1991 Ford IDI engines/trucks for towing

[ognend]

I have an opportunity to get a 1991 F-350 SRW IDI truck, it is in good shape and I have some extra money to spend on fixing it up.

How are these for towing? I own a 2016 F-250 6.7L Ford and I already know that it will be night and day. However, I am the kind of person that does not fly when towing since I tow horses - when I am in that mode, I never go over 65mph- getting somewhere in a hurry is just not on my agenda, so long as I get there at some point and in one piece.

I know the old trucks are loud, the exhaust smells - but overall - can a truck like a 4x4 F-350 with an IDI engine from 1991 tow a, let's say 12,000 lbs gooseneck horse trailer that weighs 2500 or 3,000 lbs on the hitch?

I am not considering this truck for a primary tower, just a backup right now at least.

Thanks!

[blt2ski]

In the scheme of things, pricing for an older MDT will be on par with a pickup. A 90s Navistar/international 4700 should be less than $10k. The 4600 model has the IDI 7.3 in it. If you can find one with the spicer 7 sp manual, would be best trans behind that motor.

Marty

[rjstractor]

ognend wrote:
Interesting. I wonder what price range these are in. Also, does having one and hauling with it change the drivers license / DOT etc. requirements (as opposed to just having a basic pickup).

Depending on what you are using the truck for, you might qualify for a farm/agriculture exemption from some CDL and DOT rules. Otherwise you're looking at a class A CDL if your combined weight rating exceeds 26K and your trailer GVWR exceeds 10K. Your state's DOT website should have the details.

[mkirsch]

<26,001 GVWR and hydraulic brakes, the driver's license requirements are the same as a pickup unless you are engaging in commercial activity.

[ognend]

JRscooby wrote:

ognend wrote:

JRscooby wrote:

OP, why are you so in love with a pickup? For the money you are talking a older class 6-7 pull your load, and any repairs would need done once, then never wear out again.

Hello! I am not sure I speak the language 🙂 - what is an older class 6-7?

Say a F-750 Ford. International makes medium duty trucks by millions. Freightliner, Mack, Pete are also players on the board.

Interesting. I wonder what price range these are in. Also, does having one and hauling with it change the drivers license / DOT etc. requirements (as opposed to just having a basic pickup).

[JRscooby]

ognend wrote:

JRscooby wrote:

OP, why are you so in love with a pickup? For the money you are talking a older class 6-7 pull your load, and any repairs would need done once, then never wear out again.

Hello! I am not sure I speak the language 🙂 - what is an older class 6-7?

Say a F-750 Ford. International makes medium duty trucks by millions. Freightliner, Mack, Pete are also players on the board.

[ognend]

JRscooby wrote:

OP, why are you so in love with a pickup? For the money you are talking a older class 6-7 pull your load, and any repairs would need done once, then never wear out again.

Hello! I am not sure I speak the language 🙂 - what is an older class 6-7?

[JRscooby]

Grit dog wrote:

Groover wrote:
I had a 1991 with the 7.5 gasser. As I recall the diesel was only rated for 14,000lbs GCWR. Since the truck that you are talking about weighs over 6,000lbs its trailer tow rating is less than 8,000lbs. Having said that, I have seen people pull much much more than that and get away with it. The other other question is How much do you want to pull up a hill with only 150hp? I remember driving a friends F350 1992 diesel and it didn't have much get up and go without a trailer.

Yeah, you hook 12klbs to it and try to pull a hill, you may need to chalk the tires or paint some lines across the road to actually see it moving!

Back in the day, when I would pull out of the quarry grossing near 110,000 with 427 GMC, it was said needed to drive a stake in the ground to see me moving up the hill, but when started down, it took a running automobile to get around me. (Once went past a bear at the bottom. In the mirror could see him, looking at me, then his hat, deciding which to chase first. He caught both)
OP, why are you so in love with a pickup? For the money you are talking a older class 6-7 pull your load, and any repairs would need done once, then never wear out again.

[blt2ski]

Fish,

Nice touche on Grit.....

For OPs use frankly. The IDI 7.3 us as noted by many for freeway work. BUT like myself, I doubt the OP is going to be pulling the loads he's talking about down the freeway. Speeds are slow ie under 10-15 mph pulling tailer out of the field. Very little to no additional air cooking due to speed. A lot of sailboats, off road heavy equipment, using a turbo is a disadvantage vs a non turbo with equal power specs.
I'm wondering if putting yes a rebuilt motor, it better yet, a T444e block with the mechanical injection pump turned up, open up if possible air intake, this should net this motor from 185/385ish another 20-30 hp, I'll swag upwards of 50-75 lb ft of torque. Depending on trans, dumping 433 or 488s I'm pumpkins, yes lose freeway ability. Or leave as us with probably 4.10s. know he will use 4lo getting out of fields in softer spongy soils etc.
This latter option maybe the best better option. I'm doing a too bad there is not a non turbo option for current models for this use. With lower gears in axles. Or a detuned 300/600 lower psi turbo option. The one size fits all that manufactures are going with today, does not work for everyone.
My 02
Just docking to start driving again

Marty

[FishOnOne]

Grit dog wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

LOL... Says the guy who recently purchased a 1980's Chevy truck.

JMO... JK

Hahaha, touche!
I was waiting for someone to say that!
I have towed the boat with it a couple times last summer. Now it's in 1000 pieces in the shop, almost ready for paint.

Looking forward to the pics when its all done. I'm sure it's a fun project for you and your son.

[Grit_dog]

FishOnOne wrote:

LOL... Says the guy who recently purchased a 1980's Chevy truck.

JMO... JK

Hahaha, touche!
I was waiting for someone to say that!
I have towed the boat with it a couple times last summer. Now it's in 1000 pieces in the shop, almost ready for paint.

[Grit_dog]

ognend, more power to ya! Sounds like you're living right!
I hear ya on new vehicle issues. Some have problems, some don't. I'm not even a Ford guy and I'll spare the joking around and just say you got one that has problems. Which really stinks when one thinks about the sunk costs vs residual value for effectively very little use.

My suggestions if you want the challenge or peace of mind, however you look at it, for an older truck still stand. If you're going to do it, at least get something that is as capable as it can be.

And I aspire to do something similar if time, God and finances afford when I get older. You're healthier for it, for sure and it's just an awesome thing to do.

[valhalla360]

Grit dog wrote:

valhalla360 wrote:


At that point, would you be better off getting something significantly newer. The only complication being are you dead set on Ford, I would be a little hesitant of the 6.0 but really a 15yr old 6.0 has likely been bullet proofed or never exhibited the problems. The incurable ones are likely in a junk yard by now.

But the OP has stated he doesn't want the complication of high pressure injection motors.
Good suggestion and I'd run a bulletproofed 6.0 all day, but it would have to come at a serious discount to a Cummins or Duramax of same era.

I'd take a 7.3 again but it would be one with a turbo from the factory.

Yeah, I'd probably take a 6.0 but as you say, it would need a discount and receipts for the bullet proofing work.

[valhalla360]

Grit dog wrote:

Groover wrote:
I had a 1991 with the 7.5 gasser. As I recall the diesel was only rated for 14,000lbs GCWR. Since the truck that you are talking about weighs over 6,000lbs its trailer tow rating is less than 8,000lbs. Having said that, I have seen people pull much much more than that and get away with it. The other other question is How much do you want to pull up a hill with only 150hp? I remember driving a friends F350 1992 diesel and it didn't have much get up and go without a trailer.

Yeah, you hook 12klbs to it and try to pull a hill, you may need to chalk the tires or paint some lines across the road to actually see it moving!

I recall coming EB over the pass into Denver on I-70.

Maxed out at 45mph black smoke boiling out the tailpipe.

Oh, this wasn't towing. It was me the wife and a couple of suitcases in the truck bed.

I never worried that I would make it to the top of a hill while towing but it might take a long time to get there.

[ognend]

Grit dog wrote:

ognend wrote:
From what I can tell, you can also put an aftermarket turbo on these. Not sure if you gain a lot from doing so, but there is that too...

Thank you everyone for sharing your experiences/knowledge. I think I am going to go and take a look/test drive.

It could be a good reliable work truck, but you keep throwing in the heavy towing duty that you want to accomplish with the truck and this isn't the truck to do that unless you like going REAL slow...especially now that you're hauling in the pseudo mountains and not board flat sea level.

If you want 1980s performance, it may be your truck. If you actually want to get somewhere, it is not.
1. I don't recall auto or manual. undocumented 30 year old auto = potential $$ and it is not a good choice for towing with an underpowered old low rpm diesel.
2. Now you're talking about pressing an OLD truck into heavy service (you don't like the 6.7 issues, want some old iron to replace it with etc etc)
3. You mention learning how to turn a wrench with this truck. Great idea and goal. Not a great idea to learn on the side of the highway pulling a grade with your horses in the Blueridge mtns.

If you actually want a capable/reliable, simple tow pig and are set on going backwards 20-30 years in technology to circumvent the "issues" with new trucks (why folks always think the grass used to be greener is beyond me, but, whatever floats your boat), then find you a 2nd Gen Dodge. 12V or 24V manual trans. Pay a few bucks extra to get a nice one with decent miles and well maintained.
Then it's an easy job to get 21st century power and relatively good drive train (NV4500 or NV5600) in a simple, easy to understand and repair type of truck.

Or step up to a mid 90s Power stroke, manual trans. Same deal and they will fetch a premium for the same reasons as the Dodge.
Any pre turbo Corn-binders (Ford/IH) or 6.5 Detroits (GM) are not worth it for real work duty.

JMO

Thank you, this is a fair opinion.

10 years ago I used to buy honey. Now I keep bees.
13 years ago I have never seen a horse, now I ride them and work with them.
10 years ago I used to buy "food" at the store, now I own a farm.
So on and so on (I guess I am trying to say that I can learn haha).

Here is my problem. I spent $57,000 on a brand new 2016 Ford plus $2,500 extended Ford bumper-bumper warranty to 75,000 miles (which is coming up for either renewal, losing weight or getting rid of it).

I bought the truck brand new. At 4,000 miles it had the emissions TSB 16-0041 - three days of work, pulling cab of, valve work etc. At 15,000 miles a new water pump. At 18,000 miles the back seat open/close rusted off. At 30,000 miles sensor left lean bank issue (needed reprogramming). At 40,000 miles slow coolant leak that nobody can find and I am now at 52,000 miles, wondering what will come next in terms of repairs.

I lost trust in the "Super Duty" thing and the new stuff, sorry, super duty my arse. I don't understand how it works, without a warranty - every repair is an arm and a leg and even with an extra warranty - sometimes they can't even find the problem (like my phantom coolant leak) so I am now left to run around and look for someone interested in spending the hours to find the leak (which they don't seem to be).

So, I have some choices to make:

1) spend more more on more warranty + spend more of my time running around different dealers and shops and hope someone finds the problem (and my time is worth something too, ya know)

2) or I could delete it (assuming I fix the leak problem), which is illegal, but people advise it as the holy grail that will fix everything in the long run, which I doubt, but I still have to spend >$2K on doing so and I will still not understand anything about this truck and the delete will void any warranty anyway so every new repair is out of pocket and they ain't cheap on these

3) sell the truck (I own it outright) and write another check to buy another new, shiny thing and take another chance on a new diesel or a new gasser or

4) go back in time and learn how to fix the darn things myself and own something I understand and can work on all day long, plus selling my 6.7L for $42-43,000 it is worth now, I think I can go out and get a nice, old truck in good shape and still have money left over to change the engine and transmission 4x over. (At this point, I feel like Ford has extracted enough money out of me. I have no guarantee that a new Ford, or for that matter a new RAM or a new Duramax will do me any better.)

No, this new mythical truck that will solve all my problems doesn't have to be too old - like the IDI I am looking at, of course - which is where I appreciate your advice! 🙂