Luxury Diesel SUV as tow vehicle

[ve2tcx]

Hi, I'm looking at people who have experienced towing with a diesel SUV. I'm planning to replace my current vehicle (2009 Toyota Highlander V6 AWD) in a year or so and I'm interested by the following:

2-3 years old (with less that 60000 miles), these SUV are around 35k (in Canada)

BMW X5 xDrive35d
Mercedes-Benz ML350 Bluetec
Volkswagen Touareg TDI

These 3 SUV averages 250HP and 400+ Lb-ft of torque

I have a 18' travel trailer weighting 4600 pounds loaded for now. I'd like to get a 23' with bunks (about 6000 pounds loaded) in the future.

I do not want a bigger SUV than the ones listed (nor a pickup truck), as it won't fit in my garage!

My 270HP, 250 pound-ft of torque Toyota does the job well right now, but it would be nice to get more power and torque if I want to upgrade my travel trailer.

Thanks!

[nomad_289]

My 2008 Grand Cherokee with Mercedes diesel gets 24 hwy, 17 towing a 3500 lb. pup. Temp. rises to midway during hill-climbs, but never more than 1/3 throttle is required. Lots more power on tap.

The GC suspension is intentionally soft with long travel, plush ride for rough trails. However, short wheelbase and soft suspension is not optimized for towing.

I subscribe to trailer weight <= tow vehicle and size TV to <= 80% of tow rating.

[nevadanick]

We have a MB GL350 which is diesel and have 40,000 trouble free miles. Have only towed enclosed trailernwith motorcycles so i cant comment on the weight you want to tow. I would try it though.

[ve2tcx]

The Jeep GC looks to be one of the best options. By the time I'm ready to replace my current vehicle, there should be some slightly used 2014 Jeep GC available at a reasonable price.

I'll explore the Touareg in more details as well. I've seen another one this weekend pulling a 25' travel trailer. There is also 2 people in my neighborhood with 23-25 FT trailers, one has a GC Diesel and the other one has a Touareg TDI. I might have a chat with them.

[sky_free]

elkhornsun wrote:

The VW Toureg has a well deserved reputation as a very unreliable vehicle and would not be something I would ever consider for a tow vehicle. Nothing worse than having a breakdown on the highway while towing anything. The Mercedes SUV's have a similarly bad reputation for reliability though their quality has improved the past couple years and they now rank above the BMW X5 vehicles (which rank above the VW.

The other problem is that for prolonged towing I would not trust the cooling system for the engine or the transmission to be 100% effective. Not a problem if you only tow the trailer a couple weeks out of the year but a concern if you use the trailer a lot.

Vehicles designed for towing will have the option of a tow package which will include wiring for the trailer and its brake controller and additional cooling capacity for the engine and the transmission.

I would take a 4Runner over any of the cars mentioned. There is a reason why Toyota trucks have for the past 5 years been at the top of the list for reliability as ranked by JD Powers. The 4Runner is also rated much higher in durability than Mercedes/BMW/VW. Chrysler is not noted for the reliability of its vehicles and its SUV's are rated even below the VW Toureg. The ride of the Jeep's is going to be the worst of any SUV if that matters to you.

SUV's have their place but there is more utility in having a 1/2 ton pickup with a crew cab instead. Lots more room in the bed of the truck for bicycles and pets and gear and supplies and with a shell you can more easily carry a boat or skis or other recreational items. Resale will be better as well.

Sheesh...Lots of people on here like to post opinions about vehicles they don't own. We have 40,000 miles on the Touareg with exactly 0 problems. We have towed thousands of miles and have done lots of climbing in temps over 100F with the temp gauge never budging. Actual experience here.

The Touareg is "designed for towing" within it's published operating parameters.

I agree with the last paragraph if the OP wants to tow a 6,000 lb trailer, except for the resale comment which would entirely depend on which truck obviously. If he sticks with the smaller one the Touareg or any of the others would be fine.

[elkhornsun]

It depends upon how many miles and on what kind of roads you plan to tow. Your Toyota has a truck frame but the SUV's you mentioned have a car unibody design that is lighter but not nearly as strong for towing.
Be sure to consider the weight of the SUV with passengers and the weight of the trailer when fully loaded (take dry weight and add 500 kilos).

The VW Toureg has a well deserved reputation as a very unreliable vehicle and would not be something I would ever consider for a tow vehicle. Nothing worse than having a breakdown on the highway while towing anything. The Mercedes SUV's have a similarly bad reputation for reliability though their quality has improved the past couple years and they now rank above the BMW X5 vehicles (which rank above the VW.

The other problem is that for prolonged towing I would not trust the cooling system for the engine or the transmission to be 100% effective. Not a problem if you only tow the trailer a couple weeks out of the year but a concern if you use the trailer a lot.

Vehicles designed for towing will have the option of a tow package which will include wiring for the trailer and its brake controller and additional cooling capacity for the engine and the transmission.

I would take a 4Runner over any of the cars mentioned. There is a reason why Toyota trucks have for the past 5 years been at the top of the list for reliability as ranked by JD Powers. The 4Runner is also rated much higher in durability than Mercedes/BMW/VW. Chrysler is not noted for the reliability of its vehicles and its SUV's are rated even below the VW Toureg. The ride of the Jeep's is going to be the worst of any SUV if that matters to you.

SUV's have their place but there is more utility in having a 1/2 ton pickup with a crew cab instead. Lots more room in the bed of the truck for bicycles and pets and gear and supplies and with a shell you can more easily carry a boat or skis or other recreational items. Resale will be better as well.

[Lowsuv]

one more thing to consider.
our 21T Komfort is an actual 23.5 feet overall
one of my many camping buddies just bought a nifty new "21 footer ".
on our annual 9 day joint campout he brought his new trailer .
his 21 looked longer than mine so we got out the tape rule .
his 21 was really 25.3 or so .
my 21T lists a 480 # tongue weight , a 4800# axle weight .
in actual practice with 50 gallons of water it is 980 # tongue weight and 5300# on the axles .
we carry the heaviest camping gear under our snugtop canopy . firewood , 3 gallon propane tank , 2 EZ-UP Quik-Shades ,an 60 quart cooler full of soda, etc.
with a lightweight SUV we would not have that option .
none of the suv's that fit into a short garage would be safe towing our "short" 21 footer .

[ti_co]

Hi, I might have some useful experiences for you to consider. I have a 2007 Jeep GC diesel which I absolutely love. It pulls my 20' bass boat very well - my best guess is that the boat/trailer weighs about 3500-4000 lbs. I get about 18-19 MPG towing in the mountains of Arizona and have managed over 20 MPG on a couple occasions.

I purchased a 21' Ragen toyhauler about a year ago and have pulled it about a dozen times only for short trips of about 50 miles each way. The motor does fine; however, the suspension (with air bags) is not really up to the task. I have the WDH cranked up pretty high to meet the front/rear adjustment numbers. I don't get much (if any) sway, but there's a lot of creaking and popping going on back there and up under the vehicle. The trailer really pushes me around in the corners, and it's just a really uneasy feeling towing with this setup. Even with mirror extensions, it's hard to see - you've probably noticed the same with your current setup. I get about 10-12 MPG towing the TH.

My goal was to purchase another vehicle exclusively for towing within a year, and I'm really glad I will be able to purchase that soon. I know you mentioned you didn't like the idea of a pickup; however, I would strongly recommend that you reconsider. A diesel pickup would tow your desired trailer with ease and would really make your trips much more enjoyable as well as safe.

For what it's worth, I've settled on a GM Duramax as my desired tow vehicle. I had a 6.0 Ford and will never by another Ford. I was undecided between GM and Dodge;however, spending some time lurking on the Dodge Cummins forums scared me over GM.

Someone else suggested a garage remodel which might be worth investigating - I had a storage room on the backside of my garage, so it was less than $1000 to tear out a wall and gain another 6' of garage space.

I hope this helps - let me know if you have any questions...

[Lowsuv]

after seeing your current setup , if i was in your current position my decision would be to keep my current trailer.
toyota products are excellent . we have had 2 avalons and 3 lexus v8 sedans since 1997 . trouble free , quiet , and nice to take a trip in for Interstate driving .
because of our german sportscar we got spoiled by the best handling cars on the planet . we live near the Cascades and drive 140 miles on curvy 2 lane highways before we can be on an interstate . hence the switch to the mercedes sedan .
an audi , vw , or benz diesel suv would be a nice upgrade .
but each of those will be way less than capable towing a 22 foot trailer.
however with your nifty 18 footer they would be good .
for very little money i would try upgrading my dining fly , camp stove and other camping necessities .
that would be way less money than a 22 foot trailer upgrade , especially if i would have to go even bigger in the suv (escalade, denali) to tow a 22 footer .

[RobertRyan]

ve2Tcx wrote:
My mistake, those are the DRY figures.

I guess, once loaded it'll be aroung 5600 lbs with a good 650lbs tongue weight.

No it is not your mistake. 4,300lb dry with a tongue weight of 650lbs for a 22ft caravan would make it a very light Caravan indeed.I would assume you do not have the dirt road driving we have here.

[ve2tcx]

RobertRyan wrote:

Ve2Tcx wrote:
My next TT would be a 23 feet (about 4300lbs dry, 475lbs tongue weight)

I find it interesting that you have such low weights dry. That 23ft TT would be the equivalent of an European caravan in weight.

My mistake, those are the DRY figures.

I guess, once loaded it'll be aroung 5600 lbs with a good 650lbs tongue weight.

[RobertRyan]

Ve2Tcx wrote:
My next TT would be a 23 feet (about 4300lbs dry, 475lbs tongue weight)

I find it interesting that you have such low weights dry. That 23ft TT would be the equivalent of an European caravan in weight.
A 35ft Rockwood pulled by a SUV in New Zealand. You could not do this in a Million Years in Australia with a similarly sized Caravan.

[smyke]

Trade that for a pickup? That's just not right.

[ve2tcx]

Well, answers are interesting. I did a search on the tongue weight rating:

Touareg: 616lbs (7200lbs towing)
X5: 600lbs (6000lbs towing)
ML350: 516lbs (7200lbs towing)
Grand Cherokee: 720lbs (7200lbs towing)

My next TT would be a 23 feet (about 4300lbs dry, 475lbs tongue weight)
In the real world it should looks like 6000lbs, and around 600-650lbs tongue weight)

The diesel GC is a good option but I doubt there will be much used available in a year. We'll see. As every domestic vehicle, the devaluation should be (pretty) high and it might be in my price range.
I'd like to spend no more than 40 000$ on the next (slightly used) vehicle.

I have plenty of time to look on the internet. I found this guy on the TDI forum:

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=360918


My other option would be to trade my summer baby (Infiniti G35 coupe) for a pickup truck. I'm not ready for that yet! My wife (and I) does not want a pickup for everyday commute.

This is my current setup:
TT is a Bullet 180 FBS, 4600lbs loaded, 550lbs tongue weight with the 3 bikes installed in the front.



Bike rack


And the baby I do not want to trade!

[campingcanuck]

This is campingcanuck's DH giving my 2 cents on this post and replies I have read so far...

x2 on sky_free's post.

Just for reference, the Q7 TDI is overall a bit larger than the Touareg with a longer wheelbase and a curb weight of 5412# which is more than our TT's dry weight. We travel with empty tanks and do not carry extra cargo in the vehicle. With a payload of 1280# and a tongue weight of 550#, we still have a little wiggle room.

I am happy to see a Jeep Diesel option available with specs that are close to large European diesel SUVs that we ARE able to buy in North America. If you do a build and compare with a base Jeep Diesel and a base Q7 TDI, there is barely a difference, but options quickly add to the price of the Jeep diesel which makes me question the overall value.

IMO, it is wonderful that there are options other than pickup trucks for towing!

[Lowsuv]

the SUV's you mention are all good
because you need to stay with a short wheelbase SUV you will be happier towing a shorter trailer.
trailer tongue weight is the remedy for sway issues .
none of those SUV's have extra capacity to spare if you experience sway with your new longer trailer.
how about keeping your current trailer and change the way you camp ?
assuming you want to sleep 4 inside then you could move your cooking and dishwaswhing chores outside.
buy yourself a 12 x 12 EZ-UP Quik-Shade and use a coleman stove or a combo stove / grill setup .
carry some dishwash tubs .
Low SUV is a mercedes 4 matic sedan . the second one we have owned .
i buy them because they are really good cars , not because of snooty status .
mercedes are VERY quiet , ride really well , handle very well , brake really well and the 4matic goes in the snow in the mighty Cascade Mountain range we live next to .
the rumour about high maintenance costs have not happened to me .
if i did not own a duramax i would own an ML 350 or a BlueTec ML.
hence the term "LOW SUV "