Centramatic Wheel Balancers

[bjbear]

Just installed a couple of sets of Centramatic Wheel Balancers. First test drive did not show that much improvement, but things were already pretty smooth as I just had new tires and some front end work (new ball joints, drag link and steering stabilizer) done a couple of weeks ago. We are heading out on a long trip (3000 km ++) on Sunday so we will see how it goes. Will report back after the trip.

[bjbear]

So I am 2 days into my trip and have put a good 1000 km in. I can definitely say that the truck runs smoother with the centramatcs. Where I see the most obvious improvement is in the steering wheel. I always had a minor vibration you could just feel and now that is gone and it is smooth as silk. We will see how it goes over time.

[bjbear]

artguys wrote:
bjbear...your response is typical of what I get from those that feel otherwise. The issue centers around the quality of the tires being made today and again the weights required on the better tires are minimal to the point of not being needed.

The closer to center that weights are applied the more weight is needed to correct a unbalanced tire/wheel. It doesn't make a difference as to the placement of weights on the inside or outside unless the dish is to the extreme.

Unsprung weight is critical...on a high performance vehicle the wheel and tire weight can be as little as 25 to 30lbs...higher speeds/revolutions contribute to a higher rebound rate if a unbalanced condition exists. But again were dealing with weight corrections on these tires and wheels as little as 1/4 to 1/2 ounce. When we are dealing with those vehicles that are not in the high performance class the issue changes dramatically, with tire and wheel combinations in the range of 70 to well over 100lbs in combination with a well sprung vehicle and a weight a correction of 2 to 3oz and minimal rebound is not felt nor does it show up in uneven tire wear.

So do I understand you right. All tire shops can toss out their wheel balancers?? Well at least all of them except the guys who look after my Bentley. :?

[timmac]

Well let me chime in here, I have both, Equal in tires and Centramatic Wheel Balancers and my ride is much smoother than wheel weights, is it perfect, no, but as perfect as a 19.5 tire can be, I never have to rebalance tires and worry about wheel weights coming off. your tire will ride smother over time with Centramatic Wheel Balancers and Equal once tire breaks in.

[jimh406]

The tire is only part of the assembly since there is also a hub and wheel, but tire balance isn't static. Most of us have seen scalloping, for example. Whether balancing makes a difference or not is debatable. Some of us have picked up mud or gravel on tires and felt out of balance even with smooth riding tires.

[artguys]

Wheelholder...I tested centramatics on a KW W900 for 3 years and I completely understand you position...they now reside in my back yard collecting rust. And by the way were purchased in 1999 for $50.00 each, seems like the price hasn't changed. Oh yeh...for anyone needing a pair of 24.5s come and get them.

[artguys]

bjbear...your response is typical of what I get from those that feel otherwise. The issue centers around the quality of the tires being made today and again the weights required on the better tires are minimal to the point of not being needed.

The closer to center that weights are applied the more weight is needed to correct a unbalanced tire/wheel. It doesn't make a difference as to the placement of weights on the inside or outside unless the dish is to the extreme.

Unsprung weight is critical...on a high performance vehicle the wheel and tire weight can be as little as 25 to 30lbs...higher speeds/revolutions contribute to a higher rebound rate if a unbalanced condition exists. But again were dealing with weight corrections on these tires and wheels as little as 1/4 to 1/2 ounce. When we are dealing with those vehicles that are not in the high performance class the issue changes dramatically, with tire and wheel combinations in the range of 70 to well over 100lbs in combination with a well sprung vehicle and a weight a correction of 2 to 3oz and minimal rebound is not felt nor does it show up in uneven tire wear.

[Wheelholder]

Centramatics not only balance the tires, they help to balance the whole wheel assembly. I have them on my semi and they have added additional mileage to the life of the tires. I had tires balanced when installed. Put the centramatics on and could tell the difference. With the cost of a tire over $500.00 each, adding a significant amount of miles on the life of the tire makes the cost worthwhile.

I do not have them on my pick up as do not put enough miles on it to be feasible. I would think any high mileage driving would make sense.

The cost is not prohibitive and only you can decide if the cost is worth it. AS I said, to extend the life of my tires , it is worth it.

[bjbear]

artguys wrote:
Happy you asked...to start,

2. Revolutions of the tire wheel combination. If at normal highway speeds 35 to 65 on average the revolutions aren't high enough to create a issue.

3. Unsprung weight...wheel and tire are part of a vehicles unsprung weight. To use my truck as a example the tire and wheel weight are about 75 lbs. That alone is enough to negate any unbalanced condition that could come from the tire or wheel. And I use steel wheels, no alloy, because they work better with radial tires. More can be given on that if needed.

5. Weight placement. Most conventional way of balancing is with wheel weights, tape or clip. The size/amount have been coming down for years, this again because of the quality of the tires being produced. So where are they placed...too close to the center too matter. Same goes for the Centramatics.

thanks for the info..........but I have a few comments....

Pt 2 - Centifugal force is proportional to the square of velocity so as the rotational speed of the tire increases, the resultant force increases exponentially. So double your speed and the resulting force quadruples. Having lost weights on tires, I know from personal experience that vibration at speed does occur as a result.

Pt 3 - don't understand this point. The fact that the wheel is unsprung weight seems like it would be unrelated to an unbalanced condition. If the wheel is vibrating, it would get transmitted to the vehicle.

Pt 5 - Centrifugal force is inversely proportional to the radius. Therefore, the closer to the center, the more impact the weights will have. This will make the centramatics more effective because they are smaller diameter. Also, putting wheel weights on the inside of the wheel rim makes sense.

When I said I did not see much affect from the centramatics, I did not mean I didn't see any affect, it just was not very much and difficult to quantify. After I take my extended trip over the next few weeks, I will have a better idea. Just got back from a 1500+ km trip last week so it will make for a good comparison.

[USARMYCW]

Thanks artguys for taking the time to explain.

[artguys]

Happy you asked...to start, I own a 2009 F250 with camper package and just bought a set of tires from Discount tire. Not only was the balancing refused on this set but it's been many years since I've had any balanced.

1. Because of the quality of tires being manufactured today, unless you own a Porsche 911 or a like vehicle it for the most part isn't needed on most vehicles. Especially so the larger the vehicle becomes. Now a disclaimer...for anyone intent on buying the absolute cheapest tire they can find then balancing may be needed.

2. Revolutions of the tire wheel combination. If at normal highway speeds 35 to 65 on average the revolutions aren't high enough to create a issue.

3. Unsprung weight...wheel and tire are part of a vehicles unsprung weight. To use my truck as a example the tire and wheel weight are about 75 lbs. That alone is enough to negate any unbalanced condition that could come from the tire or wheel. And I use steel wheels, no alloy, because they work better with radial tires. More can be given on that if needed.

4. Suspension...today's suspensions are more in tune with overall design than ever, even frame twist is part of that equation. From reason 1 thru 6 all are connected. Especially so the way vehicles are sprung. On mine the front is sprung so well the OE shocks may never be replaced.

5. Weight placement. Most conventional way of balancing is with wheel weights, tape or clip. The size/amount have been coming down for years, this again because of the quality of the tires being produced. So where are they placed...too close to the center too matter. Same goes for the Centramatics.

As for Equal or other like products the need is so small it's too much of a risk allowing them inside your tires. I've tested them and found no appreciable damage to the liners. However given that the liners used in tires today are not as robust as they once we're and knowing that they probably aren't needed anyway why push it.

6. This is not a opinion, I've spent many years, too much money and resources, along with giving this advice and giving up additional revenues as a result. But the relationship with the customer made it worth the effort.

Again you have to consider each point made and the fact that when tied together the result is convincing. By the way as a consultant I used to charge for this, to you it's free.

[ScottG]

I have an odd vibration that I've been chasing for years. Only occurs at two very specific speeds.
So I installed a set of Centramatics. It did nothing.
But I left them on there because they're supposed to make the tires last longer but so far it looks like that's not happening either.

I understand they work well for really big tires that are hard to balance.

[USARMYCW]

artguys wrote:
Centramatics??? Save your money. Now I'm certain that a number here spent money on and swear by them...again, save your money.

Equal??? The only thing you should allow someone to put into your tires is air.

Why?

[artguys]

Centramatics??? Save your money. Now I'm certain that a number here spent money on and swear by them...again, save your money.

Equal??? The only thing you should allow someone to put into your tires is air.

[jimh406]

I use Equal and it seems to work well. It will be interesting to know Centramatic works for you. It should be fine. I've found balancing isn't very exciting unless tires are unbalanced. 🙂