Are lithium batteries worth the cost?

[Avid_Fox]

I can carry two group 29s in my AF1150.

Are they worth it?

[Camper_Jeff___K]

Kayteg1 wrote:
When going camping, I am taking batteries from my sedans and boat.
No cost to me.
AGM batteries were design for upside down applications and are excelent for what they are design.
For camper use- it is just led-acid battery.

In defense of AGM, I switched to AGM in the belief that as they got older, there would be no crud build up between cells that could vibrate lose while driving along rough forest and backroads causing cells to short out. That has happened to me twice with the truck battery and twice with the TC batteries while using FLA batteries. I now have AGM all around, matching electrical characteristics, and never had another cell short out from vibration like driving lots of washboard gravel road. Just my 2 cents.

[Kayteg1]

When going camping, I am taking batteries from my sedans and boat.
No cost to me.
AGM batteries were design for upside down applications and are excelent for what they are design.
For camper use- it is just led-acid battery.

[theoldwizard1]

Don't Waste Your Money On Batteries - The Shocking Truth I Discovered When Testing RV Batteries

This is a 36 minute video comparing various battery chemistries and manufacturers (sorry, no SiO2). My "executive summary" is LiFePO4 is the winner because of their life expectancy and depth of discharge (down to near 0% SOC).

Good old FLA 5V golf cart batteries performed well and were the lowest cost, but also a much shorter lifespan.

The interesting footnote was, AGM are really not worth the additional cost unless you are willing to pay the premium price for no liquid !

[bighatnohorse]

It depends on what you mean by "worth it".
If you purchase lead acid batteries and take them back to the store where you bought them within the warranty time you may just find that they will give you new replacement batteries under warranty.
Costco did that for me and I understand that other stores do the same.

[moonlitsouls]

I just built a 280ah DIY Lithium phosphate battery for a total of $700 ,

1 x 100ah battle born goes for over $1000 so i got basically 3 of them for $700 fully built with the highest quality BMS , wires and lugs

Its fully programable and i can monitor/change settings using a bluetooth enabled app. If you're willing to take on that challenge you can save big. I am in the process now of sourcing another 280ah to double up on my bank giving me some serious boondocking capabilities with 560ah , upgrading the solar as well from 380 watts to almost 800w , should be fun

[mbloof]

The last time the #27 battery in my camper needed replacing, I went with a Battleborn. Here's my thinking:

- Lifetime cycles, while quality FLA's were rated at 300-900 lifetime charge/discharge cycles, the Battleborn was rated at +3000 cycles

- Capacity, the FLA's only have a usable %50, the Battleborn is nearly %100 usable capacity.

Charging - given the three possible charge sources, my solar controller had a LI setting compatible with the Battleborn, truck-2-camper charging was never really used (or upgraded to be useful) and the onboard Progressive Dynamics converter/charger was replaced with a LI compatible model (~$250).

To conclude, while the Battleborn cost ~2-3x what a quality FLA would cost, I believe it will last longer, have more capacity and be truly "maintenance free".


- Mark0.

[specta]

jimh425 wrote:

Should be a fun thread.

:B

[StirCrazy]

Avid Fox wrote:
I'm not sure I understand the charging setup.

My f350 has dual alternators that can deliver about 380 amps if needed. I already have giant charging cables back to the camper via a solenoid. Which work great BTW.

Do I need to limit the LI recharging to amp ratings and cable sizes, or just make sure the voltage is within range of 13.2 to 14.4? The Ford always delivers 14.4 to start, then backs off to 13.2 eventually when it senses they are fully charged. Will that work, or do I need something more fancy?

I would ut in a DC to DC charger. seeing you have dual altanators you can go with a larger one like a 60amp if your cables will handle it, but thats the best wy to charge the LFP batteries. you would also need to make sure your converter in your camper has a "lithium" setting if not just change it out for a charger section that does.

I dont know about down there but for the AH up here lithium is about the same cost as deicent high quality deep cycle batteries now (for the same usable capacity)

Steve

[theoldwizard1]

The big "win" on lithium batteries is that can be discarged down to near 0% SOC, repeatedly without damage. Lead acid should not be discharged below 50%, and for maximum life, not below 80%.

The second "win" is longevity. Any comparison between the two chemistries will take in to account that lithium batteries last 4 to 6 times (maybe more) longer.

Avid Fox wrote:
Do I need to limit the LI recharging to amp ratings and cable sizes, ... or do I need something more fancy?

Some lithium batteries have built in charge controllers. Bare cells (which are much cheaper) do not. For optimal battery charging from your vehicle, even with lead acid batteries, you should use a DC-DC charger.

[time2roll]

14.4 volts is fine for charging. Best to limit charging to 50% to 30% of capacity on a regular basis. So a 200 Ah battery should be charged at 100 amps or less. Not going to hurt to put it in and see what happens a few times. And of course check with what is recommended by the manufacturer.

[Avid_Fox]

I'm not sure I understand the charging setup.

My f350 has dual alternators that can deliver about 380 amps if needed. I already have giant charging cables back to the camper via a solenoid. Which work great BTW.

Do I need to limit the LI recharging to amp ratings and cable sizes, or just make sure the voltage is within range of 13.2 to 14.4? The Ford always delivers 14.4 to start, then backs off to 13.2 eventually when it senses they are fully charged. Will that work, or do I need something more fancy?

[time2roll]

If you need the power I believe they are worth it. I plan to build my own and save some money.

Something like this: https://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/30231150.cfm

[Avid_Fox]

jimh425 wrote:
It just depends on how far you want to draw your batteries down. Another option is to add batteries in the corner of your bed and connect them all together.

Should be a fun thread.

I have a sine wave inverter for electric blankets and coffee. I can get two nights out of the two batteries I have now. After that, it becomes iffy, and the fridge starts talking to me about low voltage...

Double that capacity would be awesome. LI batteries weight half as much as regular deep cycle also.

[jimh406]

It just depends on how far you want to draw your batteries down. Another option is to add batteries in the corner of your bed and connect them all together.

Should be a fun thread.