First barrage with the dealer

[Raife]

So we went and spent time with the Grand Design Imagine XLS 21BHE today. We spent about 10 minutes with the sales person and then asked if we could spend some time in the unit by ourselves (me, wife, and 3 kids). We just "played" for about 15 minutes, and then did about 70% of Tom Boles Pre Delivery Inspection. We had shore power, but nothing else. Overall the unit was very nice...we found a couple nitpik things.

So then we talked numbers. He started with the same sheet he had sent me which was 18.43% below MSRP (inclusive of freight charge). He said the freight charge was the cost to get it to them. The only fees were (I clarified several times there were no other fees later - he said no. We do get a 1-hour walk-through and "basics" kit):
- Documentary fee: $150.
- Title fee: $116.75
- State inspection fee: $7.00

We said we had an out the door budget that was significantly lower (like 35%) than what he had proposed and that we were looking at several other models as they were much closer to our budget. He tried to go down the finance route, we ignored it, and said we wanted to talk the out the door price first and we already had the means to pay for it. He asked what we were willing to spend, so we gave the number at 26% off.

He did the "let me take it to my manager" game and came back with $300 off. We joked about how that was not really a change.

He then stated with the provided price it was was $1,000 profit for the dealer (which I didn't believe) and said that was the lowest the the dealership would go. We briefly discussed "freebies" he could toss in, primarily being the WDH. He said nope. He then went down the financing route again asking what our monthly payment target was...we ignored it and talked generalities of how the dealer financing worked. He said depending on how the financing played out he may be able to bring the sale price down some more.

We thanked him, said we would be looking at the other models we were considering, but would keep in touch as our hold deposit was good through Wed (although he said if we stayed in contact he could honor it till next weekend).

So a couple basic questions:
1) Do I believe the $1,000 profit and if true is that typical/reasonable for an RV sale?

2) If I calculate out the total cost (MSRP + freight + fees), the current offer from the dealer is 19.25% off...while I know in the "ol'days"
25-30% could be the norm, I question if it is now.

For reference the other two models are the:
- Gulfstream Kingsport Ultrlite 247ABH
- Jayco Jay Flight 224BH

I am opening up the flood gates to the thoughts and opinions of all of you...

Thank you.

[badercubed]

ssthrd wrote:

TomG2 wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:
...snip.....

I AM thankful that my parents squashed us all into that little camper.

Well said. I suppose a family could go camping in a three bedroom mobile home but I don't see the point. Cousin Richard, his wife, and five kids had as much fun camping in the back of a farm grain truck as any family in a forty foot fifth wheel. If one does not want to know what their kids or doing or vice versa, bigger is necessary.

X2 from a family of 13 siblings.......

We actually downsized from a large double slide bunkhouse to the trailer in my signature. Family of four and its so much more enjoyable in the smaller unit. More places to go, more family time and more time outside, regardless of the weather. Who doesn't love muddy puddles?!

[IowaFrogFarmer]

Dealer cost lookup site.


Well I tried to post link using advanced tool but link was auto removed. Hmm.. Try this way: cut and paste - https://seedealercost.com

[ssthrd]

TomG2 wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:
...snip.....

I AM thankful that my parents squashed us all into that little camper.

Well said. I suppose a family could go camping in a three bedroom mobile home but I don't see the point. Cousin Richard, his wife, and five kids had as much fun camping in the back of a farm grain truck as any family in a forty foot fifth wheel. If one does not want to know what their kids or doing or vice versa, bigger is necessary.

X2 from a family of 13 siblings.......

[TomG2]

spoon059 wrote:

I'm certainly thankful that neither my kids nor I feel the need to belittle other people who don't think or act exactly like we do. Maybe that's a benefit of a larger camper?

Belittle? If the shoe fits.....
I do me, you do you. I don't care if you tow a sixty foot mobile home. I do look at camping as a chance for families to be close together. If that belittles you, sorry.

[spoon059]

TomG2 wrote:
If one does not want to know what their kids or doing or vice versa, bigger is necessary.

I'm certainly thankful that neither my kids nor I feel the need to belittle other people who don't think or act exactly like we do. Maybe that's a benefit of a larger camper?

[lane_hog]

Hope you enjoy your Grand Design as much as we do ours.

We walked into the dealership and told them our out the door price target, and had that in writing within 15 minutes.

[GrandpaKip]

Congratulations. Have many fun outings.
Enjoy!

[TomG2]

Gdetrailer wrote:
...snip.....

I AM thankful that my parents squashed us all into that little camper.

Well said. I suppose a family could go camping in a three bedroom mobile home but I don't see the point. Cousin Richard, his wife, and five kids had as much fun camping in the back of a farm grain truck as any family in a forty foot fifth wheel. If one does not want to know what their kids or doing or vice versa, bigger is necessary.

[Gdetrailer]

spoon059 wrote:


That's one way to look at it. The other way is that I remember growing up camping in a pop up and how much I disliked being cooped up in bad weather. I love my kids and want them to enjoy the experience. I don't know about you, but I hope that my kids have an easier life than I did... not a harder life.

Thankfully, I don't have to raise my family by your standards and you don't have to raise yours by mine.

We spent a lot of family time together when raining.

That is what board games, books, a few toys, small portable radio for music and imagination is all about, have a lot of fond memories from those experiences. We HAD to learn to "get along", we HAD to learn to share (not much space for a lot of "stuff either"), we HAD to learn cooperation. We didn't have cellphones, tablets, laptops, game devices, DVD players which are all single person devices and activities which ISOLATE them from in person human interaction.

Family time is about connecting and bonding with your family, otherwise I am not really sure as to why folks spend the money on a cramped RV, after all you only are going to have only 300 square feet of space in say a 35ft RV.

Sure, there were times when we had a fight or two, those fights were for only a few minutes and we HAD to learn to resolve our differences, but in the end, my brothers and sisters ARE still my family.

While I am the only sibling that does camp, they have other interests which take their time and resources but we do all stay in touch.

Sorry that you did not have such a good experience, perhaps you can use some of my point of view as something to consider.. Your kid's WILL grow up fast and then they will be gone from your camping experience in a flash.

My only child is now in College but we have been camping since she was only 2 yrs old.. Granted it is only one child, but I wanted her to see life outside the comfy home life. Yeah, she does take a lot of electronic stuff but she does enjoy board games on those rainy days.

When they are young, it can be a challenge of frustration camping but they are only young once and it does not require a big RV but they do require you as a parent to take time out of your schedule and perhaps play board games, read some books with your young kids and so on..

I AM thankful that my parents squashed us all into that little camper.

[spoon059]

Gdetrailer wrote:


Folks now days are soft.

Grew up with Mom and Dad packing all SIX of us kids into a STATION WAGON and TENTING as far as Florida the first couple of yrs we camped.

The Dad bought a pickup in 1970, put a cap on the back, made a bench and table and all SIX of us kids road in the back as far as Florida and camped.

Then Dad found a used 1960s TC and all SIX of us kids road in the TC..

We camped like that and it didn't kill us kids or our parents in the process.

We even survived Hurricane Agnes while camping at Disney Florida.

Now days parents are so bothered by their own kids they try to find the biggest monster to tow in order to keep the kids far, far away..

That's one way to look at it. The other way is that I remember growing up camping in a pop up and how much I disliked being cooped up in bad weather. I love my kids and want them to enjoy the experience. I don't know about you, but I hope that my kids have an easier life than I did... not a harder life.

Thankfully, I don't have to raise my family by your standards and you don't have to raise yours by mine.

[Gdetrailer]

spoon059 wrote:

TomG2 wrote:
Other than full-timers do people really buy travel trailers to "Live in"? I use a camper to sleep in while I am visiting interesting and fun places. Then I am out of the trailer. Families have enjoyed tent camping for years in smaller spaces than a 25 foot travel trailer with sleeping for six.

If you take longer trips and plan them in advance, you can't control everything. With a 7, 5 and 1.5 year old, rainy days can get messy and require staying indoors. Having a larger camper with sufficient room for the older kids to do a puzzle and the toddler to be contained and play is worth the extra cost in my mind.

Generally we are outside, but you can't control everything.

Folks now days are soft.

Grew up with Mom and Dad packing all SIX of us kids into a STATION WAGON and TENTING as far as Florida the first couple of yrs we camped.

The Dad bought a pickup in 1970, put a cap on the back, made a bench and table and all SIX of us kids road in the back as far as Florida and camped.

Then Dad found a used 1960s TC and all SIX of us kids road in the TC..

We camped like that and it didn't kill us kids or our parents in the process.

We even survived Hurricane Agnes while camping at Disney Florida.

Now days parents are so bothered by their own kids they try to find the biggest monster to tow in order to keep the kids far, far away..

[spoon059]

TomG2 wrote:
Other than full-timers do people really buy travel trailers to "Live in"? I use a camper to sleep in while I am visiting interesting and fun places. Then I am out of the trailer. Families have enjoyed tent camping for years in smaller spaces than a 25 foot travel trailer with sleeping for six.

If you take longer trips and plan them in advance, you can't control everything. With a 7, 5 and 1.5 year old, rainy days can get messy and require staying indoors. Having a larger camper with sufficient room for the older kids to do a puzzle and the toddler to be contained and play is worth the extra cost in my mind.

Generally we are outside, but you can't control everything.

[spoon059]

For reference, I bought my 2015 Jayco in January of 2015. We ordered ours with the interior colors and exact options we wanted. Our price was 35 or 36% off Jayco's published MSRP (I can't remember exact numbers now). I had gone to many RV shows, knew exactly what I wanted and knew the MSRP cost of the options. I literally sent emails to multiple dealers with the exact configuration that I wanted. I'm a pretty easy sale... no hemming and hawing, no long days of trudging through different models, no haggling over colors, etc. A couple minutes of paperwork for a known entity (on the dealers free time, none the less) for an easy profit. My salesman ultimately decided to take a reasonable profit on their part for minimal amount of work on their part.

Freight is a legit cost. Title fees are mandated by your state. Sales tax is theft. Other fees are just profit for the dealer. I don't really care how they break it down, I just want to pay a fair price for my camper.

Now... that was winter 2015. It was bitter cold those couple of months and sales were understandably very slow. Fast forward to summer 2020... you are not going to get the best deal in this environment. Interest rates are quite low, supply is low and demand is very high right now. If you want to camp this fall, you are likely going to have to spend a little more. If you can wait for this push to slow down, you'll see your bargaining power getting stronger.

[Raife]

Thanks Burbman and Deb/Ed