Long Term Nissan Titan XD Diesel Update

[Community Alumni]

It's the truck we all love or love to hate. Car and Driver has a Titan XD Diesel that they've been testing since October 2016 and here's an update. It hasn't been all peaches and cream.

2016 Nissan Titan XD Long Term Update Review

[brulaz]

transamz9 wrote:

...
There's a big difference between going over GVWR like we are talking about and going over GAWR.

I thught we were talking about the Titan XD, which has a low rear GAWR because of its wimpy axle, as well as a low GVWR.

The low GVWR could be because of all sorts of things (heavy diesel engine and/or wimpy brakes/springs/axle). Who knows what will happen when you exceed it.

But I'm noting that when you exceed the Titan XD's rGAWR, it's primarily the rear axle that will blow, if you really exceed it over a long time. And the result can potentially be disastrous, as I tried to point out.

[transamz9]

brulaz wrote:
When the bearings on my old semi-float rear axle went, the whole axle/wheel assembly silently pulled out of the housing. It didn't just make a lot of noise and come to a slow, grinding stop. Luckily I was in town, travelling at slow speeds and was flagged down by a pedestrian.

And yes, the truck had been overloaded (heavily? probably) for a couple years before hand. It was one of those "an xtra leaf in the spring pack will fix that" deals back when I was young and ignorant.

Since then I've been much more worried when exceeding a truck's rear GAWR.

There's a big difference between going over GVWR like we are talking about and going over GAWR.

[brulaz]

When the bearings on my old semi-float rear axle went, the whole axle/wheel assembly silently pulled out of the housing. It didn't just make a lot of noise and come to a slow, grinding stop. Luckily I was in town, travelling at slow speeds and was flagged down by a pedestrian.

And yes, the truck had been overloaded (heavily? probably) for a couple years before hand. It was one of those "an xtra leaf in the spring pack will fix that" deals back when I was young and ignorant.

Since then I've been much more worried when exceeding a truck's rear GAWR.

[FishOnOne]

spoon059 wrote:
Back on point... DeMiles owns a Nissan that is within his specs and he is happy with it. Good for him. There is debate about safety going over your GVWR or GAWR numbers, that will never end.

The Nissan truck rides like a truck and Car and Driver doesn't like it cause it rides like a truck.

Does that about sum up the 9 pages?

Well said... We all make choices!

[transamz9]

Huntindog wrote:

transamz9 wrote:

Huntindog wrote:

jerem0621 wrote:
I love these show me your payload sticker threads.

The Titan XD is a beast. I look at those payload stickers and just kinda laugh at them...they are literally meaningless and only matter on the day these trucks are manufactured.

I test drove a 2014 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 crew cab Hemi this past weekend. Had my two man sized sons and my father with me...none of us are under 200 lbs...the sales man rode with us on the test drive as well...that was at least 1100 lbs of humans.... truck was awesome...handled amazing ... powerful...fast...cornered great. After the test drive I looked at the silly payload sticker and it said 950 lbs. According to RV.net I was a danger to society being 200 lbs overloaded...the real world said that truck wasn't even phased by the 1100 lbs in the cab. It would have comfortably handled 600 lbs or more worth of hitch weight with a weight distribution hitch and wouldn't have even blinked.

I once looked at a Ram 2500 MegaCab 4x4 Laramie Longhorn CTD with all he options (including fifth wheel prep) ...the silly sticker said 1750 lb of payload...I posted that fact here and someone pointed out that 1750 lbs in the bed would literally not even squat the truck. That fact is reflected in these silly payload stickers on the Titan XD as well...put 1500 lbs in the bed and it will barely squat.

Thanks!

Jeremiah

If you load more than what the silly sticker states into your truck.... And something goes wrong..... Say the rear axle has a problem etc.,,,,and you get it towed to the dealership... They will explain to you just what that silly sticker means to your silly warranty.

I've never had a warranty denied on any of our trucks because of going over the payload sticker and we have had plenty of trucks go in on the hook still loaded over their payload with just tools.

An awful lot left unsaid here.... Just what were those trucks towed to the dealer for? If it wasn't a problem that could be blamed on overloading.... It means nothing. Some dealers will look the other way for their large accounts... Not so much for the normal guy on the street.

I have had them bring it up, when I had a TV that had many problems.... The conversation did not last long, as I had special ordered that TV with all the HD options. IOW, it was pretty much impossible for me to overload that particular combo.

Wheel and axle bearings. Had one truck break a leaf spring. Had one truck had a gear set making noise.

[demiles]

Yes it does!

[spoon059]

Back on point... DeMiles owns a Nissan that is within his specs and he is happy with it. Good for him. There is debate about safety going over your GVWR or GAWR numbers, that will never end.

The Nissan truck rides like a truck and Car and Driver doesn't like it cause it rides like a truck.

Does that about sum up the 9 pages?

[Huntindog]

demiles wrote:

otrfun wrote:

demiles wrote:
In my opinion the GVWR rating is more about safety and long term reliability of the vehicle. How does overloading effect braking distance? Running overloaded all the time certainly would reduce component life and could cause premature failure. An occasional overload I really don't think is a big issue as long as caution is used. Of course the GVWR comes into play when you're talking commercial vehicles but that another story. The NHTSA requires these stickers on vehicles, it's up to the consumer to use common sense which is the problem.

Lets go with your and Jeremiah's line of thinking that payload ratings are only a guideline and not a line in the sand. For the sake of discussion let's exceed it by, say 50 percent . . . very carefully, of course. That would present a payload of 2850 lbs. for your Nissan Cummins.

Ok, let's factor in value along with that 2850 lbs. You said you paid $33k for your Nissan Cummins 4x2. A very good deal; however, the average Joe would probably pay closer to ~$36k.

A '16-'17 Ram 3500 crew cab 4x2 6.7 Cummins can be purchased for about ~$36k. That's roughly 20 percent off MSRP--standard discount pricing at any volume Ram dealer.

So, now we have two trucks that cost approx the same ($36k). Let's place 2850 lbs in the bed of each. The above trim-level Ram 3500 has a realworld payload rating of 4,000 lbs. (not just in a brochure) vs. your Nissan Cummins that supposedly has a payload rating of 1,900 lbs.

For the same $36k spent and 2850 lbs. in the bed, which truck do you think is going to be safer going down the freeway at 75 MPH? Which truck sits on full-floating axles vs. semi-floating axles? Which truck has 245 lb. ft. more torque and at the same time gets equal or better fuel economy? Which truck can still carry another 1,150 lbs. of payload and still be within payload limits? Which truck will probably last longer and be more reliable while carrying that 2,850 lbs? Lastly, which truck offers the best overall ROI for that ~$36k?

You will not buy a 1 ton Ram 6.7 in any configuration for under 45k in my area. You'll be lucky to find anything 3/4 or 1 ton from the big three under 40k. They don't discount that much because they still sell them all day long at higher prices.

So in your area, you can buy an XD for cheap, yet have to pay top dollar for 3/4-1 tons...

If that is because as you say, the 3/4-1 tons command a high price.... The the reverse must be true as well... They cannot sell the XDs without discounting them a lot... Gotta be a reason for that... Just sayin..

[Huntindog]

transamz9 wrote:

Huntindog wrote:

jerem0621 wrote:
I love these show me your payload sticker threads.

The Titan XD is a beast. I look at those payload stickers and just kinda laugh at them...they are literally meaningless and only matter on the day these trucks are manufactured.

I test drove a 2014 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 crew cab Hemi this past weekend. Had my two man sized sons and my father with me...none of us are under 200 lbs...the sales man rode with us on the test drive as well...that was at least 1100 lbs of humans.... truck was awesome...handled amazing ... powerful...fast...cornered great. After the test drive I looked at the silly payload sticker and it said 950 lbs. According to RV.net I was a danger to society being 200 lbs overloaded...the real world said that truck wasn't even phased by the 1100 lbs in the cab. It would have comfortably handled 600 lbs or more worth of hitch weight with a weight distribution hitch and wouldn't have even blinked.

I once looked at a Ram 2500 MegaCab 4x4 Laramie Longhorn CTD with all he options (including fifth wheel prep) ...the silly sticker said 1750 lb of payload...I posted that fact here and someone pointed out that 1750 lbs in the bed would literally not even squat the truck. That fact is reflected in these silly payload stickers on the Titan XD as well...put 1500 lbs in the bed and it will barely squat.

Thanks!

Jeremiah

If you load more than what the silly sticker states into your truck.... And something goes wrong..... Say the rear axle has a problem etc.,,,,and you get it towed to the dealership... They will explain to you just what that silly sticker means to your silly warranty.

I've never had a warranty denied on any of our trucks because of going over the payload sticker and we have had plenty of trucks go in on the hook still loaded over their payload with just tools.

An awful lot left unsaid here.... Just what were those trucks towed to the dealer for? If it wasn't a problem that could be blamed on overloading.... It means nothing. Some dealers will look the other way for their large accounts... Not so much for the normal guy on the street.

I have had them bring it up, when I had a TV that had many problems.... The conversation did not last long, as I had special ordered that TV with all the HD options. IOW, it was pretty much impossible for me to overload that particular combo.

[jerem0621]

Just observation.. that's all. My van is very important to me, and if "they" can do it with my van "they" can do it with any vehicle.

Pay attention to your weights
Set up the hitch right
Set the brake controller up right
Check the trailer lights
Check your tires air pressure
Make sure the wall stays in your rear view mirror

I think I am checking out of here for a while. Sorry If I offende anyone.


Thanks!

Jeremiah

[Lantley]

jerem0621 wrote:
Mine didn't.. mine was more than 200 lbs different totally unloaded to the positive...GVWR minus scaled weight... proved to me that at least in my application it was false. The payload sticker on my van was 200 ish lbs less than what my van actually weighs vs GVWR...hence my silly conclusion.

And thanks for confirming my point... the payload sticker only matters on the day it rolls off the assembly line... after that you are on your own to do your own due diligence. Unless it's my T&C and it's blatentenly false.

I've hijacked this thread long enough... The Titan is a beast trying to find its way in a very competitive market. For me, its a great truck. Light enough to fit in day to day life and heavy enough to be a stable trailer tower.

For me, I really want to buy a Titan XD. I think they are fantastic and perfect for my application. But, I am going to have to wait for them to start showing up more and more on the used market. I can't afford a 60k truck.. and yes. I want all the bells and whistles too.

Thanks

Jeremiah

You are drawing a lot of conclusions from one little Old mini van!
The Dr. weighed me when I was born but I don't think he expected it to be accurate the rest of my life,but it was accurate that moment in time.

[jerem0621]

Mine didn't.. mine was more than 200 lbs different totally unloaded to the positive...GVWR minus scaled weight... proved to me that at least in my application it was false. The payload sticker on my van was 200 ish lbs less than what my van actually weighs vs GVWR...hence my silly conclusion.

And thanks for confirming my point... the payload sticker only matters on the day it rolls off the assembly line... after that you are on your own to do your own due diligence. Unless it's my T&C and it's blatentenly false.

I've hijacked this thread long enough... The Titan is a beast trying to find its way in a very competitive market. For me, its a great truck. Light enough to fit in day to day life and heavy enough to be a stable trailer tower.

For me, I really want to buy a Titan XD. I think they are fantastic and perfect for my application. But, I am going to have to wait for them to start showing up more and more on the used market. I can't afford a 60k truck.. and yes. I want all the bells and whistles too.

Thanks

Jeremiah

[otrfun]

jerem0621 wrote:
Thanks for the feedback... I was referencing the payload sticker in the door jamb of vehicles as 'silly'...they do not reflect the max tire loading at all... go look on any new auto and compare the payload stickers tire load rating to the stamp on the sidewalls of the tires... for most half tons the sticker is figured at 36-40 PSI...as an example... air the tires up to max sidewall pressure and the sticker no longer reflects what the tires themselves can carry...same if you air the tires down... most P rated truck tires have a max PSI of 44-50 PSI nowadays.

It is my understanding that the payload sticker is figured with OEM tires on the factory floor at the stated PSI on the sticker...please correct me if I am wrong about this.

Add aftermarket bed covers, side steps, tool box, load range E tires, or big knobby tires and the payload sticker on the door jamb becomes irrelevant.

Every "how much can I tow" thread agrees with me that the payload sticker is silly... especially when the advice is given to go fill up your gas tank and go weigh the truck and subtract the scale weight from the GVWR to get your real payload... that advice is saying ignore the payload sticker and use a scale to verify real payload vs the real world.

Just so I am clear, I agree,the stamp ratings on the tire sidewalls are absolute DOT enforceable and NOT to be exceeded.

Thanks!

Jeremiah

First off, the payload rating rates the entire truck. The payload rating is only as strong as its weakest link--which could be the frame, suspension, tires, etc. If you use the proper OEM recommended size/load/speed rated tires at the PSI recommended on the door jam sticker your tires will support the stated payload rating. Change any of these parameters and all bets are off.

Secondly, the door jam payload rating sticker on your truck is accurate the moment it leaves the factory. It sounds like you expect the payload rating sticker to be some kind of artifically intelligent assistant that calculates all these variables after the truck leaves the factory. That sounds silly to me. After your truck leaves the dealership, it's up to you, as the owner of the truck, to practice due diligence, and keep tabs on any modifications or changes that may effect the payload rating. In my mind, not any more difficult (or silly) than keeping track of needed maintenance.

If I take the time to completely empty my truck, and deduct/add the weight for mods after my truck left the factory, I've found my OEM payload sticker to be accurate.

[jerem0621]

Fast Mopar wrote:

jerem0621 wrote:
I found something similar when we were shopping for our Van. All of the Town & Countries had the exact same payload sticker and number regardless of options at that dealership... when I had my Van serviced a few states away while on travel I found that the Town & Countries there had the same payload number...regardless of options.

Thanks!

Jeremiah

I agree with this. The payload on my low option Grand Caravan is listed as the same as the loaded Town & Country vans I have looked at, which makes absolutely no sense at all.

However, at the same time, I disagree with the "silly" reference when it comes to the tags. I work for a large American OEM tire manufacturer, and I can assure you that the load rating numbers stamped on your tires are not "silly" by any means.

Thanks for the feedback... I was referencing the payload sticker in the door jamb of vehicles as 'silly'...they do not reflect the max tire loading at all... go look on any new auto and compare the payload stickers tire load rating to the stamp on the sidewalls of the tires... for most half tons the sticker is figured at 36-40 PSI...as an example... air the tires up to max sidewall pressure and the sticker no longer reflects what the tires themselves can carry...same if you air the tires down... most P rated truck tires have a max PSI of 44-50 PSI nowadays.

It is my understanding that the payload sticker is figured with OEM tires on the factory floor at the stated PSI on the sticker...please correct me if I am wrong about this.

Add aftermarket bed covers, side steps, tool box, load range E tires, or big knobby tires and the payload sticker on the door jamb becomes irrelevant.

Every "how much can I tow" thread agrees with me that the payload sticker is silly... especially when the advice is given to go fill up your gas tank and go weigh the truck and subtract the scale weight from the GVWR to get your real payload... that advice is saying ignore the payload sticker and use a scale to verify real payload vs the real world.

Just so I am clear, I agree,the stamp ratings on the tire sidewalls are absolute DOT enforceable and NOT to be exceeded.

Thanks!

Jeremiah