it is no longer within the parameters of the fuel map.

The trick around that is folks used to "chip" the ECU with new fuel maps.. The new school is "programmers" that load a new fuel map to the ECU. Newer emissions systems use two O2 sensors per CAT, the upstream sensors are for fuel mixture and the downstream sensors are for the effectiveness of the CATS.. No CAT installed WILL trigger a check engine light on those systems as the downstream O2 sensor reading will be outside the emissions parameter maps.. Folks get away with that using a Programmer.. However EPA has tightened up on the Programmer companies and now days not easy to find one that is willing to make those mods anymore..

[Jarlaxle]

Dtank wrote:
Many exhaust shops sell generic Catalytic converters.

Available on Amazon.

Theft is common in CA.

**************************************************************

Yes to all three.

However, Buyer Beware!!- OEM replacements *ARE* expensive!

"Generic" cats are not CARB compliant. Can't be sold in CA or NY.
They will *not* pass SMOG tests!

Poster says, "Been driving both my trucks for years with a chunk of exhaust pipe in place of the Cat."

Kinda like regularly driving 10-20 mph over the speed limit on the freeway/expressway. Works until you get caught.

Cats were not req'd on some diesel pickups (Dodge) until the 2005 model year. "Cat Delete" pipes were available from many parts suppliers. Not anymore! *IF* you can find a supplier - you must sign your life away - stating the vehicle is only used for racing purposes. A seller and/or installer will be out of business in short order w/ mega $ fine.

Try to find a (new) old style 5 gal "Jerry Can". Feds = no mas several years ago. Must have new style "spill proof" (ha ha) spout.

Note: As with CA & NY, other states (and the Feds) are adopting the CARB regs all the time. Call it what you want - but from a state perspective, besides clean air....try calling it.... *REVENUE*.

CA = Blue State. AZ = Red State - depending on urban vs rural counties, both do Smog Testing.

(Voice of a Smog Test Only operator for 20+ years.)

IMO - Skip the "plates". Wrap the cat with braided steel cable, secured at both ends - long way from the kitty. Still can be stolen, but time & effort is a thief's enemy.

Many of the "generic" cats WILL, in fact, pass a smog test. (Mine have, many times.) The manufacturer just hasn't spent the money and jumped through the hoops to get CARB certification.

[Jarlaxle]

Gdetrailer wrote:

ferndaleflyer wrote:
If you have no emissions inspections who knows or cares if you have a straight pipe. I have 2 pickups that haven’t had converters in years.

Most states have SOME "form" of checking/testing emissions, operating without ALL emission related equipment in place AND operating can be a hassle.

Myself, I am lucky to be just outside a county that DOES do full emissions testing, my county only requires the safety inspection mechanics to merely check to make sure cats are not missing.

As far as a vehicle operating fine without Cats, you obviously do not have a newer modern emission system or you have chipped your vehicle to bypass emissions.

OPs system is on a 2003 V10, 2003 typically will only have upstream O2 sensors which are before the cats, it may appear to "work fine" without cats but the reality is without having the back pressure of the cats those sensors will report back to the engine computer INCORRECT oxygen levels. The upstream O2 sensors are what the engine computer uses to detect the fuel mixture information. This WILL affect the fuel trim which can lead to an overly "rich" fuel mixture or an overly "lean" fuel mixture. This results in burning excessive fuel (dropping mileage) and if overly lean the engine will run excessively hot and possibly damage the engine.

Many vehicles sold specifically for California before 2003 CAN have upstream AND downstream O2 sensors and without a cat in place and operating it WILL cause a check engine light to stay lit..

I know emissions systems were changed between 2003 and 2006 and our 2006 5.4 V8 had BOTH upstream and downstream O2 sensors and I can assure you, ANY malfunction of the upstream or downstream 02 sensors CAN AND WILL affect the engines performance and mileage plus set the check engine light.. Been there, done that..

As far as cats, generics are not all that expensive considering the cost of a vehicle, we paid less than $250 per cat for generics (2006 5.4 had TWO cats, one for each bank).. The generic replacements work fine, we had no issue with them..

OPs 2003, the thieves may have done the OP a favor, that is within the yrs of cats known to suffer with the rattle of death in which the internal cat structure would fail and start rattling until it clogs..

Everything back to 1996 has a downstream O2 sensor-it was required by OBD2.

[ferndaleflyer]

Must be something special about my trucks. They have been running well without check engine lights, poor performance, and CATs for several years now. I won’t comment on other states bud diesels are exempt in MD and last I knew there was no emissions inspection at all on the Eastern shore or in Western MD

[schlep1967]

Catch the Vision wrote:
He said they have created and designed their own security device to protect from future thefts. They weld a sheet underneath that protects the cat. What are your thoughts on this protection device? Thanks so much everyone!

If they are using a tool that cuts metal (angle grinder) to get the cats off, another layer of metal may make them look to the next vehicle. But if they have the time, they will just cut the metal sheet with the same tool.

[wa8yxm]

CATs are a very expensive precious metal.. IF you have a planned trip this weekend I'd file with insurance and install a bypass pipe for the planned trip. When your insurance settles replace the CAT

note; some engines do not run properly without the cat and of course it's illegal to replace with bypass pipe save for testing.... Which is why I say carry a copy of the theft report and the insurance claim submission if you travel that way.

[toedtoes]

ol-Bombero-JC

Sorry. I just clicked the quote link and the system did the rest. Looks like it got confused.

My post meant I agreed with you. 🙂

[Dtank]

Many exhaust shops sell generic Catalytic converters.

Available on Amazon.

Theft is common in CA.

**************************************************************

Yes to all three.

However, Buyer Beware!!- OEM replacements *ARE* expensive!

"Generic" cats are not CARB compliant. Can't be sold in CA or NY.
They will *not* pass SMOG tests!

Poster says, "Been driving both my trucks for years with a chunk of exhaust pipe in place of the Cat."

Kinda like regularly driving 10-20 mph over the speed limit on the freeway/expressway. Works until you get caught.

Cats were not req'd on some diesel pickups (Dodge) until the 2005 model year. "Cat Delete" pipes were available from many parts suppliers. Not anymore! *IF* you can find a supplier - you must sign your life away - stating the vehicle is only used for racing purposes. A seller and/or installer will be out of business in short order w/ mega $ fine.

Try to find a (new) old style 5 gal "Jerry Can". Feds = no mas several years ago. Must have new style "spill proof" (ha ha) spout.

Note: As with CA & NY, other states (and the Feds) are adopting the CARB regs all the time. Call it what you want - but from a state perspective, besides clean air....try calling it.... *REVENUE*.

CA = Blue State. AZ = Red State - depending on urban vs rural counties, both do Smog Testing.

(Voice of a Smog Test Only operator for 20+ years.)

IMO - Skip the "plates". Wrap the cat with braided steel cable, secured at both ends - long way from the kitty. Still can be stolen, but time & effort is a thief's enemy.

.

[ol_Bombero-JC]

toedtoes wrote:

ol Bombero-JC wrote:
"Becoming very common in California."

VERY common EVERYWHERE !!...:S

Visit YouTube to view various anti-theft devices and options for same.

The cats are NOT being re-sold by salvage yards - they are destroyed to recover the precious metals.

Your comprehensive insurance (minus deductible) may cover it.

Replacement is not cheap - no matter where a replacement is sourced..:(


.

This.

And there are a ton of regulations, federal and state, that restrict the allowable replacement parameters. I would go through my insurance and a reputable shop to get the work done, especially if you live in a state with required smog checks.

BTW - also correct. The forum omitted the quoted "format" on my original reply to "lwidds", but at least the quotations are there.

~

[ol_Bombero-JC]

ol Bombero-JC wrote:
"Becoming very common in California."

VERY common EVERYWHERE !!...:S

Visit YouTube to view various anti-theft devices and options for same.

The cats are NOT being re-sold by salvage yards - they are destroyed to recover the precious metals.

Your comprehensive insurance (minus deductible) may cover it.

Replacement is not cheap - no matter where a replacement is sourced..:(


.

"TOEDTOES" - You incorrectly attributed the post by "lwiddis" to me...:(

I quoted from lwiddis' post - as above - stating Catalytic Converter theft is very common *everywhere* !!.... Which, of course it is - including California.

And This: All the above is correct.

~

[Gdetrailer]

ferndaleflyer wrote:
If you have no emissions inspections who knows or cares if you have a straight pipe. I have 2 pickups that haven’t had converters in years.

Most states have SOME "form" of checking/testing emissions, operating without ALL emission related equipment in place AND operating can be a hassle.

Myself, I am lucky to be just outside a county that DOES do full emissions testing, my county only requires the safety inspection mechanics to merely check to make sure cats are not missing.

As far as a vehicle operating fine without Cats, you obviously do not have a newer modern emission system or you have chipped your vehicle to bypass emissions.

OPs system is on a 2003 V10, 2003 typically will only have upstream O2 sensors which are before the cats, it may appear to "work fine" without cats but the reality is without having the back pressure of the cats those sensors will report back to the engine computer INCORRECT oxygen levels. The upstream O2 sensors are what the engine computer uses to detect the fuel mixture information. This WILL affect the fuel trim which can lead to an overly "rich" fuel mixture or an overly "lean" fuel mixture. This results in burning excessive fuel (dropping mileage) and if overly lean the engine will run excessively hot and possibly damage the engine.

Many vehicles sold specifically for California before 2003 CAN have upstream AND downstream O2 sensors and without a cat in place and operating it WILL cause a check engine light to stay lit..

I know emissions systems were changed between 2003 and 2006 and our 2006 5.4 V8 had BOTH upstream and downstream O2 sensors and I can assure you, ANY malfunction of the upstream or downstream 02 sensors CAN AND WILL affect the engines performance and mileage plus set the check engine light.. Been there, done that..

As far as cats, generics are not all that expensive considering the cost of a vehicle, we paid less than $250 per cat for generics (2006 5.4 had TWO cats, one for each bank).. The generic replacements work fine, we had no issue with them..

OPs 2003, the thieves may have done the OP a favor, that is within the yrs of cats known to suffer with the rattle of death in which the internal cat structure would fail and start rattling until it clogs..

[ferndaleflyer]

If you have no emissions inspections who knows or cares if you have a straight pipe. I have 2 pickups that haven’t had converters in years.