Trouble with California

[pitch]

Ag. Check points;we all know understand and tolerate them,never a problem.
Couple of weeks ago we were heade to redwood. National forest from Grants Pas Oregon.
Ag check ahead, ok I fall into line with everyone else,multiple lanes,cars trucks,other rv,s. Everyone pauses about thirty seconds and moves on. Normal right?
My turn, she looks at my NY tags,Have you any fresh fruits or vegetables on board?"
"No we Don,t"
"w
When was the last time this vehicle was in Ny?"
"About 8or9weeks ago."

She then grabs a flashlight and inspection miror and gives the undercarriage of both truck and trailer a thorough going over. She then does a second tour inspecting the roof area.
I was quite surprised,but oh well not an imposition.
"I would like to inspect the interior"

"Not with out a warrant"
"Sir Weare trying to protect our agricultural resources"

"I understand that,bbut you are not entering my trailer without a warrant !"

She gave me a look that could kill,and entered her both and made a phone call.

Minute is so later she comes out,shoves a handful of invasive critter literature into my hand and said,"move on"

Has anyone else been subjected to such nonsense,or did this inspector just have a bone for New Yorkers?

[am1958]

I find it interesting that, largely, those who are so enthralled by protecting their natural resources are also those that believe that globalization is the direction humanity should go.

The more you open your locality up to global resources the more you risk your locality.

Not a poke at California but fifty years ago if a farmer did things wrong and sent out Romaine Lettuce that was infected with a life threatening bacteria his customer base was maybe a few hundred people. Earlier this year there was a nationwide recall on Romaine Lettuce that was produced by a California based grower. Over 300 million people were potentially in danger.

It's great for California that it is the food basket for the USA but it sucks if you are a victim of the failure of big business' policy of centralization. It's time to realize that centralization is dangerous and we need to step back a little and understand that if there's a single producer of anything there's a single point of failure.

[JRscooby]

bpounds wrote:
For those worried about probable cause violations, you should be more concerned with PC violations by game wardens, if you hunt or fish. Merely the act of hunting or fishing opens you up to warrantless searches of your vehicle including trailers and RVs. I pretty much link AG and DFW together, as far as what they are concerned with, namely, protecting our natural resources.

LOL. Bet you never went thru a "Roadside Safety Inspection" in a CMV.

[bpounds]

For those worried about probable cause violations, you should be more concerned with PC violations by game wardens, if you hunt or fish. Merely the act of hunting or fishing opens you up to warrantless searches of your vehicle including trailers and RVs. I pretty much link AG and DFW together, as far as what they are concerned with, namely, protecting our natural resources.

[bpounds]

Turtle n Peeps wrote:
So there is several things going on here. I will try to clear up a few of them....

I appreciate the info from someone who seems to be knowledgeable.

I particularly appreciate the part about AG inspectors not being LEO. I live in CA, so of course I have been through the kiosk dozens if not hundreds of times. I'm rarely inconvenienced by anything other than a question or two. But do become concerned as I approach these, when I've been on a hunting trip for example. Will they check my trailer? Will they want to see my guns, and all the registration **** that can go along with that? Hasn't been a problem thus far.

But a couple of anecdotes.

The AG people may not be LEO, but at certain times LEO will man the same station and conduct their own business. Once I was stopped and asked the normal question about where I had been, to which I replied Wyoming. Can't recall if I might have said "hunting in WY", but currently older and wiser and would definitely NOT add anything like that these days. Anyway, they pointed me toward a secondary inspection, where they checked my WY hunting docs, inspected my Deer. And eventually all was well and sent on my way. It was a pain in the butt to dig that stuff out at the time. Long ago of course.

The AG is concerned about more than just bugs on fruits and veggies. These days I would not try to bring an unprocessed Deer or Elk into the state. Ungulates carry their own diseases, and we don't want that in CA either. Firewood is an issue they are involved with as well.

A friend of mine was passing through the AG kiosk one year, and happened to have an apple with him. He was from CA, and the apple was purchased in CA, but carried out of state and then returned. He was honest about that, and they advised him that he could not bring the apple into the state, so he sat there and ate it on the spot. He was the type who would pare his apple with a pocket knife bite by bite, and I think they all got a bit of a kick out of it.

My biggest complaint, and it's just a joke more than anything, is that they sit in their booth at times just idly waving every single vehicle through. I guess it is a period of low risk or something. But why we're paying them to do that, instead of printing up a sign, just feels like a big waste of taxpayer treasure.

[Powertour]

These ag stations are typically so full of derp it's unreal. For instance, just south of Las Vegas on the I-15 you will hit the NV/CA border & just beyond that a CA Ag Inspection station. It's a total joke as the vast majority of the fruits & veggies sold in Vegas come into Vegas from CA. They're not protecting anything, just wasting money & hassling the public. Commercial vehicle inspections for produce are one thing, stopping Joe bag-o-donuts is something else entirely.

Oregon story: Friend of mine buys some fresh cherries at a roadside stand somewhere around the Columbia River part of the state. Travels only a few miles south of that point & runs into a Ag Station. Friend tells them he just bought some cherries right up the road.... they demand he hand over the cherries.... WTF. Friend opens his door, puts bag of cherries on the ground, & promptly smashes the you know what out of them.... then hands them over. BRILLIANT on his part as you just know this inspector's brother in law is the cherry seller up the road & the same cherries get sold multiple times after they're confiscated.

[Yosemite_Sam1]

Ozlander wrote:
Somebody said something about the agent trowing away a dead flower and an apple.
Trowing something in the trash doesn't keep the bugs out does it?

The "trash" bag looks like sealable. But, of course, who can prevent the apples from being taken home? Just to feed into anyone's condescension, suspicious nature or paranoia.

[Acampingwewillg]

I don't want to rain on anyone's parade but the whole idea of the checkpoints is the mere appearance of a "Random" search! Its extremely evident from this Topic that many do not know the "power's" that an AG inspector has, whether they have any or not. The 5 mile warning that a checkpoint is ahead is enough in many cases to cause uneasiness within a vehicle full of people. That's the whole idea...that's the reason, in many cases, the checkpoint is just a wave through or not manned at all.

While our friend from NY didn't wave his right's, another unsuspecting traveler may not be so savy and allow such a search and in doing so, will make onlookers think twice! We all realize its a deterrent rather than catch all inspection..IMHO!

[JRscooby]

Tvov wrote:

I would assume stopping at an Ag check point would involve an inspection of the interior of a vehicle / trailer like a camper, as it would be common to carry some fruit in a camper (at least, we usually have some).

You "understand and tolerate them"... but you were surprised at a request to inspect the interior of your camper? What is the point of just asking if there are fruits and veg on board?

IMHO, to ask if somebody is carrying fruit is not bad, but if told "No." why would you want to inspect the interior of the vehicle? The asking to do so is calling me a liar. I think a better plan would be hand the driver a list of prohibited items, ask him to spend a minute with the list, and inventory their vehicle to be sure before you proceed. But that would limit the power of the uniform, hurt their feelings.

Related question... if it is common at these Ag check points to just wave vehicles through, or just ask about fruit and veg without an inspection, what is the point of them?

And another related question... with these "wave through inspection" stations, have they ever caught and/or stopped any bugs?

As I said, I know very little about this Ag inspection stuff.

I would think that most people would know what not to carry, so the inspection station is just a reminder.
Have they stopped a bug? Likely, because people know not to carry.

Yosemite Sam1 wrote:

And their lines of questioning when I've pulling an RV is to ask where we've been -- perhaps assessing whether we've passed through contaminated areas if there is a need for closer inspection --- if we carry fruits or plants and finally if we carry firewood. And once, I had a shrink wrap unused firewood and the inspector simply asked me to go to the sides and off load it.

No hassle, no drama.

I think it would make many feel better if when they realize they are carrying something they shouldn't it could be placed where outbound motorist could pick it up.
Once I stopped in the lot, but before I got to Fla check shack. Few minutes later, when I got to booth, first question was "Why?" Had lettuce on sandwich. He laughed. "What are you hauling?" Have no idea. He started to bull up, I pointed to the Red Cross taped to door. "Drive careful"

[BadgerMcAdams]

rk911 wrote:

Yosemite Sam1 wrote:

rk911 wrote:

toedtoes wrote:

rk911 wrote:

Lwiddis wrote:
ksg, "probable cause" will get a warrant issued. The SC cases approving ag inspections don't need "probable cause" or a warrant. Its not a "search" but an "inspection." This is a PEST issue, not a criminal action...

taking the OP at his word...what kind of fruit and veggie inspection includes the under-chassis and roof of the RV? we've had Customs and Border Patrol checkpoints that didn't rise to that level.

Could it be that bugs tend to "hang on" in those places???

They just found two oriental fruit flies in San Joaquin. If they find 6 of them, it could mean the area is under quarantine for 9 months.

Bugs are a major disaster waiting to happen.

ok, i'll buy that. but if bugs are a major disaster waiting to happen then why aren't the ag inspection stations operated 24/7? we've crossed into CA on I-40 twice in the last few years both times on a weekday during 'normal' working hours and both times the ag station was closed. just wonderin'. if it's a money thing (and it always is) then either CA doesn't know how to prioritize or the disaster they're trying to avert is mostly hype.

And your point is?

i think my point is clear. if the bugs are THAT much of a pblm i'd think the ag insp. stations would be staffed 24/7/365.

And, if the problem was THAT bad, then they should institute a total vehicle fogging/wash rack that all vehicles entering California should go through. The vehicle would be sent through a car wash type spray system to coat the vehicle with a pesticide type spray, and if they REALLY want to get jiggy with it, they could then hit the interior with a pesticidal fog to ensure that no harmful insects are entering the state to possibly infect and destroy their agricultural system...

Just sayin'

[Ozlander]

Somebody said something about the agent trowing away a dead flower and an apple.
Trowing something in the trash doesn't keep the bugs out does it?

[Turtle_n_Peeps]

So there is several things going on here. I will try to clear up a few of them.

I have worked for CDFA (not as an Ag inspector) so I know how some of these things work. I'm also a Ca farmer....or was until Ca drove me out of business with regs and.......... 😞

#1. Do you have to stop at these Ag inspection stations? Answer, yes you do.

#2. Do you have to answer any questions? No you do not.

#3. Are Ag inspectors LEO? No they are not.

#4. Do Ag inspectors have arrest authority. No they do not.

#5. Can Ag inspectors call someone that does have arrest authority? Yes they can and have in the past.

#6. Can Ag inspectors inspect your vehicle without your permission? No they can not.
(the case YS quoted has nothing to do with this. In the case he quoted the LEO HAD probable cause. Just because you are traveling from one state to another does not give them PC.)

#7. Can Ag inspectors get a warrant to search your vehicle? They can try but it's super, super, super unlikely that a judge will sign off on it because you need PC FIRST!

In short, these "programs" are voluntary. If you want to participate, participate. If you don't want to participate, don't participate. By participate I mean go through searches and things like that.

In closing I find it odd that Ca politicians don't want a wall to keep out drugs and bad bug infested fruit and everything else, but want to check people coming in from other states for those things. :h :S

Here is a great video of a guy that knows his rights. This is a very funny video for me because the Ag inspector finally figures it out. 🙂
Anyway, enjoy.

[garyhaupt]

I am just tossing this out for my CDN brethren..do not ever refuse a request from any authority to do a look-see in the RV. That could see you tossed out of the country. And if not that, then a very expensive lawyer tab.

Never mind the YouTube stuff...if I were a resident and citizen of the US, I truly don't know how I would handle the stops, but as a visitor? C'mon in.

I want to think that I would say "not without a warrant" for my home, but in reality? I don't know if I have that.

Gary Haupt

[Yosemite_Sam1]

Deb and Ed M wrote:

pitch wrote:
I would have been no free than happy to do a u turn. California aim,t that big a deal. I answered her questions truthfully and completely, I was carrying no fruit no pests.

I suspect what they were looking for, were "hitchhikers". Like underneath your RV or on the roof.

I live on a lovely lake that is plagued with Aquatic Invasive Species. Nobody brought these things to our lake deliberately - they rode along on visitors' boats/trailers. As I travel the USA, I see the devastating effects of pine beetles on our forests - spread via campfire wood (among other ways). Maybe there's something in NY that California really wants to keep out of their state, hence their attention to your RV?

Not only would I have allowed an interior inspection - I would have offered a flashlight, some cold water and a sandwich.

Indeed, and I'm beginning to suspect it was the OP who showed some attitude.

I now remember I've gone through most if not all of these California check points and never once encountered a rude inspector.

And their lines of questioning when I've pulling an RV is to ask where we've been -- perhaps assessing whether we've passed through contaminated areas if there is a need for closer inspection --- if we carry fruits or plants and finally if we carry firewood. And once, I had a shrink wrap unused firewood and the inspector simply asked me to go to the sides and off load it.

No hassle, no drama.

[2012Coleman]

So how are your Ash trees doing up there in Michigan - no way some little bug could kill thousands of trees. Oh - I hear that those Asian Carp are good eatin.

[Lwiddis]

“I live on a lovely lake that is plagued with Aquatic Invasive Species”

A terrible problem. I wish I could help.