Buying first trailer/ advice for recent graduate

[4Runner03]

Hey everybody, first post. I've been reading through the stickies around the forums and learning heaps.

I am looking to buy my first travel trailer and need some advice.

I just graduated college and moved to Washington from Colorado. I am a forester and spend a lot of time in the woods. In my next few years it looks like I could be moving around quite a bit again with work. To me a travel trailer seems like a great idea. I've been living in my boss' '22 Nash and don't mind it one bit, I actually love it. So here are my goals and please correct me if I'm wrong:

Keep living costs low (student loans)
Have a sense of home wherever I go, tired of packing and moving every year
Possibly cheaper than apartments, in my area without utilities ~$650 Rv lot w/utilities $350/month
Have an asset when done, if I can purchase one where depreciation has slowed
Love the freedom of going anywhere

I recently found one at a dealer and negotiated what I think is a fair deal, but I would appreciate some input!

It's a 2008 Komfort Ridgecrest 181. http://www.clearcreekrvcenter.com/rv/2008-KOMFORT-RIDGECREST-181-4406
I negotiated down to 8,200 and have the financing ready to go at $130/month at 6%. Would likely pay double that to not get upside down.

Cliff Notes:
Is a travel trailer a good idea for me in your experience?
Do I have a good deal set up?


Cheers

[BubbaChris]

OP - Your plan sounds more thought-out and feasible than some I've seen here (compared to a family of 4 wanting to winter in upstate NY in a fiver). So I'll start with a couple of suggestions:

First find a mobile RV tech that you can hire to thoroughly inspect any trailer before you sign any purchase paperwork. You want this on your dime, so he/she is accountable to you.

Second, call 1 or 2 places where you think you'll first be camping for a while. Ask them if they have a local outfit that rents 50-gal or 100-gal propane tanks and get that referral. Call them and get pricing and guestimates on how often you'll need to have them filled.

I'd also recommend creating a generous time and money budget for the first year of outfitting/customizing whatever TT you buy. Our 18-month old (when we bought it) unit swallowed somewhere between $1,000 to $2,000 in tools, supplies, and projects our first year.

[rebelopie]

Around 12 years ago or so, I found myself recently graduated and in a peaked housing market that I couldn't afford. My only real option to own something was to buy a lot in an RV resort and purchase a nice trailer to live in. Having high standards, I bought the absolute best I could with leather furniture, 3 TVs, washer/dryer, walk-in closet, and so on. However, I didn't own a tow vehicle that could pull the monstrous 5th wheel, so it served as a stationary home for several years while I saved up to purchase a house. I got a good return when I sold my RV lot and was happy I went that route.

You have been given a lot of good advise so far. My advise would be to purchase something large enough you can stand to live in while small enough that you can maintain and travel in by yourself. If I could go back in time, I would have bought a smaller rig that I could have traveled in and would have met my needs for camping once I moved into a house. The 5th wheel sat in my backyard, unused, for a year while I struggled to sell it.

[RedRocket204]

Slowmover wrote:
The trailer paid for is where the cost savings come in. But not with a conventional box trailer. The reason I've stayed with one of the Airstream cousins from years ago. No depreciation, and no rot given some maintenance.

You mention maintenance for your "Airstream" but fail to address that below with regards to "box" trailers and their lifespan. Please also go into further detail on the initial cost factor of Airstreams too.

Slowmover wrote:
It is the upfront costs that are critical. A wood box trailer might last ten years if moving around is contemplated. They're built for a six year lifespan (normal length of first ownership), and eventually rot in place in some field or some back lot trailer park. Thus, one winds up having to replace them pretty often (as I see it).

Laughable at best. Please site your source for this nonsense... FYI an Airstream forum doesn't count as a reliable source for information on "box" trailers as a majority of those folks are very biased. A well maintained "box" trailer, as you put it, can last well beyond your 6 year mention or even your 10 year mention. Rot in a field? Seriously dramatic there aren't you? You mean there are no Airstreams, or cousins rotting away in fields?

Something else you forgot to mention. Please let us know how well your Airstream cousin does in areas that get a good amount of hail. Just yesterday there was so much hail at my house, it looked as though it had snowed. Will I own a Airstream that is destined to look like a golf ball? No way.

To each his own, but Airstreams, or their cousins, are not the end all of travel trailers. They do have their faults too.

[Slowmover]

The trailer paid for is where the cost savings come in. But not with a conventional box trailer. The reason I've stayed with one of the Airstream cousins from years ago. No depreciation, and no rot given some maintenance.

All trailers are bad in cold weather. Three seasons is about it for reasonable expenses plus wear. In the hottest areas ones electrical costs are high. That said, my overhead is low (paid for truck and trailer where the former is expected to be I service another 8-10 years, with the latter having an indefinite life span), about half that of paying for a metropolitan area apartment.

I would, were I you, spend a lot of time reading Winter Living threads, here and on www.airforums.com as there is a lot to learn where dealing with temps from 40F on down for a daily high is expected.

High temps are a little easier, but if humidity is part of the mix, it introduces its own problems. Water is what destroys trailers. For me this means that there is a definite line going north that trailer living becomes unreasonable. Short andong term costs both.

It is the upfront costs that are critical. A wood box trailer might last ten years if moving around is contemplated. They're built for a six year lifespan (normal length of first ownership), and eventually rot in place in some field or some back lot trailer park. Thus, one winds up having to replace them pretty often (as I see it).

There are a thousand and one little costs associated with becoming the owner of a trailer not obvious from the outset. A trailer that just sits appears to not have them. But the whole point of owning one is to be mobile. And this is where there is not only a learning curve , but some large expenses as well as the thousand small ones. . Too much, IMO, for most blinded by the idea of "it's cheap and I can move it".

Take your time. Read. Make notes.

[RedRocket204]

Our 2007 Komfort Kampsite is decently insulated on the sides but that doesn't mean a whole lot in regards to the OP's identified TT. Ours does not have heated pipes or holding tanks but that doesn't seem too hard to add. Our is a 26' coach (point to bumper is 30.5 feet) and has a GVWR of 9500 lbs. Construction on it is not a lightweight build. Ours does not have double pane windows. It is more of a 3 season TT. But again, not the same model line as listed in the OP.

Per the recommendations on Nash/Arctic Fox, Bigfoot... yes those are great 4 season trailers but also generally end up being very heavy for the size. His 4 Runner would be questionable as a TV and it does not sound like he wants to upgrade TV.

Check all the seals on the top of the TT to see if it was well maintained. There should not be any signs of "caulking" (actually Dicor) that looks to be cracking or pulling away. Severely cracking Dicor has the potential for a water leak.

[westend]

I'd suggest to look at a few more before purchasing. The Arctic Fox line is well regarded by some that full-time. In the Winter, I'd suggest to look at some insulated skirting and heat lamps or portable heater underneath to keep the floor warm. For me, I could probably maintain a pretty good life at 50f but my feet would be in rebellion with a cold floor. A cold floor gets old fast. I've stayed in trailers where the heated temp was 70f but there was snow and ice on the floor by the entry door. Another cold radiator is windows. 1 1/2" blue board friction fit in the window opening is the best solution I've seen. The foam panels can come off in the day for light and back on for nights.

I'd also suggest to buy a vented propane fish house stove. You will have to do some installation for the vent but these little space heaters use a fraction of what an RV furnace uses for propane. I have the Sportsman brand heater and it is in it's third RV. You just can't beat them for efficiency and comfortability.

Good luck with your new RV lifestyle.

[sdianel_-acct_c]

Have you considered a well insulated truck camper (TC)? You may need a larger truck but it might work best for winter.

[amxpress]

I agree with another response, the trailer you're looking at retails from $5,000 - 6,000. Don't add options from the list if it already comes as standard equipment.
Not knowing how it has been maintained will require a thorough inspection. Check the date on the tires; chances are they'll need replacing. Get the dealer to include a warranty by a reputable company that is accepted Nationwide. If something breaks
I think the $8200 is too high, but good luck.

[tatest]

Where you are planning to use it I would be looking for a Nash, Arctic Fox, or BigFoot, which all start out more winter-capable than most TTs on the market. I'm not familiar with Komfort as it was one of the Dutchmen RV brands not marketed in this area, but I think it may have been positioned as a lightweight, or at least some models.

[azrving]

I think a TT is a good idea as your house and ride to work wont be connected like a motorhome. RV's are best suited to move with the weather but there are ways to use them in the winter..

The number one issue when buying an RV is water damage. You need to look at every inch of that TT. Get on top and feel for soft wood under the membrane. Look and feel in all the closets and cabinets. Various leaks can result in water running through the walls and into the floor. Do not rely on the salesperson. Do not buy into trusting the guy. They may be the greatest people you have ever met but it is totally on you to be sure you dont get ripped.

Don't worry about the appliances so much as they are all easy compared to water damage. See that all the appliance work of course but the big thing is water.


I was in the Denver area last November when they had unusually cold weather. It dropped to 9 degees or so on a few nights. I was burning 30 pounds of propane some days and always 15. 30 pounds was $26.00 !!!! The only time the furnace stopped was on the days that there was decent sun on the FW. I also had an electric heater going a lot of the time.I never connected to city water, just used the fresh fill so there were no frozen noses or heat tape. I boxed in the holding tank area and used an electric heater on the coldest nights.

You have to be ready to dump and winterize if the heat goes out. Running something like a buddy wont get it.

Being single would let you go to the next level when dealing with winter. You could keep it dry and deal with your needs without having the water on or filling the tanks. People who camp/live in vans pretty much do it that way year round. Bucket toilets, 5 gal jug of water etc.

The weather extremes are what will drive the cost up the most. If you could never turn the ac or furnace on those would be your 2 biggest savings.

If you take care of the exterior it will last a long time. If you guess that it would last 10 years and you junked it you would have your cost per month. To me it would be very good to not get an apartment. If you go solar and can boondock some of the time you could save on rent. Even a month here and there is another $350 to put on the rv that month.

There is always something to do or buy for an RV so expect that. If you do it be absolutely sure it has no water damage then make sure you keep it sealed up or your house part of the deal is going to burn you hard. Good luck to you

[4Runner03]

GMandJM wrote:
Have you checked NADA to see if that price is fair/reasonable?

The listing doesn't say what options are included. If bare bones, it has an average retail of about $6k. Have you checked your bank or credit union to see if they will loan that much on it? Or is this going to be a cash deal?

You also don't mention what you're going to tow with and if you KNOW it's suitable to tow that specific TT. (Don't just rely on your salesman saying that you can.)

You also don't mention where you might be going. Many TTs do not do well in cold climates and the price of propane to heat it in the winter s an expense you'll have to factor in.

That said, I can totally relate to you wanting to take your home along with you. I met someone last year who is a ranger "up north" in the warmer months and will be working in The Everglades next winter. The kind of set up you're talking about would work for him.

No advice other than check your facts and realistically gauge your circumstances see if it's really "do-able" for you.

I looked up the NADA with the options on the trailer and it said low retail came in around $7,200, and Average was $9,100. I'll check that list when I get home and double check those numbers. It's going to be financed through the local credit union with 5% down.

That person sounds in very similar situation. The coldest temperatures I may find myself are 10-15F, I'm on the Olympic Peninsula located right on the coast. So I'll never find myself much above sea level.

Thanks for the food for thought. You all are awesome, I want to make sure I don't leave any possibility untouched and wind up upside down on it.

What would you estimate average propane usage per month could be if the average temperature is in the 30's for a few months?

[4Runner03]

toedtoes wrote:


First, it will never be an "asset" - you will never make more money selling it than it cost to live in it. It will never gain in value. Even paying twice the payment, you'll lose money.

Two, add your RV lot fees to your $260 RV payments and you're looking at $610 per month. Not a huge savings. In addition, any problems with the TT are at your expense - problems with an apartment are at the landlord's expense.

Then you have to consider the tow vehicle - is your current vehicle big enough to handle towing the trailer (even on a seasonal/yearly basis)? Will you have to buy a different vehicle to tow it? Add on that cost.

Then you have to consider winter - will you be in areas that get below freezing? If so, you have to consider that RVs often don't have wrapped pipes or other cold weather protection. How will you handle those freezing temperatures? Also, if there will be below freezing winters, the RV parks may close during those times.

My general advice is that if you are looking at living in an RV to save money, don't do it. You won't save enough to make it worthwhile. If you are looking at living in an RV because you want the freedom to move around, then it might be a good deal.

You make an excellent point. These things depreciate faster than anything I've ever seen. After looking at depreciation it seems they level off somewhat after 7 years. Not to say they don't stop depreciating.

I'm referring to it as an asset relative to an apartment in which there is nothing to recoup after paying every month. I will no doubt lose money on this, but I'm trying to figure out if I'll lose less if I can get something of a return in the end or decide to keep it travel trailer.

You make an excellent point regarding expenses. I used to be a mechanic and am very handy, but if any major issues occur that could be costly.

I would definitely be wrapping all my pipes and insulating the tanks, winters around here will get down around 10-15 F at the lowest. I'm located right on the coast near sea level. As for myself I think I could handle colder temps as long as I can keep the trailer above 50 F.

As for a tow vehicle I have an 03 4runner with the 4.7 iforce v8, tranny cooler, HD springs, tow package and brake controller. I've pulled a 7500lb trailer through the rockies and had no problems. The tow rating on the rig is 7000lbs.

I love adventure and traveling, I put around 25k miles on my rig a year. Just thinking about the cheap motels I've racked up makes me sick. Most of the time I go backpacking, offroading, and camping. It would be awesome to have a home away from home

Thanks for the awesome feedback you gave me some great things to think about!

[4Runner03]

Dakota98 wrote:
Will you be in any harsh winter environments, living in the TT ?

Coldest temperatures will be around 10-15'. I'm not worried about myself having stayed in logging camps, but I would plan on insulating the pipes and tanks.

[GMandJM]

Have you checked NADA to see if that price is fair/reasonable?

The listing doesn't say what options are included. If bare bones, it has an average retail of about $6k. Have you checked your bank or credit union to see if they will loan that much on it? Or is this going to be a cash deal?

You also don't mention what you're going to tow with and if you KNOW it's suitable to tow that specific TT. (Don't just rely on your salesman saying that you can.)

You also don't mention where you might be going. Many TTs do not do well in cold climates and the price of propane to heat it in the winter s an expense you'll have to factor in.

That said, I can totally relate to you wanting to take your home along with you. I met someone last year who is a ranger "up north" in the warmer months and will be working in The Everglades next winter. The kind of set up you're talking about would work for him.

No advice other than check your facts and realistically gauge your circumstances see if it's really "do-able" for you.

[gmw_photos]

toedtoes wrote:
....snip....

My general advice is that if you are looking at living in an RV to save money, don't do it. You won't save enough to make it worthwhile. If you are looking at living in an RV because you want the freedom to move around, then it might be a good deal.

Exactly. Well put.