No brakes on trailer

[crazyro]

Hey guys and gals. Picked up a new to us travel trailer and can't get brakes to work at all. Had to be extra careful towing it. Plugged in, truck shows "Trailer not connected. Check brake wiring." message. Squeezing the brake controller to send full charge does nothing. (factory brake controller) Cleaned 7 pin connector with electrical contact cleaner, fine grade sandpaper. Lights all work. Checked any wiring I could. Didn't see any wires connected to frame so I'm assuming ground is done via ball? Battery is brand new. When I pull the breakaway switch, there's no whine, no sound, nothing from brakes. I'm not in a place where I can take wheels off, but the only other thing I can think of is that maybe magnets are shot or seized and/or causing a short? Trailer sat for about a year and a half. I may just have to take it to a shop and let them check it out. Anything I could check? Camper is a 2002 Cedar Creek (35 RLS).

TIA.

[JaxDad]

One of the best electric trailer brake tester I've ever used is ....... a selaed beam headlight bulb.

Put two short wires on the bulbs spade lugs and first put it between the TV's brake lead and the ground pin. When first connected you should get a flicker then it goes out. Next have a helper manually apply brakes from inside the TV, it should fade to full brightness. If it does the TV & its wiring are fine.

Next put the bulb between the trailers brake connection and the TV's brake line with a jumper between ground pins. Repeat the above test. If the bulb fails to light, or lights but differently than the first test you can start digging further into it.

[BobsYourUncle]

Looking at my link above, I see the ratings are poor.
But check around and find one similar. Many are AC only. Have to have one that works with 12V DC.

[MFL]

crazyro wrote:
Thank you guys for all your help. I truly appreciate every single one of you. (and I never felt criticized at all)

My plan of action:

1. Go hook up to friend's trailer tonight and see if truck is happy with it. If it is not, then 7 pin or brake controller in truck is having issues. (I've thought about getting an extension and trying the in-bed 7 pin connector for 5ers).
2. If #1 checks out, hook up to my trailer, pull the breakaway pin and drive forward. If nothing happens, then brakes on trailer need attention.
3. Jack trailer up and check brake system.
4. If I can't find the issue, drink another beer or two, throw my hands up and take it to auto shop (where owner is an RVer and has extra knowledge).

Much appreciated again!

Good plan, hope you find it! Even if you have to go with 4, at least you can enjoy the beer, and know you did your best!! 🙂

Good luck,

Jerry

[BobsYourUncle]

Rather than go to the effort of hooking up another trailer to try out, could you just test to see whether the voltage is there or not?

We all know that if the brakes are working, there is up to 12V present in the brake feed wire. No voltage, no brakes.

Perhaps you could get a 12V DC induction test meter such as This one.
Non invasive, you don't have to poke holes in the wires and find a ground to get a reading.
Leave all lights off, apply full braking from the controller, then go to the pigtail connector and look for a reading before and after the pigtail. The ignition key would likely have to be on, or the truck running. The tail lights need to be off for this. I don't know if your Ram puts them on by default or not, or if just the DRLs come on.

This little device has a feature that will show an internal breakage in the wire when you move it along.
It either has a reading, or it doesn't. You can easily check everywhere for voltage in the line by just putting the tip of the tester on the wire.

It's under 10 bucks, if you have Prime, you can get one in a day.
I think I may just order one myself!

And again, good luck to you, and have another beer for us! :B

[Sjm9911]

Good advice above. Addtionally, as someone said, check behind the breaks for the wire conection. Sometimes they pull loose or you can re do the conections. Next is if the wire goes through the axel, check to see if the wire is worn through when it enters and exits the axel. I had a problem on mine and it was easier to re run the wires from the front toung box. Its not hard and is probably easier then chasing down a broken wire. But first thing is to seperate weather its the TV or the TT. You should have a ground to the frame somewhere on the trailor. Its not a bad idea to clean it up.

[crazyro]

Thank you guys for all your help. I truly appreciate every single one of you. (and I never felt criticized at all)

My plan of action:

1. Go hook up to friend's trailer tonight and see if truck is happy with it. If it is not, then 7 pin or brake controller in truck is having issues. (I've thought about getting an extension and trying the in-bed 7 pin connector for 5ers).
2. If #1 checks out, hook up to my trailer, pull the breakaway pin and drive forward. If nothing happens, then brakes on trailer need attention.
3. Jack trailer up and check brake system.
4. If I can't find the issue, drink another beer or two, throw my hands up and take it to auto shop (where owner is an RVer and has extra knowledge).

Much appreciated again!

[cummins2014]

Gdetrailer wrote:

cummins2014 wrote:


I agree its not a grounding issue, but it was worth pursuing, once I realized his lights work then its not the grounding, but we all kind of tried trouble shooting to try ,and help the OP , no need for criticism .

I am no expert ,but its simple wiring, and I have wired brakes, lights etc on trailers that I have fabricated ,and its not rocket science.

Not "criticizing", but I notice that everyone ALWAYS jumps on the "bad ground bandwagon" as the very first item to check and that has been pointed out multiple times muddying the waters.

Good troubleshooting requires how to break down the problem into smaller easier chunks.

Braking it down into two chunks helps greatly..

Chunk one, the truck.

Chunk number two, the trailer.

You can switch another truck into the picture with known good wiring and controller..

OR just pull the breakaway pin and drive forward..

ALL wheels should lock and slide.. No lock and slide then the issue is the trailer side..

Wheels lock and slide, then the issue is the TRUCK side..

Breakaway system bypasses the truck and controller and applies full on board battery voltage to the brake magnets causing the wheels to lock..

You now have cut your search area in half with one simple check.

Its been awhile since I have wired brakes on a trailer I've built. The one I did had tandem axles , it was an ATV trailer ,and I only bought one axle with brakes ,and the other without. I jumped one wire across to the other side ,and ran the blue wire to the plug, and I ran the other two coming off the brakes to ground on the frame each side. Plus when I ran the rest of the wires I also ran a ground wire to the frame coming off the plug. My question ,and I have to assume those brakes don't work if Their ground wires are broke or loose ,and not grounding . AlthoughI have wired a separate ground to the trailer from the plug ??

[Gdetrailer]

cummins2014 wrote:


I agree its not a grounding issue, but it was worth pursuing, once I realized his lights work then its not the grounding, but we all kind of tried trouble shooting to try ,and help the OP , no need for criticism .

I am no expert ,but its simple wiring, and I have wired brakes, lights etc on trailers that I have fabricated ,and its not rocket science.

Not "criticizing", but I notice that everyone ALWAYS jumps on the "bad ground bandwagon" as the very first item to check and that has been pointed out multiple times muddying the waters.

Good troubleshooting requires how to break down the problem into smaller easier chunks.

Braking it down into two chunks helps greatly..

Chunk one, the truck.

Chunk number two, the trailer.

You can switch another truck into the picture with known good wiring and controller..

OR just pull the breakaway pin and drive forward..

ALL wheels should lock and slide.. No lock and slide then the issue is the trailer side..

Wheels lock and slide, then the issue is the TRUCK side..

Breakaway system bypasses the truck and controller and applies full on board battery voltage to the brake magnets causing the wheels to lock..

You now have cut your search area in half with one simple check.

[cummins2014]

Gdetrailer wrote:

crazyro wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:
If you follow the 7 pin cable back to the trailer, it will eventually terminate in a box near the trailer box on the tongue.

All grounds are supposed to terminate at that point and one ground wire from that box will run to the frame of the trailer.

I opened up that box last night looking for any stray wires or anything that didn't look right. There are no wires going out from that box to the frame. I wonder if that could be something I should add?

No need to add or modify as long as there IS a ground connection from trailer to vehicle via the 7 pin cable..

You can view a wiring diagram of the 7 pin connection HERE

Your trailer to tow vehicle cable should have a ground wire which should be WHITE.

The trailer brakes ground AND trailer lighting wires and one wire to the frame wire MUST connect to that white wire. The frame ground wire may have been done elsewhere like at the converter or battery.

The trailer brake positive wire MUST connect to the BLUE colored wire of the trailer to tow vehicle cable.

I honestly highly doubt it is "ground issue", if you were having a "grounding issue" you WILL be having issues with your stop/turn lights working incorrectly (like one brake light going out when stopping or opposite light quits using turn signals)..

I think the "grounding issue" brought up is a "red herring" sending you off down a "bunny trail" wasting your time.

The brake grounding must be done via the wiring running from the brakes all the way to the front of the trailer and back to the truck, this IS important.

Do not "add" ground wires to the frame at the axles, the ground wire IS already installed and runs up to the tongue.

See first diagram from Dexter axle..

HERE

HERE is a good writeup from Dexter on electric brakes, how they work and basic troubleshooting procedures..

I agree its not a grounding issue, but it was worth pursuing, once I realized his lights work then its not the grounding, but we all kind of tried trouble shooting to try ,and help the OP , no need for criticism .

I am no expert ,but its simple wiring, and I have wired brakes, lights etc on trailers that I have fabricated ,and its not rocket science.

[crazyro]

wnjj wrote:

If you want to confirm you have a ground connection through the 7-pin connector, plug the trailer into the truck but without the hitch dropped onto the ball. If the lights work, you must have a ground wire.

Ah, that makes perfect sense. I actually did and all lights worked. So I won't be chasing the ground issue.

[crazyro]

Beaker wrote:

crazyro wrote:
I'm really thinking it's the camper as our previous one was fine (well, in a couple of instances it took the truck a few minutes to realize it was there so maybe the controller IS starting to act up). Argh.

Not saying that your problem is the same but everything is fine until it isn't.
Maybe I missed it but have you hooked up to another camper yet?

You have not missed it. Friend couldn't make it happen tonight. We'll try tomorrow. Thank you for checking.

[Beaker]

crazyro wrote:
I'm really thinking it's the camper as our previous one was fine (well, in a couple of instances it took the truck a few minutes to realize it was there so maybe the controller IS starting to act up). Argh.

Not saying that your problem is the same but everything is fine until it isn't.
Maybe I missed it but have you hooked up to another camper yet?

[wnjj]

crazyro wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:
If you follow the 7 pin cable back to the trailer, it will eventually terminate in a box near the trailer box on the tongue.

All grounds are supposed to terminate at that point and one ground wire from that box will run to the frame of the trailer.

I opened up that box last night looking for any stray wires or anything that didn't look right. There are no wires going out from that box to the frame. I wonder if that could be something I should add?

If you want to confirm you have a ground connection through the 7-pin connector, plug the trailer into the truck but without the hitch dropped onto the ball. If the lights work, you must have a ground wire.

[Cummins12V98]

They did an upgrade to my 15’s controller. Was not a recall!

[crazyro]

spoon059 wrote:

What year is your Ram? I know that Ram had a TSB out for their brake controller (IBC) for some years of the Gen 4.

"Integrated trailer brake control nodule"

Throw your VIN in this and see if the TSB applies to you. https://www.nhtsa.gov/recalls

Otherwise, start playing with your brake settings. Change it from light trailer to heavy trailer, or heavy trailer to light trailer. Adjust the gain on it. See if those settings change anything. Whenever I get a new trailer, I take it to an open/empty area and test the brake controller at about 25-30 mph. Using the manual slider, I activate the brakes and see what happens. The goal is to get the trailer to apply just enough brake force to quickly stop me, without locking up the wheels. That is how I adjust my brake settings.

Best of luck. My IBC is great on my Ram, but I've heard that some people have problems with theirs. Worst case scenario, replace it with a nice Tekonsha P3 for $120 and keep on trucking.

2017. My truck is not part of the recall. I have monkeyed with the darn controller in all kinds of ways. There was no bite at all and truck never recognized the camper. I'm really thinking it's the camper as our previous one was fine (well, in a couple of instances it took the truck a few minutes to realize it was there so maybe the controller IS starting to act up). Argh.