Adding air bags: can that increase payload capacity?

[DesertDogs]

Does adding airbags to a pickup truck tow vehicle increase the payload capacity of the truck?

For example, take a pickup with 3500 lbs. of payload capacity. If one were to add air bags to such a pickup, could that realistically increase the payload capacity from 3500 lbs. to 4000 lbs.?

Also, does adding airbags improve ride quality in the truck?

We're thinking of going with a 2019 3/4 ton RAM or 1 ton RAM as our every day driver and also as a tow vehicle for a fairly short 5th wheel.

I'm trying to decide which would be the best route to follow when buying a truck that will serve mostly as a daily driver, with occasional use to tow a 5th wheel.

3/4 ton with air bags added?
1 ton without air bags?
1 ton with air bags added?

Or....???

[FishOnOne]

I spend way more time in my truck than our camper, therefore my priority was picking a truck that met my needs as a first priority, and then picked a camper that complied to my trucks specs as a second priority.

[spoon059]

DesertDogs wrote:
Thus, we are now looking at another 5th wheel model, with a somewhat lighter estimated dry pin weight (2400 lbs) - which when reasonably loaded would bring the 5th wheel pin weight to around 3400 lbs.

With loaded 5th wheel at 3400 lbs pin weight, combined with the weight of hitch and occupants in the truck, one of those SRW 1-ton pickups will meet the need, and likely keep us a little bit under the payload limit of the pickup.

We want to avoid DRW and long bed. Our truck will serve as a daily driver far more than it will serve as a towing machine, so by considering a 5er with a lighter pin weight, we're trying to keep the truck more comfortable for our daily errands.

Great decision. You'll be far happier with a little leeway in your payload and a SRW truck. I'm hopeful to find a nicely appointed 4 season 5th wheel that is light enough to tow with a SRW 1 ton truck when its time for me to retire. I don't want the hassle of a DRW, nor a camper so big and heavy that a DRW is necessary.

Sounds like you've made a good decision, enjoy the new rig!

[Cummins12V98]

OP, thanks for not being an idiot!

[Me_Again]

DesertDogs wrote:

spoon, indeed, if the 5th wheel pin weight alone was 4000 lbs, we would have to have a duelly.

The Vilano 320, loaded, washer dryer & portable generator, would likely have a pin weight of around 3700 lbs. Added to weight of occupants and hitch - that would put us around 4300 lbs. payload requirement. Just a couple of hundred pounds too-much payload weight, for the 1-ton SRW truck we like.

Yes, there are a number of 1-ton pickups, SRW, with 4100 lbs payload capacity.

Thus, we are now looking at another 5th wheel model, with a somewhat lighter estimated dry pin weight (2400 lbs) - which when reasonably loaded would bring the 5th wheel pin weight to around 3400 lbs.

With loaded 5th wheel at 3400 lbs pin weight, combined with the weight of hitch and occupants in the truck, one of those SRW 1-ton pickups will meet the need, and likely keep us a little bit under the payload limit of the pickup.

We want to avoid DRW and long bed. Our truck will serve as a daily driver far more than it will serve as a towing machine, so by considering a 5er with a lighter pin weight, we're trying to keep the truck more comfortable for our daily errands.

Solitude 310GK 5th wheel floor plan is similar to our Bighorn 3575el, but a little smaller. It would have been of interest to us back in the spring of 2016 as it is the size we were aiming for, except for the fact that Grand Design does not include a rear cap.. Disclaimer to that statement is our Laredo also does not have one, as very few bumper pulls do.

[DesertDogs]

spoon059 wrote:
Seems to me that 4000 lbs pin weight would have me in a dually.

On the other hand, if you decide that a more comfortable daily driver is more important then you need to downsize the 5th wheel you're looking at.

Without researching every make/model/trim level, I would estimate that a reasonably equipped 1 ton SRW diesel truck will have about 4000 +/- payload. Subtract weight of hitch, passengers and any gear in the truck and you are probably around 3200-3500 lbs for actual hitch weight.

spoon, indeed, if the 5th wheel pin weight alone was 4000 lbs, we would have to have a duelly.

The Vilano 320, loaded, washer dryer & portable generator, would likely have a pin weight of around 3700 lbs. Added to weight of occupants and hitch - that would put us around 4300 lbs. payload requirement. Just a couple of hundred pounds too-much payload weight, for the 1-ton SRW truck we like.

Yes, there are a number of 1-ton pickups, SRW, with 4100 lbs payload capacity.

Thus, we are now looking at another 5th wheel model, with a somewhat lighter estimated dry pin weight (2400 lbs) - which when reasonably loaded would bring the 5th wheel pin weight to around 3400 lbs.

With loaded 5th wheel at 3400 lbs pin weight, combined with the weight of hitch and occupants in the truck, one of those SRW 1-ton pickups will meet the need, and likely keep us a little bit under the payload limit of the pickup.

We want to avoid DRW and long bed. Our truck will serve as a daily driver far more than it will serve as a towing machine, so by considering a 5er with a lighter pin weight, we're trying to keep the truck more comfortable for our daily errands.

[Grit_dog]

^ True, but heavy E load LT tires can be aired down to run soft with no load, just like any other E load tire. And a person could get a legitimate 8000lb rated cap out of LT tires with the right tires and rims.
IMO, if not going dually, the best/safest "compromise" if loading to the upper limits is bags, sway bar and a set of 19.5s you can throw on for RV trips.
Remember, cheap, fast or good, pick 2, at most.
Also know that tire and wheel ratings or truck class "rating" truly are the lowest common denominators in most srw scenarios.
Even comparing the "6000lb" payload stripped down reg cab gasser 1 tons to the 4000lb payload CC diesel. The difference in empty rear axle weight is about 1/2 the difference in payload rating. Why? The other 1000lbs is the additional weight on the front axle.

[spoon059]

DesertDogs wrote:
Will heavy duty tires close to 4000 lbs. each create a significantly worse ride for daily use?

I'm open to going with a 5th wheel which has lower pin weight - giving us a buffer zone of capacity, but we do really like that Vilano 320 which is the smallest 5th wheel VanLeigh makes.

Yes, heavier duty tires will ride more rough. That's the tradeoff of higher payload carrying capability. You ultimately need to decide what is more important to you and make the decision. If its more important to have a large 5th wheel, then get the right truck the first time. Seems to me that 4000lbs pin weight would have me in a dually.

On the other hand, if you decide that a more comfortable daily driver is more important then you need to downsize the 5th wheel you're looking at. Without researching every make/model/trim level, I would estimate that a reasonably equipped 1 ton SRW diesel truck will have about 4000 +/- payload. Subtract weight of hitch, passengers and any gear in the truck and you are probably around 3200-3500 lbs for actual hitch weight.

You can't have a super capable truck that also rides like a Cadillac and gets Prius like mileage. You have to accept trade offs and make decisions based upon what is most important. You are coming from Class A campers, which are designed to carry the weight they have. You will not be happy if you have too small a truck for your new camper, as you will either take a hit on trading in the too small truck or the too big camper. Do it right the first time, save yourself some time and money.

[Cummins12V98]

Me Again wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

spoon059 wrote:

romore wrote:
The door sticker remains the guide in the event of a police check or worse yet an accident.

Not true. The sticker remains the guide for warranty purposes only. The only thing that matters for a "police check" is your paid registration weight.

YEP. I am well north of 14k but licensed to tow what I do.

RV Weight Cops always have the scary notes about issues, yet hotshot haulers roll through the weigh stations across the country at weights that are way beyond RVers. How can that be? Oh wait, they are within the federal bridge weights and licensed for the correct amount!

At my RAW I still have a lot of tire capacity left.

[Huntindog]

There was a time when 3/4, 1 ton srw. and 1 ton drw shared most all of their components. It was easier for the manufacturer to build them when this was so. That mean't that it was pretty easy to do some swapping of parts to upgrade a truck to a higher capability model (the sticker of course never changes)
Nowadays with just in time supplies to the plant, this may not always be the case. With everything computerized, a part that may save the manufacturer 50 cents can easily be supplied just in time for that 3/4 ton in production vs. the 1 ton version . I think it can still be done, but one has to be more careful about it.
Even to the point of studying part numbers to see where they differ.

[JIMNLIN]

Me Again wrote:

JIMNLIN wrote:

Short bed trucks will have a bit more payload than a long bed when both have the same cab/engine/tranny/etc configurations.

The 2019 RAM towing chart I linked above does not support that statement.

Looking at mfg GVWR based payloads your probably right ...however if you had read the rest of my reply it deals with actual payloads based on the trucks RAWR as its carrying all the weight in the trucks bed.
Most long bed trucks rear axles can weigh from 70-120 lbs more than the same short bed giving the short bed a bit more payload.
I'm talking same trucks with the same cab/drivetrain/std and option packages.

Legal weight opinions on a RV website are a hoot.

[DesertDogs]

Grit dog wrote:
So desert dogs, I'll presume these questions are due to your lack of experience towing.
If I'm wrong, apologies.
You know a 2 ton pin weight is ultimately handled better by a dually, and unless you're already comfortable towing large trailers, it's also my reccomendation as the best way to go.
BUT, that said, a 4000lb pin weight and typical other truck cargo (people and some other stuff) is not out of the realm of the capability of a srw truck. Yes it's heavy, quite heavy, but back to your original question, slap some airbags and some heavy duty tires on it that are good for close to 4000lb ea and you'll drive a lot of miles without issue.
You'll be right at the upper end of your tire and wheel rated capacities but if you think about the 1000s of trucks driving around every day with similar loads, you'll realize it's not the end of the world.
OR, if you want real belt and suspenders, pick up a set of 19.5s, either new, which will run you a couple grand, or keep your eyes peeled for a used set for about 1/2 that.

I am a very experienced RVer with diesel pusher motorhomes over 40', have had several. My only 5th wheel experience, though, was around 2000 -2002, and it was a smaller and lighter one than what we're considering today. So, my 5th wheel experience is dated quite limited. These are two very different kinds of towing. Pulling a 1/2 ton GMC Sierra behind a 43' diesel pusher is a lot different than pulling a 35' 5th wheel behind a pickup truck.

I'm pretty sure I can keep the pin weight and weight of passengers and stuff in the truck below or at 4,100 lbs. So, yes, that's pushing the limit. It amazes me how many people apparently go way beyond limits and shrug it off like that's no big deal. I do take it fairly seriously, but I'm not overly cautious about it all.

Will heavy duty tires close to 4000 lbs. each create a significantly worse ride for daily use?

I'm open to going with a 5th wheel which has lower pin weight - giving us a buffer zone of capacity, but we do really like that Vilano 320 which is the smallest 5th wheel VanLeigh makes.

Still kicking the ideas all around in my head. No hurry. We've got time to sort it all out and get comfortable with the decisions.

[Grit_dog]

So desert dogs, I'll presume these questions are due to your lack of experience towing.
If I'm wrong, apologies.
You know a 2 ton pin weight is ultimately handled better by a dually, and unless you're already comfortable towing large trailers, it's also my reccomendation as the best way to go.
BUT, that said, a 4000lb pin weight and typical other truck cargo (people and some other stuff) is not out of the realm of the capability of a srw truck. Yes it's heavy, quite heavy, but back to your original question, slap some airbags and some heavy duty tires on it that are good for close to 4000lb ea and you'll drive a lot of miles without issue.
You'll be right at the upper end of your tire and wheel rated capacities but if you think about the 1000s of trucks driving around every day with similar loads, you'll realize it's not the end of the world.
OR, if you want real belt and suspenders, pick up a set of 19.5s, either new, which will run you a couple grand, or keep your eyes peeled for a used set for about 1/2 that.

[rhagfo]

DesertDogs wrote:

Me Again wrote:

DesertDogs wrote:
So, is it reasonably possible to increase the cargo capacity of a 1 ton SRW pickup from 4100 lbs to, say, 4600 lbs?

What would need to be done?

I do not believe that you ever answer the question on washer, dryer and generator? Or stated that you would push the manufacturer for a more accurate dry pin weight vs their statement of an average pin weight?

I'm considering it all. May need to go with a slightly lighter 5er. Not going to consider a duelly - don't want that. The truck is a daily driver. 5th wheel used for perhaps one trip, each year, for a month or two. Might be worth some towing inconvenience to go with a short bed and sliding hitch.

One trip each year for a MONTH or TWO, sounds like a bit of towing. How long do you plan on staying in each location, how many miles per trip?
Once you get use to the hips, daily driving a DRW is not an issue.

[DesertDogs]

Me Again wrote:

DesertDogs wrote:
So, is it reasonably possible to increase the cargo capacity of a 1 ton SRW pickup from 4100 lbs to, say, 4600 lbs?

What would need to be done?

I do not believe that you ever answer the question on washer, dryer and generator? Or stated that you would push the manufacturer for a more accurate dry pin weight vs their statement of an average pin weight?

I'm considering it all. May need to go with a slightly lighter 5er. Not going to consider a duelly - don't want that. The truck is a daily driver. 5th wheel used for perhaps one trip, each year, for a month or two. Might be worth some towing inconvenience to go with a short bed and sliding hitch.

[Me_Again]

DesertDogs wrote:
So, is it reasonably possible to increase the cargo capacity of a 1 ton SRW pickup from 4100 lbs to, say, 4600 lbs?

What would need to be done?

I do not believe that you ever answer the question on washer, dryer and generator? Or stated that you would push the manufacturer for a more accurate dry pin weight vs their statement of an average pin weight?