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When does it end?

Fulltimer50
Explorer
Explorer
When workamping, do you normally accept non-emergency phone calls/texts at home from your boss when you are not working?
After more than a month on the job we are finding that our boss expects us to answer our phone during non-duty hours to hear things that, so far, could have been told during work hours. We have been doing this for over 11 yrs and this is a first for us.
George

2011 F350 PSD CC LB 4X4 DRW Lariate
2015 Mobile Suites 41RSSB4 5th Wheel
34 REPLIES 34

Fulltimer50
Explorer
Explorer
Its getting so that I would rather pay a reasonable site fee instead of getting a "free" site. But that would mean more pay to start with.
George

2011 F350 PSD CC LB 4X4 DRW Lariate
2015 Mobile Suites 41RSSB4 5th Wheel

doxiemom11
Explorer II
Explorer II
The ruling by the IRS was being used by many who volunteer for site,utilities etc so that they would not have to claim the value of such on their taxes as income. From reading the full-timers forums and Workampers News they indicate that it is very important to get this statement from the employer. If you do not, then there is no requirement for you to reside on the employers premises to perform your duties AND EVERYTHING is income and taxable on your personal income taxes. The value of the site, your utilities, laundry tokens, value of tickets to attractions the employer gives you - everything. This has been studied extensively by both Workampers News and Escapees. It is not for the benefit of the employer, It does not say you have to be on call 24/7, only that you are required to reside on the premises to perform your job duties.

2012Coleman
Explorer II
Explorer II
aguablanco wrote:
SDcampowneroperator wrote:
IRS regulations requre that a workcamper accept employer provided accommodation, be on call 24 hours a day to quailify for exemption in liew of declared wages and accomodation charge.
Look it up.


Since I found your statement to be amazing, at the very least, I have followed this thread with the hope you would post that "IRS Regulation." Not having done so I am compelled to believe that it is a regulation that has been manufactured to justify the abuse of workcampers and their time. Please prove me wrong and post the regulation here as soon as possible.
RichH
It's pretty sad that the two owners of campgrounds have such condescending views of people with legitimate questions, then come up with questionable statements with no links in order to justify their point.

Since the IRS is an agency that has rules on the collection of taxes, one could safely assume that if this rule did exist, it would be only relevant when calculating your tax return.

So I did what the one poster alluded to and looked it up. I first found several statements on CG websites recruiting workcampers that stated:

"The following information is included per IRS rules on lodging/compensation (irc1.119(b)): In order to properly perform your duties, you are required to accept employer provided accommodations as defined elsewhere in this agreement. The value of the accommodations will not be included in your gross income."

I also found statements that describe the working hours:

"Our work campers work 20 hours a week (10 hours a piece if you are a couple) for their site, electric, cable, and laundry which, depending on what needs to be done here, can be broken down into many different jobs. There is no overtime available and we are willing to work with you when it comes to the days/hours you work."

So I looked up the IRS Rule mentiond which happens to relate to meals and lodging furnished for the convenience of the employer.

The section on lodging states:

IRS wrote:
(b) Lodging. The value of lodging furnished to an employee by the employer shall be excluded from the employee's gross income if three tests are met:

(1) The lodging is furnished on the business premises of the employer,

(2) The lodging is furnished for the convenience of the employer, and

(3) The employee is required to accept such lodging as a condition of his employment.
The requirement of subparagraph (3) of this paragraph that the employee is required to accept such lodging as a condition of his employment means that he be required to accept the lodging in order to enable him properly to perform the duties of his employment. Lodging will be regarded as furnished to enable the employee properly to perform the duties of his employment when, for example, the lodging is furnished because the employee is required to be available for duty at all times or because the employee could not perform the services required of him unless he is furnished such lodging.


So it sounds like the requirement to work 24/7 resides in the agreement between the camper and the employer. The IRS regulation is written for the employer's benefit - not the campers, as the value of lodging is not deductible on the campers taxes.

So the OP should read his agreement and see if there is specific wording regarding on call. I'm not sure how as stated, there could be an exemption in (sic)liew of declared wages since the value of the site is not included in gross wages, and therefore cannot be deducted by the camper.

The statement that the IRS requires you to be on call 24/7 is kind of like that Indian guy that keeps calling me, telling me I'll be arrested because I owe taxes. I tell him to send the cops to arrest me, but they never come.
Experience without good judgment is worthless; good judgment without experience is still good judgment!

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Fulltimer50
Explorer
Explorer
If one reads the entire thread one can see that not everyone has the same point of view on this issue. For me, there is no problem anymore with this employer as I gave 3 weeks notice 3 weeks ago. As a result of opening this thread, I have been able to see other points of view better than before, and have learned a valuable lesson for the future.
George

2011 F350 PSD CC LB 4X4 DRW Lariate
2015 Mobile Suites 41RSSB4 5th Wheel

fulltimedaniel
Explorer
Explorer
This is curious. If someone has been working most of their lives and dealt with a variety of bosses and workplace situations how could they not know the answer to this issue for themselves?

I sympathize with their plight but only up to the point where they refuse to act.

A diplomatic statement posed as a question to the supervisor should right this.

There are many different good ways to handle this but all require a face to face meeting. Not passive aggressive behaviour like turning your phone off.

Sit down with the other party get the rules set about when to call you and that will be that. Do it civilly and with good humour. Leave with a smile a handshake and a Thanks for your time.

End of the problem.

aguablanco
Explorer
Explorer
SDcampowneroperator wrote:
IRS regulations requre that a workcamper accept employer provided accommodation, be on call 24 hours a day to quailify for exemption in liew of declared wages and accomodation charge.
Look it up.


Since I found your statement to be amazing, at the very least, I have followed this thread with the hope you would post that "IRS Regulation." Not having done so I am compelled to believe that it is a regulation that has been manufactured to justify the abuse of workcampers and their time. Please prove me wrong and post the regulation here as soon as possible.
RichH
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Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

DianneOK
Explorer
Explorer
We workcamped for nearly 9 years. We always answered the phone. That does not mean we always worked overtime or even said yes. We had no problem saying no.....
Dianne (and Terry) (Fulltimed for 9 years)
Donnelly, ID
HAM WB6N (Terry)
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2009 Lance 971 Truck Camper, loaded


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Fulltimer50
Explorer
Explorer
doxiemom11 wrote:
So, the employer cannot call you when another employee has just been hurt and they need someone right now to cover the office while they get the employee to a ER for medical assistance, perhaps a single with no one else? They cannot call you for help because they are having a heart attack and no one else is around? I have received these kind of calls so will always answer the phone when an employer calls, day off or not.


Thank you for your point of view. I am sure that there are endless examples of why a person could answer the phone.
George

2011 F350 PSD CC LB 4X4 DRW Lariate
2015 Mobile Suites 41RSSB4 5th Wheel

doxiemom11
Explorer II
Explorer II
So, the employer cannot call you when another employee has just been hurt and they need someone right now to cover the office while they get the employee to a ER for medical assistance, perhaps a single with no one else? They cannot call you for help because they are having a heart attack and no one else is around? I have received these kind of calls so will always answer the phone when an employer calls, day off or not.

Fulltimer50
Explorer
Explorer
We fully intend to be sure this kind of situation does not happen again. We dont want to be friends with the owner and we dont want any calls. I have worked many places where the manager doesnt want to be disturbed when off duty either. Not a new idea I guess. ๐Ÿ™‚
George

2011 F350 PSD CC LB 4X4 DRW Lariate
2015 Mobile Suites 41RSSB4 5th Wheel

Akwoofer
Explorer
Explorer
Everyone's expectations are different, talk to the park owner and let them know that just a couple of times a day is ok, or just real emergencies. Is everyone's lives so important they cannot spend 5 or 10 minutes a day, more than that I believe might be a little much. I mean we are retired right? Our case has always been friends with the owners and has not been a problem, but set guidelines early before it does. Communication is always the best solution

Irover
Explorer
Explorer
dewey02 wrote:
I find it funny how people treat a ringing telephone as the #1 priority.
I have had interesting reactions when I was at work at my desk and discussing something work-related to someone that is standing right in front of me. The phone rings and they stop what we were talking about and say "aren't you going to answer that?"

My response is: "I am talking with you. You were here first and you have priority. What we are talking about is important. Why should I interrupt you for a simple phone call. Whatever it is, important or not, they can leave a message."

I think it is the same in the OP's situation. Simply do not answer the phone, if it rings and you are beyond you normal work time. They can leave a message. If you are that curious, listen to the voicemail and if it is urgent or an emergency, then you can call back if you want to.


This Is The Best Answer so far!

dewey02
Explorer II
Explorer II
I find it funny how people treat a ringing telephone as the #1 priority.
I have had interesting reactions when I was at work at my desk and discussing something work-related to someone that is standing right in front of me. The phone rings and they stop what we were talking about and say "aren't you going to answer that?"

My response is: "I am talking with you. You were here first and you have priority. What we are talking about is important. Why should I interrupt you for a simple phone call. Whatever it is, important or not, they can leave a message."

I think it is the same in the OP's situation. Simply do not answer the phone, if it rings and you are beyond you normal work time. They can leave a message. If you are that curious, listen to the voicemail and if it is urgent or an emergency, then you can call back if you want to.

Fulltimer50
Explorer
Explorer
Cant help but wonder if this post might have gotten overlooked.
George

2011 F350 PSD CC LB 4X4 DRW Lariate
2015 Mobile Suites 41RSSB4 5th Wheel