FWS Major Failure (see photos) *UPDATE*

[Vegas1]

Today I noticed the outside end cap to the Power Gear ram was getting hung up when retracting the full wall slide. Upon closer examination, it was discovered that two bolts that secure the floor to the ram had sheared off, causing the center of the slide to sag about 1/2". I brought it to the local WInnebago Service for diagnosis and repair. They determined that it was going to be a very difficult fix since you can barely get one hand into the area. The two outside Rams were doing all the work. If this was not discovered, who knows what kind of failure would have occurred. They called factory service and it was recommended that the ram be jacked up to close the gap between the sheared bolt and weld it in place.
I'm not sure if this is going to reduce the integrity. Hoping Extended Warranty will pay for the repair since it appears to be a manufacturer defect. Any suggestions?

[sailor_lou]

It may be fine and as you stated, it's sharing the load. I wouldn't be overly concerned and would just inspect it on a regular basis. Good luck.

Lou
05 Travel Supreme Envoy

[Vegas1]

Rut Ro , not what I wanted to hear! According to the tech who welded it, the head was welded to the frame, then he went around it again with a second weld. The original failure was most likely a result of the slide being out of alignment. Since it is now properly aligned, hopefully it will hold up, considering this was the center ram, and there are still two outside rams to share the load.

[jwmII]

Why is everybody hung up on grade 8 bolts? They are not always the best choice just because they are the hardest or shiniest or because others think they are the be all to end all solution. Other grades of bolts would not be made and used if that were the case. Other grades are not made and used because they might be cheaper either. Grade 8 bolts hold up well under tension and in some cases under compression but are not recognized as a good solution for use under shear. Frequently a lesser grade like a grade 5 bolt is used in shear and must be properly torqued. If loosened after being in service it is then best replaced and torqued to the proper specification as the softer bolt will stretch and becomes increasingly less effective with repeated uses.

The weld repair shown in the accompanying pictures is questionable and seems to lack any kind of decent penetration where it joins the structural steel. This is a fix that will probably be revisited many times in the future.

[wildmanbaker]

It doesn't look all that bad. Depending on how much room there was to get into for the actual welding, and overhead to boot. If it fails, it will be just below the bolt head. I know I have done a lot worse looking welds in my day, and they held just as good as the "Joe Magee" looking welds.

[sailor_lou]

I agree, it looks like a MIG weld and not a very good one at that. I am also surprised they recommended welding a Grade 8 bolt. Grade 8 bolts are made by heat treating high carbon steel material to achieve a specific strength. If improperly welded you can produce a hardened zone, which can become brittle. After adding heat the characteristics of the materials change and a grade 8 bolt is really no longer a grade 8 bolt. Hopefully there is still sufficient margin in the materials to maintain the bolts integrity. I would just keep an eye on it for cracks and/or breakage.

Lou
05 Travel Supreme Envoy

[RayChez]

I agree that the welder was not very good at laying a bead down around the bolt. The idea they used will work IF done right. There are many different types of welding wire or rods that can be used. Every thing from stainless steel to regular wire welding with a Mig welding machine. Keep an eye on it and get some kind of warranty for the work done.

[Vegas1]

Moderator: Please delete double photo post. Thanks!

[Vegas1]

Today I picked up the coach from the dealer. They replaced the bolts with Grade 8 and welded them to the frame per Winnebago a Factory advice. The slide was also re-aligned. Not the prettiest weld joint, but I will just keep my fingers crossed when moving the slide. Thank you all for your suggestions and support.

[-Gramps-]

Is there room for two bolts? Seems to me if one is not strong enough than add a second one.

[Mote]

If they could drill out the original bolt head, could they weld a nut to the bottom of top channel instead of the new bolt? Then insert a new bolt from the bottom ?
This way you are not welding the bolt and weakening it.

[427435]

Bad design to put a bolt in bending. They should only be used for clamp loading (bolt in tension) unless the load is very minimal.

[Kayteg1]

With the additional explanation this confirms my first guess that break was result of improper technique.
Grade 8 bolts should not be welded unless proper warming up technique is applied.
Wrong design to start and looks like Winnebago does not have good fix for it.
I would tend to agree with other suggestion to just put additional nut without a weld, but hard to say if the space could be an issue.
Welded high-tension bolts are not easy to cut with blade and not easy to drill.
Grinder might be only good tool, but than you need good access and protection from sparks.

[Vegas1]

Drilling out the hole and inserting a new grade 8 bolt would be a great idea, but due to the tight space, I don't think you will find a right angle drill small enough and powerful enough to fit in the small space. The photos were close-up shots and the work space is tighter than the pictures depict. Plus the head of the bolt that sheared was welded to the frame, making it even more difficult.

[George_Beggs]

You could tack a wire to the top side of the bolt ( like Blue Ox does to the nuts on their base plates). Then you just bend the wire so the bolt can be aligned with the hole and drop it in. Use red Locktite on the nut.
How do you plan to remove the broken bolt heads if they are welded in?