Buying a New TC Hauler

[NRALIFR]

I started the process today of replacing my 2010 F450 with a 2016 model. The Ford dealers here in Little Rock hardly ever have them though, and I had resigned myself to probably driving to Dallas in order to see and drive one.

My local dealer called me last week to let me know that they just got one in that someone else ordered, then backed out of. I figured I could at least look at it, drive it, and decide if I wanted to buy it or order one.

Turns out it was very close to the truck I had already built on Ford's site, and I even liked the color (Ruby Red). It has the black carpeting and cab accents which is what I wanted.







Both front seats are heated AND cooled! :C







This truck has a sunroof which I didn't want (sorta useless with a TC), a soft tonneau bed cover (not wanted), gooseneck/fifth-wheel prep (not needed now, but you never know about the future). It did NOT have upfitter switches in the dash, and I have a use for at least three of those. The dealer is going to trade the tonneau cover for the upfitter switches, so I'm happy with that.

I'll probably take delivery Tuesday, and when the switches and an extra satellite antenna come in I'll bring it back to them for installation. I've got a few things to pull off the truck in my sig. I ordered some Torklift tiedowns from Tweetys today. I'm going to temporarily use the fifth-wheel 7-way plug in the bed for the TC, but my intent is to install a heavy-duty battery charge circuit on the new truck like I had on the old truck. I'll be using 4 AWG wire for the +/- 12v, and split the camper's umbilical cord between two heavy-duty Pollak trailer connectors that will be located closer to the front of the bed.

I'll be changing my sig pic's soon!

:):)

[SoCalDesertRid1]

Very nice truck! 😄

Glad to see Ford went back to the wide front axle and S-series rear axle on the new 450's.

Good idea on the winch to lift the tailgate.

I like your commercial wiring plugs too.

[NRALIFR]

F450EC1165 wrote:
NRALIFR
Check the metal tag on the Dana rear axle to see if it is a 110 or a 130.
I saw on another forum where a guy with a 2015 F-450 (not a cab/chassis 450) posted a photo of the axle tag that showed it was actually a Dana 130.

Here's a picture of the only tag on the axle.

I'm going to guess that first line of embossed data is saying the axle is a model year '16, S110.



:):)

[The_Mad_Norsky]

Good info posted here.

Thanks for the replies.

[Daryl_B]

NRALIFR
Check the metal tag on the Dana rear axle to see if it is a 110 or a 130.
I saw on another forum where a guy with a 2015 F-450 (not a cab/chassis 450) posted a photo of the axle tag that showed it was actually a Dana 130.

[NRALIFR]

I couldn't agree with you more Bedlam. It all comes down to your truck camping style. While I do own a flatbed trailer, and I could even tow it while hauling the camper, my intention is to never tow anything while hauling the TC.

I also can safely say that I will never own a bigger TC than the one I have now (until I do :B). If I ever buy another TC, my intention would be to buy a slightly smaller one with either no slide, or only a dinette slide. I'm confident that the pickup version of the F450 will serve our needs well now, and in the future as well. There really was no reason for us to even consider a cab and chassis model, although I will admit that we did for a short while. The V10 gas motor is still available in the chassis-cabs, and that was making me seriously consider going that route.......... until I realized that the only rear axle ratio available with the V10 was 4.88 :E. Scratch that.

I guess I've been truck camping long enough now that I know what we want, and don't want. I know where we want to go, and won't go. And, I know what we want the total package to look like. As always, other peoples needs typically differ from ours, and that's what makes having all these choices available so great.

:):)

[Bedlam]

jimh425 wrote:
The F450 spring pack/frame on the chassis cab have a huge payload capacity with about the same axle as far as I can tell. http://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/chassis-cab/specifications/payload/

My spring pack is lighter than the '16 F350 my friend has. Of course, my F450 is a '10. I think Bedlam has done closer comparisons.

I could not afford trim levels of the F450 pickup, so I didn't look in to them as much as the chassis cabs. From what I have seen, they are a F350 with F450 driveline (one step up from the old Tow Boss option). The frame and suspension is pretty much a F350.

If you want one of these triple slide campers, the Dana 110 is the minimum axle you want. Regardless of OEM camper specifications, expect approximately 6000 lbs of payload on the rear axle. I feel this is too close the maximum of the Dana 80 or AAM axles. If you also plan to tow behind these campers, even the Dana 110 will be close or over its limits - You want the Dana 111 or 130 in the Class 5 trucks.

I feel that until you get in to the chassis cabs, the suspension will be too soft in any of the pickups. Once I add an additional ton to my Class 5, I won't know whether I need to take out any sag. Right now it handles 5000 lbs of camper and tongue weight and is still tail high with no suspension changes.

[NRALIFR]

The chassis cab trucks are different animals than the trucks that come with a pickup bed from the factory. Personally, I like the looks of the pickup bed better than a flatbed, plus I have no use for a flatbed. I also wanted a King Ranch. Chassis cabs don't come in King Ranch or Platinum trims. The highest trim level you can get on a cab and chassis is Lariat, which can of course can be optioned out pretty nicely. King Ranch trucks are actually Lariats with the KR package added on top. Also, after four years of personal experience with the 2010 F450, I knew a NEW one would handle my camper just fine with minimal suspension mod's required. I would NOT have bought one of the 2011-2014 F450's because of the changes Ford made to them in those years.

The rear axle is a Dana S110, and is rated at about 14.7K by the manufacturer, so I don't think I have to worry about overloading the axle itself. It's also not available in the F350. The wide-track front axle is standard on the F450's, and was a must-have for me. The turning radius with that axle is awesome, and has been very much appreciated by me several times. The wide-track front axle is only available on the F350 if the correct option package is selected, and you rarely see it selected. I'm not concerned about the weight rating of the front axle since I know my TC doesn't put much weight at all on the front.

The rear springs are what they are. I think Ford choose to give "ride comfort" a higher priority over payload. I used some home-made stableloads on my old truck, and was happy with the results. That was the only suspension mod I made to it, and mine weren't even half as thick as Torklift's. The only thing I wasn't satisfied with about my stableloads is they were just as noisy as the OEM rubber pads, especially when they were dirty from running down a dusty road. I was hoping they would be quieter since I made them out of UHDP plastic, but they made a lot of noise too. If Torklift stableloads don't do what I want, I'll take the truck to a spring shop and have them add a couple of leaves to the overload packs, and that WILL take care of it once and for all. I don't want airbags or Timbrens, I want it to get on the overloads quickly.

The tires used on the F450 pickups are also used on the F450/F550 chassis-cabs. Per the sticker on my new truck, they are inflated to a max of 90 front/80 rear, so they are de-rating the tires a little right there. Are the polished wheels rated for the full 110 psi? I don't know for sure, but I suspect they are. I doubt Ford would put a 110 psi tire on a wheel that wasn't also rated for 110 psi, but I can safely say they are at least rated for 90 psi. The steel wheels are in fact rated for 115 psi, as I can see it stamped on the rim. At any rate, I could get a little more capacity out of the rear tires/wheels simply by inflating them to 90 psi.

An observation of mine that is totally anecdotal (which means it's meaningless) is that it seems that some owners of the 350 and 3500 class truck with higher payload ratings than the F450 were also needing to do suspension mod's to haul a heavy TC. I'm not going to go find any specific examples of this as I'm done with the research phase of my truck purchase. It was just something that I made mental note of once in a while. I'm now in the enjoyment phase and I intend to stay there!

:):)

[The_Mad_Norsky]

jimh425 wrote:
The F450 spring pack/frame on the chassis cab have a huge payload capacity with about the same axle as far as I can tell. http://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/chassis-cab/specifications/payload/

My spring pack is lighter than the '16 F350 my friend has. Of course, my F450 is a '10. I think Bedlam has done closer comparisons.

Comparison with the newer F-350 dually's (say 2015 and newer) is the one thing I am lacking right now.

I'd love to be able to compare one of those versus this new F-450.

Went browsing through Auto Trader the other night for a cab/chassis F-450, but gosh, they're all listed as XL or XLT at best versions.

Kind of got my heart set on a Platinum version. Figure since my 2011 F-350 was a King Ranch, my Ram 3500 is a Limited version, I may as well go whole hog with my next vehicle. :B

[jimh406]

The F450 spring pack/frame on the chassis cab have a huge payload capacity with about the same axle as far as I can tell. http://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/chassis-cab/specifications/payload/

My spring pack is lighter than the '16 F350 my friend has. Of course, my F450 is a '10. I think Bedlam has done closer comparisons.

[The_Mad_Norsky]

Glad to see you're already out and about, enjoying the new truck.

Questions????

I will be the first to admit confusion about these F-450's. Especially the factory pickup version like yours.

Mind you, I love the 19.5's they come with, as it appears one will get much longer tire use (wearing better) than most any say 17 inch tire available for the GM/Ram/Ford F-350 dually now.

My concerns center on the low ratings Ford gives this truck on the axles.

Perhaps it is as you stated, marketing to keep the vehicle at or below the magic 14,000 pound GVWR so as to compete directly with Ram in particular.

But a 9,100 pound rating for the rear axle from Ford just seems terribly low for this vehicle, especially considering at the same time my Ram is rated for 9,750 pounds.

Front axle rating at 5,940 pounds while my Ram is at 6,000 pounds.

Is this really just number fudging on Ford's part?????????? Or are these axles in fact able to do a lot more, and Ford just does not want to show that because of their marketing strategy with these vehicles??????

My last concern is the small rear leaf spring pack on these F-450's. I honestly now do not recall the number of leafs on the new F-450, but I side by side compared one with my Ram at a local Ford dealer last summer. The F-450, same pickup version, had LESS springs in back than did my Ram.

So yep, I've got concerns and questions. LOL, my main reason is the wife really, I mean REALLY, wants me to get a Host Mammoth to replace our current camper, and I know that once loaded, it may in fact be too heavy for my Ram.

So that leaves me to look in the direction of F-450's or the Ram 4500/5500 series trucks. And honestly, having owned a 2011 Ford F-350, I'd lean towards the F-450 if only they were capable of hauling around 6,000 pounds of camper. Mind you, if you recall I mentioned side by side comparison w a 2016 F-450. The glove box paper said 4,000 pounds max for a slide in camper for that F-450.

Thoughts?????????

[jimh406]

Nice report! If you aren't charging more than 1%, I'd say you are missing a fuse/breaker.

[NRALIFR]

We finally got our new truck back from the dealer on Wednesday last week. I spent the rest of the day installing the camper tie-downs.

Decided to take the new truck out for a few days to check things out. We really like the way it handles the camper. The truck sits a few inches lower than I'd like in the rear, so I will most likely be purchasing some Stableloads soon.

We intentionally headed into the north-central part of Arkansas where there are many steep and twisty roads. We were not disappointed with the trucks performance. The tow/haul mode works better on the new truck than it did on the 2010, and it also has a separate exhaust brake that the 2010 didn't have at all. Both worked flawlessly, and I felt that they've finally got the tranny software to the point that the truck is cooperating with instead of fighting against me.

We first head to Greers Ferry Lake, a COE project about 60 miles north of Little Rock on the Little Red River that includes an impressive dam near Heber Springs. The dam was officially dedicated on Oct. 3, 1963 by John F. Kennedy, and was his last major public appearance before he was assassinated. The stretch just below the Greers Ferry Dam on the river is well known for its excellent trout fishing. The US Fish and Wildlife Service maintains a trout hatchery just below the dam and releases large numbers of mature trout regularly. The Little Red River is the home of the world-record brown trout (40 pounds 4 ounces).



We found a campsite in the Cove Creek COE campground. Electric only, which was good since we needed the AC that night.



The next day, we head towards Mountain View on the twistiest 2-lane roads we could find. Made the poor cat sick, and she doesn't usually get car sick. Fortunately, the boss/co-pilot threw herself between the cat and the upholstery, so there was no damage that I cared about. :W

After Mountain View, we head towards Gunner Pool Recreation Area near Fifty-Six, AR. The Gunner Pool is created by a dam constructed by the Civilian Conservation Corp in the 1930's. The pool is fed by Gunner Creek, which then runs into the North Sylamore Creek.



A pano-shot of the crystal clear water of North Sylamore Creek.



We found a campsite at the Gunner Pool USFS campground in the Ozark NF. Drove down several miles of gravel road to get there and explore the area around the campground. The truck got VERY dusty, and I think a twig or two may have brushed the side! Oh, the humanity! :B

Our campsite at Gunner Pool CG. No hookups at all. It cooled off nicely that night, being down in a hollow next to the cold water. It was a very pleasant nights sleep with the windows open and the fan on. I dozed off listening to a Whippoorwill and the sound of water going down the face of the dam.



This is a surprisingly substantial single-lane bridge to find on a gravel forest road. (FSR-1102).



We tried to stay out one more night, but being Saturday night all the campgrounds near us were just too crowded. So, we head on home and used the extra time Sunday morning to clean the truck up a bit. It seems to have survived it's inaugural trip just fine. The trip confirmed that the truck is every bit as capable (actually more so) of carrying the camper as the 2010 F450, despite the GVWR being 500 lbs lower. I suspect that may just be a paper change to keep the truck in the “Light Duty” class. Medium Duty supposedly starts at 14001 lbs. No problem, the 2010 needed thicker overload pads too.

Another thing it confirmed for me is how worthless the standard RV plug is for battery charging. Using my temporary connection to the fifth-wheel plug in the bed, the camper battery SOC only went up maybe 1% during our drive each day. Going to have to make installing the heavy-duty charge circuit a priority.

:):)

[NRALIFR]

Goodbye black truck, I feel that I hardly knew you. I turned it over to the dealer today.

Brought it home 4 years and 2 months ago. It actually looks better now than when I bought it.





I spent most of the day removing the camper tie-downs, front hitch, and all my "stuff" in the cab. The hitch is supposed to fit the new truck, but according to Torklift's website, the tie-downs will not. Seems like the rear tiedowns would work, but I don't have the new truck at home to see right now. It's at the dealer getting the upfitter switches installed.

I also asked them to enable "Battery Charge Protect" in the ECM, and connect it to one of the upfitter switches. On my 2010, it was just a matter of connecting two wires under the dash. On 2013 and up, you also have to install a resistor on two of the PTO inputs even though you aren't using PTO. BCP mode allows the ECM to monitor the battery charge voltage and manipulate the idle RPM to maintain good voltage.

They gave me 2016 F150 Ecoboost to drive while they have my new truck. The "Sport" mode in the F150 is pretty impressive! :C

:):)

[jimh406]

Looks great. Those newer tailgates with step are super heavy! DW has tried to help, but I find I can handle it better in the middle by the step handle.

[ace44]

Nice Truck!