Crossing Into Canada with a Firearm

[SheriDan28]

Hi everyone: We are in the deep planning stages for a journey to Alaska, sometime in 2016. We plan to bring along a couple of firearms - a 9MM handgun and 12g shotgun.

We have read, pretty much all there is to read about how to legally journey through Canada with firearms and we have obtained the necessary NON-RESIDENT FIREARM DECLARATION form and we "think" that we are ready to attempt the crossing. However, it would surely be helpful if any of you out there have actually had the "experience" of rolling up to Customs Gate with firearms in your camper, and actually making the "declaration." Your first hand account of your experience would be most valuable for us.

Both my shotgun, which is a Mossberg Model 590, 20 gauge with a 20 inch barrel, and, my handgun, a CZ 75B with a 4.60 inch barrel length, I believe, "meet" the requirements for legal passage into Canada.

If you have had this experience in your camping journeys, it would be very much appreciated if you could share your thoughts and advice.

Thanx .... Dan

[tonymull]

I did know that about the .22. A young native girl, but she shot him in the side of the head. Lot's of grizzlies have fallen to .270's too, my buddy killed one with a .243, but hunting shots are quite different than protection shots. That, by the way is not the world record any more, although it was at the time.

[tonymull]

"The articles you cite were clearly composed by anti-gun authors with an agenda. They lack real data."

Now you are just being funny, aren't you??

Years ago there was a study published by ADF&G using various rifles, handguns and shotguns and real bear skulls. Now skulls attached to a post are more fragile than a skull attached to a shock absorbing bear neck, but it was a great test. The Anchorage newspaper and Alaska hunting magazines carried it. What I remember is that high powered rifles were best, of course, then the 12 gauge with slugs, handguns came last. In none of the cases did the 12 gauge penetrate the skull, but 7 or 8 times out of 10 it crushed the skull...in the instances when it hit just left or right of the central ridge. When it did hit the ridge it just kind of slid off to the side without crushing the skull...so a 12 gauge is marginal, which is why I said that another 200 foot pounds is important.

I can tell your mind is made up though. I'm sure you've faced more bears than I have.

[NMace]

The articles you cite were clearly composed by anti-gun authors with an agenda. They lack real data.

As you discovered a shotgun is a great noise maker, and 1200 pounds of energy will deter a bear, kill if the placement of the load is near a vital organ.

Their are right, nothing short of a cannon will stop a charging grizzlie, but I like my chances better with than without.

In case you don't know the world record grizzlie was killed with a .22 rimfire.

[tonymull]

An extra 200lbs can't hurt. BLM and ADF&G both recommend and use 12gauge shotguns with rifled slugs and do so with the knowledge that stopping a charging bear is really just not likely. Here's a few links. But keep in mind that a charging brown bear covers at least 15 yards per second. In close quarters where the vast majority of real charges and attacks actually occur, even getting a gun, pepper spray, or taser up is dicey at best and getting off an accurate shot is practically impossible. Links:

http://www.adn.com/article/20120308/gun-no-insurance-policy-bear-attack-study-indicates

http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=wildlifenews.view_article&articles_id=626

http://www.blm.gov/ak/st/en/prog/recreation/rec_info/bearsafety.html

Essentially you are about as well off with a noisemaker, such as a bear banger, or pepper spray as you are with a gun of any kind. Just leave them at home. (But I say that having toted a double barrel 12 gauge for most of my years in Alaska 😉 Although the only time I used it was as a noisemaker one night near Illiamna when I could not see well enough to tell if the bear was coming closer or not....so do what you want I guess, just don't think anything will save you from a bear that's actually charging for contact.)

[iwon415]

CA Traveler wrote:

iwon415 wrote:
Tell them just transporting it through to destination.

So is your post a April Fools joke or you're suggesting lying to the border agents?

How many times have I posted: Remove your hat and sun glasses, look directly at the agent and answer every question directly and honestly?

Reread my post carefully. I was responding to an earlier poster re April fools comments.

I was saying do not tell them you are bringing it in for self defense as they do not buy that reason. If that is your only reason, don't bother.

They will acccept traveling through to another destination.

[NMace]

I looked it up, the the foot pounds of energy of a 20 is about 90% of a 12, little over 1300 compared to 1500. A bear would not notice the difference nor would a person.

I would take it, and be confident I could protect myself and my family.

[NMace]

Some real misinformation on the effectiveness of the proper load in a 20 gauge against bears. With 3" shells and OO buckshot or slugs it is nearly as effective as a 12 gauge, more effective than any pistol, and oh, about 1,000 times better than pepper spray. I have read the junk anti-gun studies put out by NFS on bear spray, and it is slanted and nonsense. A 20 gauge would not be my choice to go bear hunting, but it will work as a deterrent.

[errante]

Back in 1986 we tried to cross into Canada with a shotgun, we were turned away, so we went to the next crossing east, did not declare and were allowed in. Bad idea, we were ok but there could have been serious ramifications. They are very strict about firearms. So last year we went again with the camper and no firearms, but I was, as most are, concerned about self defense. When we arrived at the border crossing we were asked about firearms. We responded that we had none, but we did have flare guns that we carried as safety devices on our kayaks. (We did have kayaks). The negatives, of course, is that these are one shot and you may start a forest fire. These are legal as long as they are not used as weapons. The moment you use them as anything but safety devices they are considered weapons. For many years there have been discussions in the marine field about inserts for firing 20 gauge shells in these flare devices. This is also a bad idea as they are not designed for them. Interestingly, when the border agent asked us about firearms he had trouble believing we had none. He told us several times that all we had to do was to tell him what we had. He said everyone carries a gun. As others have stated it is all about who you talk to. He informed us that is not a problem to carry a long gun as long as you declare it. This is all just my experience and I am not advocating anything, just giving you my experience.
By the way, we never felt threatened while in Canada or alaska. We did carry bear spray, which you can buy at many retailers in Canada. Last thought, if hiking and the need for spray arises, always consider wind direction.

[JumboJet]

filrupmark wrote:
My parents were crossing into Canada about 15 years ago. The border patrol were flagging people thru and saw my parents and pulled them over and did a very thorough search of their dually and fifth wheel. Dad said why did you pick us to search . The border patrol said you are from Texas . Everybody from Texas has a Gun. True story.

So the best thing you can do is have a New York, Illinois, New Jersey, or California plate on your vehicle.

How about "I Heart NY" stickers all over your vehicle and camper?

[filrupmark]

My parents were crossing into Canada about 15 years ago. The border patrol were flagging people thru and saw my parents and pulled them over and did a very thorough search of their dually and fifth wheel. Dad said why did you pick us to search . The border patrol said you are from Texas . Everybody from Texas has a Gun. True story.

[RobertRyan]

keefr wrote:

classification of firearms means nothing to this conversation. you can't bring a handgun through Canada.again,if a Canadian can't carry through,what makes you think an out of country visitor can? you can apply,but you will be denied,regardless of what the "law" says.

I have attended several matches in Alberta and BC where shooters from the US have attended with their own guns. I have also requested and received ATT's covering travel in Alberta and BC, and US border crossing spanning nearly a month with no issues. I have requested and received ATT's for the Yukon for travel to Alaska, again covering more than a month. It IS doable.

A lot of this thread applies to Australia, including ban on pepper spray. About 4 yrs ago a traveller from Texas, turned up with a virtual armoury. He was surprised he could not bring his SUITCASE full of guns in. As well as handguns, he had machine guns and a Anti-Material rifle. One man war

[joeshmoe]

lincolnmatthews wrote:
One time I made the mistake of saying it for personal protection, they said from what? I said from other people, etc. They turned me back to the States.

Interesting. I would have said for the same reason that LE does--criminals. Violent crime DOES exist in CAN. Don't let anyone say otherwise. Human nature is the same wherever you go.

I guarantee firearms are nearby at the border in the event authorities need to use them. Doesn't seem to matter anyway. Whether you decide defend yourself with a firearm or commit a crime, it sounds like there'll be hell to pay in Canada.

[lincolnmatthews]

We live close to the border in WA, we use to rough camp a lot in BC. I have paid the fee (I thought it was more than $25) I got my rifle or shotgun thru. One time I made the mistake of saying it for personal protection, they said from what? I said from other people, etc. They turned me back to the States. This was around the time when a family had been killed around a campfire in the Wells Gray area.
If asked from what, say from Wildlife. Also if you were camping in a non remote area, they will not allow you to take a firearm into CA, (they figure you don't need a shotgun at a RV park for instance.)
Anyway we don't go up very often anymore,(its to bad we love CA) because of the long waits at the borders because there all coming down to Bellingham buying everything. They even have 4 or 5 gas cans full of gas going back across the border. To bad the CDN government doesn't do something about this.

[joeshmoe]

Jfet wrote:
So if you do not have a permanent residence (full timing in camper), where might one store rifles, shotguns, handguns for a year or so while taking a trip up through Canada to Alaska?

Really big safety deposit box?

A year? No way would I ever trust anyone to hold firearms for a year unless they knew me and I them. I look at guns like I do any precious metal, stones or jewelry...if you don't hold it, you don't own it. Not to mention, creating paperwork (and likely digital paperwork) with names and serial numbers to be stored into only God knows whose computers or servers But that's me. Just saying.