DINGHY TOWING

[treebender]

We purchased a 2010 Honda Fit sport with auto trans,because it was listed as towable the salesman showed us on page 238 Honda owners manual this vehicle could be towed 4 wheels down all you had to do is run it thru the drill FOOT BRAKE ON SHIFT PARK DOWN TO N THEN DOWN TO D HOLD FOR FEW MINUTE'S then back to N LET IT RUN 4 MORE MINUTES IN N TURN OFF KEY TO ACC, THEN DO NOT TOW FASTER THEN 65 MPH EVER.STOP EVERY 8 HOURS AND REPEAT DRILL,, WE DID THIS DRILL EVERY 3 HOURS drove at 60 mph top speed AND ON A TRIP TO SEATTLE, WE BURNED THE AUTO TRANS UP COSTS $4665.88 to repair it, THREE TRANS REPAIR SHOPS TOLD ME THIS VEHICLES TRANS CANT BE TOWED HOPE THIS HELPS SOMEONE WHO WAS THINKING ON BUYING THIS TYPE OF VEHICLE.

[Joe-n-Doe]

We are original owners of a 2012 Fit Sport with automatic transmission, specifically purchased in April 2012 BECAUSE Honda told us it could be flat towed. We too have fallen victim to Honda America's decision not to honor their powertrain warranty.

Page 159 of the Owner's manual reads:

"Towing Your Vehicle
Your vehicle can be towed behind a motorhome

When Your Vehicle is Towed Behind a Motorhome
Perform the following procedure before towing your vehicle.

Automatic Transmission models
1. Check the transmission fluid level
> Make sure the fluid level is between the upper and lowermarks.
2. Start the engine.
3. Depress the brake pedal. Move the shift lever through all its positions.
4. Shift to D and hold for five seconds, then to N. Let engine run for three minutes, then turn it off.
5. Release the parking break.
6. Leave the ignition switch in ACCESSORY.
> Make sure the steering wheel does not lock.
7. Turn off all the electric devices. Do not use any accessory power sockets.
> This can prevent the batter from running down.

>>>Towing your Vehicle
Automatic transmission models
NOTICE
Failure to follow the recommended instructions exactly will result in severe automatic transmission damage. If you cannot shift the transmission or start the engine, your vehicle must be transported on a flat bed truck or trailer.

Do not exceed 65 mph (100km/h)

Consult your towing parts sales or rental agency if any other items are recommended or required for your towing situation.

Automatic Transmission Models
If you tow your vehicle behind a motorhome, the transmission fluid must be changed every 2 years or 30,000 miles (48,000 km), whichever comes first.

>>> When Your Vehicle is Towed Behind a Motorhome
Automatic transmission models
NOTICE
Severe transmission damage will occur if the vehicle is shifted from R to N and then towed with the drive wheels on the ground."

Page 160 reads:

"•Extended Towing
If you tow more than 8 hours in one day, you should repeat the "before towing your vehicle procedure" at least every 8 hours."

The remaining information on the page relates to removing the vehicle's 30 amp radio fuse to prevent the battery from running down.

Page 10 of the Honda Fit Warranties Manual reads:

"Your powertrain is covered for 5 years or 60,000 miles, whichever comes first."

Now having regurgitating what is written in the Honda Fit Owner's and Warranties Manuals, here is our story.

Our 2012 Honda Fit has been driven 27,361, is less than 5 years old, and still under warranty. We are currently in the San Diego area on a 6-week cross-country road trip. Our Fit started making weird noises that sounded like a fan belt slippage. A burnt rubber smell reinforced our suspicion. We drove to a nearby Jiffy Lube. The manager took it for a spin around the block. When he returned, he told me he thought the transmission was the problem. OBTW, no warning lights came on to indicate there was a problem and fluid levels were where they should have been.

On Monday, Sept. 26th, we towed the Fit to a San Diego area Honda dealership. After explaining our situation to the Service Tech, he aggressively confronted me asking "Who told you that you could flat tow your car?" I sensed he didn't believe me when I just as aggressively replied "Honda". I recited by memory the pre-tow procedures and warnings. It remained obvious he doubted me. As we finished up the paperwork, I noticed he had included an estimated cost. When I told him the car was still under warranty, he told me Honda would decided if the damage fell under warranty. While stowing our towing accessories, he came out recited the pre-tow procedures and skeptically asked me if I performed all the required procedures.

On the morning of the 27th, he called and informed me Honda America had declined to honor the warranty and claimed I must have done something wrong and that Honda America had the final word. I responded by telling him the courts and not Honda America will have the final word. I told him I wanted everything he was telling put into writing. He went on to inform me there was a replacement transmission in Los Angeles and if I gave the go ahead he was certain they could have me back on the road by week's end. I told him to proceed. To add insult to injury, he call me that afternoon to tell me Honda America was requiring me to post a $1,200 deposit on the old transmission's core that will be reimbursed 1) when it is received by Honda America and 2) only if it can be rebuilt. Think about it for a second; Honda is going to charge me $5,800 for parts and labor and then demand a ransom of $1,200 for something I will have paid for to be replaced!?!

Yesterday afternoon (the 29th), the Tech called to inform me the Fit was ready to be picked up. When we got to the dealership, the Tech told us the Service Manager wanted to talk to us. Both the Tech and Service Manager told us they were stunned that Honda America had declined to honor the warranty; especially since there was no proof we had done anything wrong to cause the problem. I told them I appreciated their sentiments and asked they inform Honda America that they have lost a customer for life and might lose other potential customers contemplating purchasing a Honda vehicle to tow behind their motorhome.

[DownTheAvenue]

soren wrote:


This one isn't real complicated. There is a very simple set of steps that I cut and pasted They are REQUIRED to indicate to the computer that you are about to flat tow the vehicle. The OP has explained (twice) that he does not follow those procedures. Honda says it can be flat towed, because that is how they designed the product, and oddly enough, there are thousands of owners that do so with no issue. You made the leap from a guy who destroyed his trans. by not following simple directions, to a manufacturer that builds a defective product.

You want to take a wild guess as to why most manufacturers have stepped away from offering vehicles that can be flat towed? Maybe it's got a wee bit to do with battling owners who refuse to follow simple directions, destroy vehicles, then think that 6-7 years after the product left the showroom, they need to be compensated?

AMEN!

[soren]

lanerd wrote:
Boy, that was one long sentence. :W

I think that even tho the car was out of warrantee, I would still contact Honda. If the manual says it can be towed four down and then it destroys the trans.... Sounds to me like you have a case. Might want to talk to your lawyer.

Ron

This one isn't real complicated. There is a very simple set of steps that I cut and pasted They are REQUIRED to indicate to the computer that you are about to flat tow the vehicle. The OP has explained (twice) that he does not follow those procedures. Honda says it can be flat towed, because that is how they designed the product, and oddly enough, there are thousands of owners that do so with no issue. You made the leap from a guy who destroyed his trans. by not following simple directions, to a manufacturer that builds a defective product.

You want to take a wild guess as to why most manufacturers have stepped away from offering vehicles that can be flat towed? Maybe it's got a wee bit to do with battling owners who refuse to follow simple directions, destroy vehicles, then think that 6-7 years after the product left the showroom, they need to be compensated?

[soren]

treebender wrote:
What I said was I start the car ,hold the brake on and shift from park to n then wait 1 minute then shift to d hold for a few seconds then shift back to n NO BRAKE IT IS HOOKED TO THE TOW BAR ATTACHED TO A 40 FT. DP LET IT RUN FOR 3 MORE MINUTES IN N Then turn keyoff to acc mode

OK, well that'a actually not what you said, in the least. But, it also makes it quite clear that you really have no interest in following Honda's directions on the subject. Which is apparently a decision that comes with a $4500 penalty. Good luck with that new trans. Hope you got the extended warranty.

[lanerd]

Boy, that was one long sentence. :W

I think that even tho the car was out of warrantee, I would still contact Honda. If the manual says it can be towed four down and then it destroys the trans.... Sounds to me like you have a case. Might want to talk to your lawyer.

Ron

[treebender]

What I said was I start the car ,hold the brake on and shift from park to n then wait 1 minute then shift to d hold for a few seconds then shift back to n NO BRAKE IT IS HOOKED TO THE TOW BAR ATTACHED TO A 40 FT. DP LET IT RUN FOR 3 MORE MINUTES IN N Then turn keyoff to acc mode

[soren]

The unanswered question is why does your original post detail a towing prep. process that is quite different than is shown in the owner's manual for your car?


The following is copied straight from the 2010 Fit manual, available online.

2. Start the engine.
3. Press on the brake pedal. Move
the shift lever through all its
positions.
4. Shift to the D position and hold for
5 seconds, then to N. Let the
engine run for 3 minutes, then turn
it off.
Severe transmission damage will occur
if the vehicle is shifted from reverse to
neutral and then towed with the drive
wheels on the ground.

If you are, as you describe, sitting in the car for four minutes, as you stand on the brake pedal, with the car in drive, you just might have answered your own question as to why the trans. grenaded. The steps are there to send a message to the computer that the thing is going to be towed. Just like the grave warnings to not go from reverse to N, I would suspect that holding the thing in drive for four minutes, instead of the required five seconds, probably isn't the greatest idea, and may be exactly why the thing failed.

[treebender]

First I will try and answer all the questions, The Honda has 42,005 total miles on it, the research we did all said this car can be towed 4 wheels down, with auto trans and doing the drill this isn't our first tow car we have had 4 all with no problems towed to Alaska from Florida 5 times no problem two were Saturns two were Honda ody. We don't mind the drill, The trans shops said they would put it in writing if I was to go back to Honda, the car is not under warranty so didn't think Honda would care , However you have gave me a good tip that it is worth fighting for so I sent off a letter and copy of the invoice and a copy of the owners manual,, ill let you all know what Honda will do about it, As far as the post where you towed it 20,000 miles with no problem, Good Luck.

[SoCalDesertRid1]

That's alot of funky, complicated carp to go through to tow that car. I would have read that and said, no thanks, and moved on to something else that's simple to tow.

[rr2254545]

treebender wrote:
We purchased a 2010 Honda Fit sport with auto trans,because it was listed as towable the salesman showed us on page 238 Honda owners manual this vehicle could be towed 4 wheels down all you had to do is run it thru the drill FOOT BRAKE ON SHIFT PARK DOWN TO N THEN DOWN TO D HOLD FOR FEW MINUTE'S then back to N LET IT RUN 4 MORE MINUTES IN N TURN OFF KEY TO ACC, THEN DO NOT TOW FASTER THEN 65 MPH EVER.STOP EVERY 8 HOURS AND REPEAT DRILL,, WE DID THIS DRILL EVERY 3 HOURS drove at 60 mph top speed AND ON A TRIP TO SEATTLE, WE BURNED THE AUTO TRANS UP COSTS $4665.88 to repair it, THREE TRANS REPAIR SHOPS TOLD ME THIS VEHICLES TRANS CANT BE TOWED HOPE THIS HELPS SOMEONE WHO WAS THINKING ON BUYING THIS TYPE OF VEHICLE.

I burned one up in Jan 2011 in my 2009 Fit - Honda said it was my fault cost me right at $4000 - I towed it before and after with no trouble. I towed it just over 34,000 miles in total

[paulcardoza]

Unfortunately, the only thing that matters here is that the OP's Fit is outside the warrant period, so it's pay the $4600 or junk it.

[soren]

Trackrig wrote:
I would never buy or tow a vehicle that you had to go through that goat rope on. Buy a Jeep.

Bill

If you spend more that fifteen seconds in a Honda product, while getting the trans. and ignition key set to flat tow, you are wasting time. If that's a "goat rope" I hope you never encounter anything really difficult in your travels.

[soren]

I'm pretty sure that the OP has little interest in how wonderful anybody's Jeep product is. I would also question the OP's understanding of the prep. procedure for towing, as it bears little resemblance to what Honda specifies for two CRVs we have towed, or the same info. I located on flat towing the 2010 Fit automatic, while doing a quick search. I would recommend re-reading the manual and following the process carefully. Foot on brake, cycle shifter from P to low, then up to D. Hold brake and keep in D for FIVE SECONDS. Shift to N, let vehicle run for three minutes. If the vehicle is accidentally shifted from R to N it WILL cause damage to the trans. I just traded our 2013 in with 67K on the ODO and another 45K+ miles of being towed. The trans was serviced at 30K intervals, and it had zero issues. The OP is either unlucky, or damaged the trans. by accidentally doing the process wrong.

[Trackrig]

Pangaea Ron wrote:

Trackrig wrote:
I would never buy or tow a vehicle that you had to go through that goat rope on. Buy a Jeep.

Bill

Although comments about Jeeps are interesting, they are not related to this thread.

I had a 2000 Jeep GC that lost it's transfer case and it was blamed on towing it 4 wheels down.

I now have a 2014 Honda CR-V that tows well, and the process is similar to the 2010 Fit, and is not problematic.

Don't forget, the Saturn Outlook isn't related either then........

Sure mentioning Jeeps is relevant - it's one of the easiest vehicles to tow and the OP was having problems with what he chose. Jeeps have problems occasionally, but I would say whoever blamed the transfer case failure on towing four down didn't know what they were talking about - unless it wasn't in neutral when it was being towed.

Bill