2104 Keystone Terrain 250TRS

[Gaffer222]

Looked at this unit Keystone Outback Terrain today at Flagg RV in Uxbridge MA. Until this rear bed slide unit we have been looking at queen bed/ bunks and dinette slide units under 28' We also looked at the North Trail 240BHS today.

Overall the family and I like the Terrain best from all the units we have looked at so far. The wife really likes it and said she was good with buying this model if it's what I want. Interior roominess and storage is better than anything in this length camper we have seen. Having the queen bed and dinette slides really opens up the floor space.

My concerns are:

- Very limited outside storage and that alone may be a deal killer. Not sure where we put all the outside stuff? Only outside storage is in the back behind the spare tire and it's not very deep. Anyone have any ideas how to get past this issue please respond.

- There is no outside vent for the stove hood, only a charcoal filter. This is strange to me as we use our stove vent all the time. There is a roof vent in the kitchen area and maybe adding a fan in the vent will work?

- Construction quality compared to the North Trail was lacking in areas. The sidewalls, ceiling etc are rock solid in the North Trail but the Terrain has a bunch of flex and vibration when I bang on it. Seems like Keystone cut some corners since they separated these units from the Outback lineup.

- DD #1 does not like the fact there is no window in the bottom bunk. The bike door is there but no window. I believe(not sure)The Outback version had a window in the bike door. Top bunk has a window.

- Dump drain/valves are up near the front so we would be using 20' or more of hose at most sites.

- You can tell this particular unit was towed in the winter salt as there is a ton of rust and corrosion on the under carriage, suspension etc. Need to avoid a unit with this issue if possible!!!!!

Please respond with opinions or suggestions.

[Gaffer222]

I have local dealer working up a price to place an order for the Outback Terrain 250TRS. Anyone have opinions on a price to try and negotiate to?

[Gaffer222]

Cotay wrote:
With our Terrain 250TRS we were initially worried about the limited outside storage as well. What I can confirm is that the amount of interior storage on the 250TRS more than made up for it. We were overloaded in our old HTT, but now we can't find enough stuff to fill up our cabinets. This thing has more cabinet storage than almost any other TT in its size t we saw. I do wish that Keystone had put interior doors on the dinette seats and also added a outside door to get under the dinette as well (I've seen this on a few others...I think Passport and a KZ). Our plan for storage if it becomes an issue is to use storage totes for those items we will always take outside and stack the totes in the back of the Expedition or outside when not in use. That so far hasn't been necessary, but I don't mind putting our chairs on the floor in the bunk area during transport.

The lack of a window in the bottom bunk is a blessing for us...our three year old sleeps there and we can "wall him off" so he doesn't wake at 5am every day. Personally I wouldn't mind sleeping there myself since I prefer the dark while I'm napping. 🙂

The drain location is perfectly fine for us. I have an Rhino hose extension that I would add if necessary.

To be honest, I didn't realize the stove doesn't actually vent outside until you pointed it out. That is a testimony to it not really being a problem. A fan in the ceiling vent is a good idea. My wife burnt some bagels last weekend and we had to open the doors.

Overall, the construction is good. The unit however is built to reduce weight...the front end cap to me is not a big deal and I actually chose the 250TRS over a 250RS because I didn't want the added weight. It also gets in the way of changing out the batteries. To me the caps are simply not necessary and artificially inflate the tongue weight. The overall construction of the outer shell is the same as the regular outback...the interior has slightly downgraded cabinets, but the quality is indeed better than most I've seen. My biggest issue was that whoever installed our doors must have been drunk since he installed the door jam upside down and then apparently forgot how to install the screen latch catches. Five minutes of adjustment and that was fixed however.

We are extremely happy with our 250TRS. If the quality worries you at all, find a regular Outback 250RS. I think you'll be happy with either however.

I think we are going to pull the trigger and try it out the way it is. We did a ton of research and looked at bunch of TT's <28' and this one looks fit our wants and needs the best so far. If I find I need more outside storage I can do the mods. The wife and I discussed the same thing last night about the interior and exterior doors on the dinette as it is a pain to remove all the cushions etc to get in there every time. I have to look but I think it's doable to add some interior doors and maybe drawers to dinette.

[Gaffer222]

W.E.BGood wrote:
gaffer...that looks and is equipped exactly like our 250RS. Don't forget, you also have an outside-accessible storage area at the rear, under the slide and above the bumper...it's just a pain to have to drop the spare tire on its post-mount to get into it, or to get to it when the slide's out.
And, I still wouldn't take a salty dog.

I never considered purchasing this particular unit due to the salt damage. It was really bad from what I could see and who knows what is affected that I can't see. Also the wife does not like the vinyl/leather couch material. We need to find a non "SALTY DOG" unit with different decor or order one.

Can anyone comment on what a fair price is? and what should I add on besides a slide topper and fan in kitchen vent. I'm assuming a slide topper will not work on the rear bed slide?

[Cotay]

With our Terrain 250TRS we were initially worried about the limited outside storage as well. What I can confirm is that the amount of interior storage on the 250TRS more than made up for it. We were overloaded in our old HTT, but now we can't find enough stuff to fill up our cabinets. This thing has more cabinet storage than almost any other TT in its size t we saw. I do wish that Keystone had put interior doors on the dinette seats and also added a outside door to get under the dinette as well (I've seen this on a few others...I think Passport and a KZ). Our plan for storage if it becomes an issue is to use storage totes for those items we will always take outside and stack the totes in the back of the Expedition or outside when not in use. That so far hasn't been necessary, but I don't mind putting our chairs on the floor in the bunk area during transport.

The lack of a window in the bottom bunk is a blessing for us...our three year old sleeps there and we can "wall him off" so he doesn't wake at 5am every day. Personally I wouldn't mind sleeping there myself since I prefer the dark while I'm napping. 🙂

The drain location is perfectly fine for us. I have an Rhino hose extension that I would add if necessary.

To be honest, I didn't realize the stove doesn't actually vent outside until you pointed it out. That is a testimony to it not really being a problem. A fan in the ceiling vent is a good idea. My wife burnt some bagels last weekend and we had to open the doors.

Overall, the construction is good. The unit however is built to reduce weight...the front end cap to me is not a big deal and I actually chose the 250TRS over a 250RS because I didn't want the added weight. It also gets in the way of changing out the batteries. To me the caps are simply not necessary and artificially inflate the tongue weight. The overall construction of the outer shell is the same as the regular outback...the interior has slightly downgraded cabinets, but the quality is indeed better than most I've seen. My biggest issue was that whoever installed our doors must have been drunk since he installed the door jam upside down and then apparently forgot how to install the screen latch catches. Five minutes of adjustment and that was fixed however.

We are extremely happy with our 250TRS. If the quality worries you at all, find a regular Outback 250RS. I think you'll be happy with either however.

[W_E_BGood]

gaffer...that looks and is equipped exactly like our 250RS. Don't forget, you also have an outside-accessible storage area at the rear, under the slide and above the bumper...it's just a pain to have to drop the spare tire on its post-mount to get into it, or to get to it when the slide's out.
And, I still wouldn't take a salty dog.

[Gaffer222]

OK so I may have figured out a way to solve the limited outside storage issues. Hit me with any issue you see with this solution.

Since I posted I did realize I forgot there is a very small(maybe 2.5 to 3') outside storage at the front. Access door is forward of the first entry door. This is under the bunk wardrobe and is maybe 1.5' deep. Not much room in there. The bunk door opens up on the other side of the TT. You can swing the bottom bunk up and store bikes or whatever. This area is open to the inside of the TT. We were planning on using this for bikes while in transit. If we did not use it for bikes, we could partition the bottom of the lower bunk and that would solve the storage issue. We could even open up the wardrobe wall and make it a pass through. The bunk would still swing up and allow access to this new pass through from the inside if needed. All of this mod could easily be reversed if needed for resale etc. Maybe we could put a bike rack over the A frame and storage problem solved?

Here is a picture of the wardrobe, the lower section is where the outside storage is. You can also see under the bunk open to the TT. Second pic is with the bunk up and the bunk door from inside.

[W_E_BGood]

gaffer, the DW and I love our 2011 Keystone 250RS which has exactly the same floor plan as shown in your post. To address your concerns:

#1. Agreed, very little outside storage, but it works for us, and may very well not for your needs.

#2. Yes, Keystone and some other manufacturers went with a ventless system...not a good idea IMO. A fan in the ceiling hatch just above our kitchen area works.

#3. Can't testify to the construction, ours seems quality and solid BUT an interesting observation...our 250 is rated at 5,980 dry, this new one is 500 lbs. LESS...less what? Also, ours has a one-piece fiberglass front cap, MUCH preferred as I've read of many problems of leaky/delaminated front "wraps" like this one.

#4. No lower bunk window...yep, it's dark, stuffy and confined. I wouldn't like sleeping there either. Ours is used only as storage, so it doesn't matter to us.

#5. Dump valve location...not a problem, occasionally I have to use a second 10' section to make the 20', both carried in a plastic tube under the rear bumper.

#6. Towed in salt...would NOT even consider it! We towed ours 12 miles home from the dealer new in slushy/salty snow, it infiltrated one of the brake wiring connections causing a real headache with braking problems until we discovered it.

Considering what you've indicated, I'd pass on it. The design has to fit YOU.

[aamyotte]

I currently have a trailer similar to this without the dinette slide. It works well for us. Something to think of with the rear slide is that there is no wardrobe for the adults. We keep our suitcase under the lower bunk in the front and live out of that. For exterior storage we use the pack and play door and load our things under the bunk. It surprising how much space there is under there. If you fold up the lower bunk you can put bikes in there. I try to keep the bunk down so it's ready if we need to stop overnight, we don't have to take anything out to use the lower bunk.

[Bumpyroad]

n8wgb wrote:
the bicycle storage door and the lower bunk area could hold a lot of things too.

However, I have not made a trip with it yet, so maybe things will change... :S :B

but with two DDs would need both bunks.
bumpy

[n8wgb]

I just bought a 210TRS (last week). I had the same concerns about the storage. I plan to put a pipe under the bumper for the black hose. And then use the rest of the outside storage for power cords and leveling stuff. I have a fairly large area under the kitchenette seats that I can also use for things I would not be using a lot. And as mentioned, the bicycle storage door and the lower bunk area could hold a lot of things too.

However, I have not made a trip with it yet, so maybe things will change... :S :B

[Speedogomer]

I just purchased an Outback Terrain 260trs, so I can't comment specifically on the 250...I looked into one, but the 260 fit our needs better.

1. Outside storage is an issue on my unit as well, although I have a small pass thru storage in the front of my unit, the opening is small though so it won't fit much. With the bicycle storage on your unit however that opens up a huge area for storage while traveling. Another option is to install a rear bumper rack for coolers ect, or a roof mounted storage container for the tow vehicle. This was possibly the biggest downside of my unit as well.

2. The vent outside isn't a huge deal for me, as I do almost all my cooking outside. The charcoal filter will work fairly well, and as with your unit, mine also has an outside vent near the kitchen. I wouldn't worry too much myself.

3.I have no issues with the construction of my unit so far, but as with most ultra lites, there are some corners cut. I notice then on my unit as well, but overall I would rate the Terrains better than most other ultra Lite units I've been in.

4. The no window in the bunk, nothing you can do there unless you cut a hole in the door and put your own window in.

5. My dump is near the rear, but I think realistically every campsite is different and some will be better than others. Have an extension ready if need be.

Another unit we considered with a Passport 2400bh. With the optional upgraded exterior (Grey as opposed to white fiberglass) it was a great unit, but the Outback had so much more seating, and features it was no brainer for me. What really sold us was the uniqueness of the Outback Terrains. Every other unit we looked at has bunks in the rear, a dinette and couch in the slide, and a queen bed up front. Every. Single. One. Seeing something different was refreshing.

Another forum member "Cotay" (he has a 250trs) helped me decide on mine, and I hope I can do the same for you. Outbackers.com has some useful insight as well.

All your concerns are valid, but I think every TT is somewhat of a rolling compromise... All will have their pros and cons. For us, the Outback Terrain just had the most pros. If you do get it, I promise you'll be happy with one.

[GaryWT]

Looked at this unit awhile back, liked the beds but did not pass the bathroom test, it was too small for me once the door was closed. Dump values are bot a big deal, I use 20 feet at most sites sometimes 30 but you can park differently to deal with that. You can install a tube of those storage. Some outside things can be placed on the floor just inside the door so the come out first and go in last. Many Keystones don't vent outside not an issue for us as we cook outside. Good luck with whatever your choice is.