Optima Batteries - Yellow or Blue

[qtla9111]

My deep cycle 6V batteries have served me well for over eight years but it appears it's time for a replacement.

I would like to get them off of the hitch and use sealed batteries somewhere inside the trailer.

After watching the Optima video, I'm still a bit confused over which is the best application; the yellow or the blue?

Any other brand you might recommend as well?

Thanks in advance.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

Don't take offense at this it is not meant to be smart aleck.

When criminal gangs started erecting communications towers, solar panels and batteries were literally sucked into Mexico. There are still some places that outfit rural ranchitos with basic lights well pumps, etc. I imagine a vast majority of batteries for these systems are LTH wet batteries but you never know. In the states sears featured Odyssey batteries as it's top of the line. But like Costco things may be mighty different.

If you decide to drive and haul batteries take a small pocket digital voltmeter. You need to cherry-pick which batteries are best. In southeast Texas heat any Lifeline with a voltage of 12.8 or higher is great -- other brands 12.70 or higher. You'll need to do a top charge on them once you get home. I sure would look at reinforcing across your floor if the new battery area is thinner than the occupancy area.

IMHO sealed glass mat batteries are worth it simply to get rid of the antimony. A little discussed area is the amount of kWh needed to float the batteries. About 1/5th that of golf car batteries.

[qtla9111]

wa8yxm wrote:
All maintenance free batteries are sealed so don't give me "The only sealed brand" The full name by the way both for liquid filled and AGM Sealed batteries (And a couple others) is "Valve Regulated Sealed Lead Acid" since there is a valve they CAN outgas (just not much) and that is why Maintenance free have a "This side up" where as AGM's do not.

I might add though we spoke of LIFELINE Agm... East Pen (MK and DEKA) and otehrs also sell AGM's. Even Sears sells AGM's but I'm not sure which line.

It didn't take long for someone to ruin my thread. I live in Mexico in a rural community. I went to a Battery Master and a CostCo in the city. That's what they had and I based my knowledge on that.

I came to RV.Net to get more information, which I have done and found it very useful. So your "so don't give me "The only sealed brand" was a bit out of line and I found it offensive.

I appreciate all the comments but please don't assume what you think you know about me. Remember that I said, "that I have seen".

I accept your apology in advance.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

Shows how special the lifeline really is. This is like comparing a Ford Focus to a Bentley.

Reminds me of the time a machinist friend tried to back out a Phillips flathead screw. Screw? yeah..

I took my Wiha impact Phillips tip fitted to an impact driver and whacked it several times. Backed it right out. He grabbed the tool out of my hands and looked at the perfect flutes on the Wiha.

Value has nothing to do with price it has to do with itself. Warehouse batteries are a crummy value. It's tough to find a good value in Trojan because Trojan is overly proud of their product.

A foolish person wastes time, effort in money trying to save a few dollars. That seventy nine dollar lifetime alternator can easily cost three hundred dollars when lengthy trips are needed to change it in snowstorms, Death Valley Days, in the middle of a giant metropolis.

Drive that 22 miles to save ten cents per gallon on gasoline.

Sheesh. What economics class?

[landyacht318]

Odyssey AGM proudly tout their thin plate pure lead batteries.

'Thin plate' and 'Deep cycle' are usually not associated together.

Northstar AGMs also advertise TPPL construction, and the battery specs for equal group size batteries are basically the same as Odyssey. AH CCA weight, almost identical.

I have been getting very good service from my group27 Northstar AGM. NS AGMS are relabelled and sold by Batteries + as X2power, and batteries plus adds another year to the free replacement 4 year warranty

My NS AGM-27 has over 800 deep cycles on it and at least a hundred of those are to well below 50% SOC and it will turn 5 years old in November. I'd gladly get another if it failed tomorrow, but it will not.

The trick it to fully charge it regularly, often, and high amp recharge it occassionally from a well depleted state.

Last week it easily started my 318 engine, depleted 72 of its advertised 90Ah capacity, and 97 alternator amps were not able to instantly bring it upto absorption voltage. 12 miles later it was still accepting 83 amps at 14.5v. At this many cycles the time it takes for amps to taper to 0.5% of capacity at 14.7v is quite long though. I'd not get this battery for deep cycling, unless I could high amp recharge it, and that opinion goes for any AGM.

I'd never buy or recommend Optima AGMs, but for starting batteries in jetskis or the like that are subjected to extreme physical stresses, although some that were purchased early 2000's that my friend owned, gave spectacular longevity despite some incredible mistreatment. They had developed a good reputation when they were USA made, and then cut all corners possible and cashed in on that reputation, and now count on marketing and remnants of that reputation.

I'm glad to hear the Vmaxtanks AGMS are performing well, but it would be nice to know how many cycles have accumulated since their purchase and their average depth of discharge.

So many people brag about how many years they get out of a battery, without indicating how many cycles the batteries have endured and the average depth of those cycles, which makes reports of that longevity pretty much useless to prospective buyers.

Seems many people search out and buy the cheapest they can then try as hard as they can to prove it is just as good as more expensive options, and I am not only talking batteries here.

[MEXICOWANDERER]

This is Mexico not Houston Dallas Fort Worth San Diego or Fumbuck Michigan.

Anything brought across the line loses it's warranty protection and that is why I choose Lifeline AGM and Rolls wet batteries. If it works well it does not need be worried to death about warranties. I would be more concerned with panels and controllers. I brought (thirty grand) worth of batteries down here 23 years ago. I realized going in that I would be bareeassed on my own.
Very much like Michelin Tires. Costco. Absolutely no road hazard nor tread life warranty even purchased through a Costco store down here.

Battery warranty down here is screwy. LTH, Gohner, whatever. Have a problem? Take it back to the store you bought it from for warranty. Just -try- to warranty it at a different same brand store. Perhaps Wal-Mart and Costco battery warranty is treated differently now. But they are Mexican batteries.

I label spiral cell batteries "Gizmo Batteries". They do one thing reasonably well --- survive the rigors of terraceria (washboard) gravel roads. If my shock absorbers kept breaking off and windshield regularly cracked I would consider optima over flooded.

Mr QTLA has another issue quite apart
Facturization.
Importing the batteries legally. His choice to declare and pay IVA the national sales tax.

And getting the FOB as near the Texas/Reynosa Mexico border as possible. The USA side isn't exactly AGM city. I helped a friend purchase four 8-D Lifelines near Sugarland, just south of Houston in 2005.

IMHO his position is daunting when it comes to choice and availability. I am biased somewhat against spiral cell batteries. In 2008 it took a forty five dollar telephone call to Colorado to slowly break down barriers accessing hurdle after hurdle of of educated sales staff to talk to a genuine engineer. The Herb Tarlek crowd at Optima was insisting that the Optima COULD NOT POSSIBLY LOSE CAPACITY. Idiot arguments against touching the royal Optima charge algorithm. Finally I reached a genuine engineer. 2-minutes of explaining and he agreed 100% with my protocols of recovery. Nice guy. After he hung up I listened to another half dozen extensions hang up. Customer turned to me and said "Nice Job" It was an eighteen hundred dollar cruising sailbost refit. But the upriver battle with the idiots was not impressive.

There seems to be little experience on this forum with other than low priced versus flagship top quality batteries. Next in line to the Lifeline I rank Odyssey batteries. They are not cheap and they have an excellent reputation.

So for the OP's best choice he faces a situation I do not envy. A much easier to get spiral cell battery or migrate north of the Rio Bravo to obtain a vastly more durable and longer lived AGM brand. Then render warranty service untenable. And that brings the all-or-nothing attempt to get warranty-free batteries.

Whistling the "Oooooo but I saved 70%" tune at the city dump does little to assuage wearing a dunce hat in economics.

Some top quality long lasting items are not available down here except perhaps in Mexico City. Then they are priced near 200%, wealthy Mexicans can afford them. I cannot afford a 1,600 mile drive to pay double for stuff.

I'll never forget John Booth (Senior Costco management) giving his opinion about Optima batteries (thumb's down) "Ridiculous warranty returns". A repeat of Delco Voyager disaster.

[time2roll]

ALL yellow top Optima are deep cycle. Blue can be either deep cycle or starting. Red is always a starting battery.

What you want is the light grey case for deep cycle. Dark grey is for starting.

If choosing Optima I recommend the D31T (yellow). And like said above I recommend Lifeline over Optima. I have used both.

[dougrainer]

1. YES, you have to CHANGE the charging profile for Lifeline AGM Batteries. On Magnum chargers there is actually a separate setting JUST for Lifeline batteries (AGM-1). ALL other AGM's on Magnum chargers use AGM-2
2. AGM's have a different Charge profile. You need to research the type Converter or Inverter/Charger you have to see if it is compatible with AGM batteries.
3. While Lifeline batteries are very good, their warranty in nonexistent. They have a catch 22 on their warranty. They warranty their batteries for 5 years. GOOD. BUT, If the battery fails it is because of external source problems. Went dead and stayed dead too long. Charging system failed to keep battery charge, etc. So, in 5 years of dealing with Lifeline, they have NEVER warrantied their batteries. That said, they ARE CORRECT in their process. AGM batteries are very good, but they are not a cure all for neglect. Neglect an AGM battery bank and it will fail. You don't get the do over like some Lead cell Deep Cycle battery companies. They will freeze if dead.
4. RESEARCH who sells and warranties Lifeline batteries. They have very few dealers. In DFW Texas the closest dealer is 250 miles away and the batteries have to be shipped to us, or we go thru the main center in the LA area of California. Not good if you do have a failure and you are lucky enough to find someone that will warranty the Lifelines.
5. I would go with Interstate AGM batteries as Interstate does not give a hassle for warranty. There are thousands of Interstate battery centers all over the USA. Doug

[NRALIFR]

I’ve been quite pleased with the VMAX Tanks brand of AGM battery. I’ve had a group 31 SLR125 in my camper for about three years. It’s one of the heaviest group 31 batteries I’ve encountered. 77 pounds.

:):)

[wa8yxm]

All maintenance free batteries are sealed so don't give me "The only sealed brand" The full name by the way both for liquid filled and AGM Sealed batteries (And a couple others) is "Valve Regulated Sealed Lead Acid" since there is a valve they CAN outgas (just not much) and that is why Maintenance free have a "This side up" where as AGM's do not.

I might add though we spoke of LIFELINE Agm... East Pen (MK and DEKA) and otehrs also sell AGM's. Even Sears sells AGM's but I'm not sure which line.

[qtla9111]

Sorry for not responding but I've been working out of town.

I have a 235W solar panel, a 30 amp MTTP charge controller, and a Xantrax 600W inverter.

Why did I consider Optima? They were the only brand I have seen that were sealed batteries. People make a big deal about gassing off and I want to make sure that if I move them inside that we don't have any issues.

I am open to advice and I will begin to analyze the information that people are posting.

So that brings me to another question. We use radiant heat. The Suburban furnace is located under the fridge next to the converter. I would like to take out the furnace, since it isn't used, and use the space to put the batteries. Any issues being under the LP fridge and next to the converter?

Truly appreciated as I want to keep my unit for at least 10 more years.

[wa8yxm]

Ok, here are a few numbers. From a battery manufacturer site or two.

Lifeline GPL-27T c/20 capacity 100 amp hours.
31's were 105 to 125 Amp hours (Different models of the 31)

Optima blue top D-27-M C/20 capacity 66 Amp Hours or 2/3 of the Lifeline (I did say 50% more power in a lifeline)

The Group 31 is 75 amp hours. or about the same percentage

SO TWO Lifeline XX's in parallel are like 3 OPtima's of the same size class.

WHY BUY OPTIMA??? Why even consider them? And they cost more..

O

[wolfe10]

Wet cell and AGM's are very close in charging protocol.

But, don't know what converter, charger or inverter charger Chris has. So don't know if it is or could be converted to a "smart one" or not.

[ScottG]

Would the OP need a different charging profile if he went to AGM's?

[toedtoes]

IF you go with the Optima, go with the blue top.

I have a group 31 blue top and have been very happy with it - but my power usage is minimal. I can go 10 days and not have put a dent in the Optima.

My usage consists of one or two fluorescent lights for an hour or so each night, water pump on 24-7 with frequent use, and charging phone and tablet daily. No inverter, no pull from the fridge, no other electric devices.