Interesting E450 Problem

[Lumpty]

Never heard of this occurring, but according to my dealer it is a frequent issue, that at least happened to me 20 miles from home at the end of a 2500 mile trip, because otherwise we'd have been stranded a few days.

Accelerating out of a toll booth towards an offramp, right at the 1-2 shift point, my previously anvil reliable 2010 chassis E450 V10/5R110 lost drive, or at least nothing above idle creep. Lit up the wrench light on the dash. Crawled up the flyover off-ramp, coasted in neutral down, and then limped it with flashers blinking on the shoulder 3 miles to the nearest Ford dealer.

They wanted nothing to do with it, but did call me a tow, and while the wrecker got there, confirmed that my local in town dealer would take it. Given it happened right at a shift, I was thinking transmission. After we got dropped, and I was getting things out of it and preparing to rewinterized there in the lot, a tech ran the code reader and said there was no signal from the throttle pedal. Hmmmn. Vehicles these days are all drive-by-wire, and apparently the electric rheostat in the pedal went kaplooey.

Telling the story, one of my racing friends shared he had the same thing happen in a F250, and was able to limp it to a dealer via using the cruise control buttons as a hand throttle. Wish I'd thought of that and it would have saved me $400 and a trip on the hook. The pedal assembly replacement part was $360, and two hours of labor, which along with other incidentals made for a $660 tab.

$1000+ for a relatively simple part that used to be a cable.....

[suprz]

I have gotten into a customer's Class c to move it and the battery was dead, i used the boost button and started the coach, it started and the check engine light came on, and when I tried to rev the engine nothing happened, the engine did not respond to any gas pedal input. Then without warning, and without any gas pedal input, the engine revved to the moon! I had to shut the engine off to prevent damage. Once i tried to start the engine again all was well... So for the OP, yes these things are fly by wire

[ron_dittmer]

j-d wrote:
If you have a Ford with the OHC heads on a 4.0 V6, be warned about that engine's longevity. One camshaft drive chain is at the REAR of the engine. Engine, maybe Transmission, has to come out to replace that "pack" of Chain, Tensioners, etc. Job will cost more than the value of the vehicle. Anything north of 100,000 would make me nervous. Explorer, Sport Trac, Ranger... The 4.0 push rod engine is OK.

Where I volunteer in a "CARS" ministry in our church, we get a fair amount of decent looking Ford Rangers. That dang 4.0L engine is always the reason they get donated. You are 100% correct concerning that engine j-d. The cost to get the engine right is more than the vehicle is worth. I would never purchase any Ford vehicle with that engine.

The 3.8L-V6 was another BIG looser with a very common head gasket problem. Our ministry received so many with lots anti-freeze in the engine oil. The engine was fine as long as the cooling system worked. If the water pump failed or a hose popped and the owner continued driving, the engine could not handle getting over-heated at all.

I personally loved Ford's 3.0-V6 engine that went into many different Ford vehicles, from the Taurus to the Ranger. That was a winner.

Ford's big winner is the V10 in motor homes. It is one exceptionally good engine, especially since their 4th or 5th year (around 2003) when they increased the amount of threads in the heads for the spark plugs.

[pauldub]

I'm not Gary, but my Scan Gage will read codes too.

[pnichols]

Gary,

What OBDII reader do you recommend?

Thanks ... in advance!

[garyhaupt]

Matt_Colie wrote:
To me (a refugee from the Detroit development labs) that this is a real good reason to carry an inexpensive OBDII reader in the tool kit.

Matt

I'm often surprised how many don't have one. If nothing else, one can clear codes and get along to a shop.


Gary Haupt

[pnichols]

Boy, now I'm getting even more paranoid after reading this thread about a whole bunch of stuff that can leave you stranded with a Ford E-Series based Class C chassis ... I'm beginning to think there might be a national conspiracy going on to:

1. Keep us all traveling with multiple ERS memberships, and on only main highways, and camping at only commercial campgrounds.

AND/OR

2. Convince us all to own only Mercedes/Sprinter based Class C motorhomes.

Us Ford E350/E450 Class C owners who might want to boondock camp and/or explore out in the middle of nowhere better be keeping our fingers crossed at all times.

P.S. About what model year did the E350/E450 series start using drive-by-wire throttles instead of good old steel cable throttles?

[j-d]

Daughter had a 2005 Ford Exporer (4.0 V6 with R55W transmission) and when it got below the minimum cruise speed, the engine would quit. Apparently the Throttle Plate Idle Position is electronically controlled by PCM/Cruise and Cruise at low speed confused that.

Oh, If you have a Ford with the OHC heads on a 4.0 V6, be warned about that engine's longevity. One camshaft drive chain is at the REAR of the engine. Engine, maybe Transmission, has to come out to replace that "pack" of Chain, Tensioners, etc. Job will cost more than the value of the vehicle. Anything north of 100,000 would make me nervous. Explorer, Sport Trac, Ranger... The 4.0 push rod engine is OK.

[Hank85713]

On a similar note, last summer our 2011 E450 did not want to start after stopping to refuel. Also it developed a hung starter while trying to start. Anyhow finally got it to start and we left the station. As I merged onto I 40 from I 17 it died. Coasted to side of road and went thru the same ordeal of no start/hung starter. Finally started again got to the campground (left running) and got a campsite. Would not start again, called for roadside assist. Now there were no codes showing and he indicated a bad fuel pump as the culprit. Anyhow ended up changing the TPS at the intake, and had to drive to Phx to get a fuel pump (4th july weekend). They replaced the fuel pump, replaced the started lock on the steering column, the tps, they said the battery was weak also. Went and R&Rd all still no start! Another day in the shop (had a laptop with ford trouble shooting so knew what was going on) Played with a lot of stuff. Finally a tech came out and said lets try something. Went over to a E450 with a bad trans and pulled the Fuel Pump Relay hooked it in and viola all worked as it was supposed to. So not all things are simple anymore and even with all the scan tools somethings remain invisible. BTW a fuel pump is around $550, a good maint free battery around $200, the relay depending on where you buy is $65 (dealer, orielly) and $250 off internet, autozone so be a wise shopper. I now carry a spare relay just in case. Trouble shooting of fuel pump found no issues but they tore it apart trying to figure out if it could be repaid just in case! It cost around around $1900 total and as a FYI GS extended coverage covered around $1400 after my deductible and some non-essential items.

[Photomike]

Sorry to hear what you went through, will file that one in the back of my mind!

[Matt_Colie]

To me (a refugee from the Detroit development labs) that this is a real good reason to carry an inexpensive OBDII reader in the tool kit.

Matt

[docsouce]

Ok. Thanks Ron for the info. I'm going to mess around with that today. Very good to know.

[ron_dittmer]

docsouce wrote:
How do you use the cruise control as a hand throttle? First time I have ever heard of that.

You need to be moving at the minimum speed for cruise to function which is around 35 MPH, turn on the cruise control, and use the cruise "accelerate" and "set" buttons.

Lumpty, Thanks for letting us know. If it happens to me, I'll already know what to do to get to a repair facility, and what to tell the mechanic to replace. I suppose because I display TPS on my ScanGauge-II all the time, that number would drop way down.

[j-d]

What was that "Rheostat Thingy" called? I'd like to know more. Did Ford provide a Description and/or Part Number?

I can see how Cruise would help once underway. With Fly By Wire, Cruise only commands the throttle like you do when you press the Pedal. But Cruise doesn't work below about 25 MPH. How would we use Cruise to come up from standing still?

[docsouce]

Sometimes when taking a sharp right hand turn my engine acceleration goes flat. I have to push the accelerator pedal all the way to the floor to get a response. I brought it to 2 Ford dealerships and was told this is a common issue. PIA

How do you use the cruise control as a hand throttle? First time I have ever heard of that.