Supplemental Brakes Confession Time

[GreenSalsa]

Hello.

Long time member and have been driving my American Coach Revolution 42T for over 2 years now and LOVE it.

I just upgraded my 2007 Ford Escape (towed it with a two wheel tow dolly) to a 2017 Ford Edge.

I have lusted over flat towing for the past 24+ months, now that I have a vehicle that I can do it with my question is this:

My rig can tow 15,000 lbs. Do I really need a supplemental brake system for a car that has a curb weight of 4,000 lbs? I seriously doubt I will even know it is back there. I am completely confident the rig will stop the car.

What say the crowd? Do I need it or will I be okay with out it?

[wallynm]

I suggest it is a "NO BRAINIER" but then what would I know. I can tell you from experience that in an emergency stopping situation that a working supplemental braking system will stop a fishtail and keep things lined up when braking.

[mowermech]

In the often touted sudden emergency situation (dog or kid runs in front of you, car makes sudden stop in front of you, etc.) keep in mind how far you will travel before your foot even hits the brake pedal.
For instance, are you aware that at 60 MPH, you are traveling at 88 feet per second? What is YOUR reaction time?
Yes, a braking system on a towed vehicle is a good idea.
But, think about it. In a true sudden emergency situation, will it really do any good? Also, given the "Nanny State" mentality of today, isn't it likely that if the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (IIHS) or Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards (FMVSS) considered it a necessity, they would be testing the systems and recommending that every state pass laws requiring them?
Again, yes, such a braking system is a good idea.
However, I have been researching this issue for many years, and the only state I have found that appears to address the issue is North Carolina. Nearly every other state has a Braking Performance Standard that closely (or exactly) mirrors the Standard set by FMVSS. In fact, many states have a legal definition of a "trailer" encoded in law that specifically excludes towed motor vehicles!
I have also found that it is foolish to trust ANY "list of vehicle/towing laws" found on the internet. Just looking at what they say about Montana laws convinces me they can not be trusted at all.

[Mile_High]

Not wanting to pick a side on this one, but when I first got into towing a toad, I was told the supplemental brake also minimized a lot of wear and tear on the tow bar.

[tropical36]

Bumpyroad wrote:

PastorCharlie wrote:
http://drivinglaws.aaa.com/tag/trailer-brakes/

North Carolina

Every semitrailer, trailer, or separate vehicle attached by a drawbar or coupling to a towing vehicle of at least 4,000 lbs., and every house trailer weighing at least 1,000 lbs., shall be equipped with brakes controlled or operated by the driver of the towing vehicle.

North Carolina seems to clarify that whatever you call it, if you are dragging it behind your motorhome, it needs brakes.
and when I towed a toad, I was not concerned about the $500 fine or whatever for not having a braking/breakaway system, I was worried about the $5,000,000 civil suit for negligence awarded by some jury.
bumpy

My worry has always been about possibly saving someone from injury or death as a result of not being able to stop a few feet sooner and regardless of any laws on the books of which I could care less about. This I've stated many times before on like threads and never can figure out why laws, lawsuits and the like, seem to be the only concern with some, when the discussion should be, not if, but maybe what works best, without much in the line of failure.
I've seen some of these threads go on longer than it took me to order and install the whole system, for chrissy sakes and by now, the OP should have had his installed and working, as well.
On the note of safety and not long ago, we saw a small car load of people in front of us and up against the back window was this small child with only a few inches between him and the outside, so again, one foot of stopping distance could mean a lot.

[Bumpyroad]

PastorCharlie wrote:
http://drivinglaws.aaa.com/tag/trailer-brakes/

North Carolina

Every semitrailer, trailer, or separate vehicle attached by a drawbar or coupling to a towing vehicle of at least 4,000 lbs., and every house trailer weighing at least 1,000 lbs., shall be equipped with brakes controlled or operated by the driver of the towing vehicle.

North Carolina seems to clarify that whatever you call it, if you are dragging it behind your motorhome, it needs brakes.
and when I towed a toad, I was not concerned about the $500 fine or whatever for not having a braking/breakaway system, I was worried about the $5,000,000 civil suit for negligence awarded by some jury.
bumpy

[Mr_Mark1]

rgatijnet1 wrote:
Don't look for TRAILERS. Look for, or do what I did, ask the State Police, what the requirement is for a "VEHICLE IN TOW".
Then try to remember when you saw any tow truck operator put a supplemental braking system in a car that they were towing. TRAILER requirements are what the people put in the ads to fool people in to buying their braking system. It works, so they keep doing it. msimth1199 is ex-police and he is telling you the truth.
As I mentioned, I contacted most States that I would travel in and never found a single one that required brakes in my toad. I posted the names of the people that I contacted. Here is a typical reply from Florida. NOTE that no weight limit is ever mentioned. Compare this with what BrakeBuddy tries to tell you:
A vehicle towed behind a motor home would be exempt from the braking requirements in Florida statute 316.261 as a drive away, tow away operation. Please contact me if you have any other questions.

Lt. Jeff Frost
Florida Highway Patrol
Public Affairs Officer
Commercial Vehicle Enforcement
2900 Apalachee Parkway, MS 45
850-617-2279
Tallahassee, Florida 32399
www.flhsmv.gov/fhp
Jefffrost@flhsmv.gov

RG, I'm not looking for 'trailers'. It is what came up when I punched in 'towing'. It is hard to navigate TDOT.

I want to see it in writing what TN says about towing a car behind a motorhome and the requirements.

I'll find it. I haven't given up.

MM.

[Busskipper]

rgatijnet1 wrote:
Don't look for TRAILERS. Look for, or do what I did, ask the State Police, what the requirement is for a "VEHICLE IN TOW".
Then try to remember when you saw any tow truck operator put a supplemental braking system in a car that they were towing. TRAILER requirements are what the people put in the ads to fool people in to buying their braking system. It works, so they keep doing it. msimth1199 is ex-police and he is telling you the truth.
As I mentioned, I contacted most States that I would travel in and never found a single one that required brakes in my toad. I posted the names of the people that I contacted. Here is a typical reply from Florida. NOTE that no weight limit is ever mentioned. Compare this with what BrakeBuddy tries to tell you:
A vehicle towed behind a motor home would be exempt from the braking requirements in Florida statute 316.261 as a drive away, tow away operation. Please contact me if you have any other questions.

Lt. Jeff Frost
Florida Highway Patrol
Public Affairs Officer
Commercial Vehicle Enforcement
2900 Apalachee Parkway, MS 45
850-617-2279
Tallahassee, Florida 32399
www.flhsmv.gov/fhp
Jefffrost@flhsmv.gov

Now that almost sounds Legal - you mean to tell me that the tow truck driver does not have a Brake Buddy:)






.

[rgatijnet1]

Don't look for TRAILERS. Look for, or do what I did, ask the State Police, what the requirement is for a "VEHICLE IN TOW".
Then try to remember when you saw any tow truck operator put a supplemental braking system in a car that they were towing. TRAILER requirements are what the people put in the ads to fool people in to buying their braking system. It works, so they keep doing it. msimth1199 is ex-police and he is telling you the truth.
As I mentioned, I contacted most States that I would travel in and never found a single one that required brakes in my toad. I posted the names of the people that I contacted. Here is a typical reply from Florida. NOTE that no weight limit is ever mentioned. Compare this with what BrakeBuddy tries to tell you:
A vehicle towed behind a motor home would be exempt from the braking requirements in Florida statute 316.261 as a drive away, tow away operation. Please contact me if you have any other questions.

Lt. Jeff Frost
Florida Highway Patrol
Public Affairs Officer
Commercial Vehicle Enforcement
2900 Apalachee Parkway, MS 45
850-617-2279
Tallahassee, Florida 32399
www.flhsmv.gov/fhp
Jefffrost@flhsmv.gov

[Mr_Mark1]

Down Home, it's not 4,000 lbs. for TN. All I can find at the moment is for trailers. But, I'm still looking.

Here is what I found for TN regarding trailers: "Every trailer or semitrailer of a gross weight of 3,000 lbs. or more must be equipped with brakes that may be applied by the driver of the towing vehicle from the cab and must be of a design such that in case of an accidental breakaway of the towed vehicle, the brakes will be automatically applied."

Every Tow equipment site that I pull up says that TN has a 3,000 lb. requirement for brakes and equipment.

TDOT doesn't have a very easy site to navigate.

Safe travels,
MM.

[PastorCharlie]

http://drivinglaws.aaa.com/tag/trailer-brakes/

North Carolina

Every semitrailer, trailer, or separate vehicle attached by a drawbar or coupling to a towing vehicle of at least 4,000 lbs., and every house trailer weighing at least 1,000 lbs., shall be equipped with brakes controlled or operated by the driver of the towing vehicle.

[msmith1199]

Kayteg1 wrote:
Don't buy the the opinions that it is required by law.
Buying small tractor in Nebraska, I was offered new 7000 lb equipment trailer with no brakes. I was driving 4000 lb SUV and would be perfectly legal.
Toads are not trailers and are legal to tow with no brakes in all states last time I was checking, but there might be updates in last years.
Still if you can find brake system that is really reliable and doesn't cost more than the toad, you can't go wrong with it.
BTW since the incident above, whenever I drive in Nebraska I make sure I don't do sudden braking.

Like most states, Nebraska has a braking performance requirement. I'm going out on a limb here, but I'll bet if you load that trailer to 7,000 pounds and put it behind your 4,000 pound SUV that you cannot meet the performance requirements required by Nebraska law.

[msmith1199]

PastorCharlie wrote:
Green Salsa, in NY and NC under 1,000 lbs. is the limit for no brake system. There is no state where it is legal to tow without a braking system if the tow is 1,000 lbs. or more.

http://www.brakebuddy.com/towing-laws

Brake Buddy is lying to you and they are doing it on purpose. In California, the State with the most laws in the land, it is NOT required to have brakes on a toad if you can meet the requirements in a braking performance chart. Never once have I seen CHP pull any motorhome over and require the driver get up to the appropriate speed and slam on the brakes.

[down_home]

I would have brakes on the towed. We have a 2013 edge and had a 2010 edge. Behind a Revolution. The extra braking is good to have in an emergency situation.
The Edge weighs around 4100 lb with awd. A little less without.
We can tell the difference in stopping with and without the brakes.
We have air brakes. Next one will be air brakes too but perhaps the air force one, I think it is called, which you don't have to remove the cylinder, from brake pedal, to bracket to drive.
I really didn't know Tn allowed 4,000 lbs without brakes. I'm glad we have them anyway.

[slickest1]

Kayteg1 wrote:
Don't buy the the opinions that it is required by law.
Buying small tractor in Nebraska, I was offered new 7000 lb equipment trailer with no brakes. I was driving 4000 lb SUV and would be perfectly legal.
Toads are not trailers and are legal to tow with no brakes in all states last time I was checking, but there might be updates in last years.
Still if you can find brake system that is really reliable and doesn't cost more than the toad, you can't go wrong with it.
BTW since the incident above, whenever I drive in Nebraska I make sure I don't do sudden braking.

A 4000 lb vehicle pulling a 7000 lb. trailer with no brakes may be legal. Just because there is no law saying a toad is a trailer you can throw common sense aside!
It is pure stupid in my opinion. Even if you are clairvoyant and can avoid a sudden stop.

[Mile_High]

I confess 🙂

When we first got our MH I didn't have braking system and we towed a season without. Colorado requires one over 3,000 lbs. I figured I should get one someday so I started asking around the campgrounds what they use and I soon found out I wasn't alone in towing without.

I decided I should have one for the breakaway if nothing else. I bought a Stay-n-play but ran into issues with our brake lights coming on with the exhaust brake, plus I wasn't sure when we would be replacing the Jeep, so I traded for an RVi2 portable. It works - not a miracle, but I'm sure its doing something back there.