Diesel vs gas......................

[blt2ski]

OK folks, there have been a few to many diesel vs gas threads that have shall we say gone to "Hell and a hand basket"! So if all of you would put in you BEST, no flaming reasons for going gas vs diesel, pro and con, I will either leave your thread, or copy and paste pertinant info to the 4 posts of pro and con of diesel or gas. This can include the GM 8.1 vs Dmax or Ford V-8/10 vs PSD etc too.

Be real and honest in you answers, not hear say, flaming etc PLEASE!

If posts are good ones, I will leave, if inflamatory or trolling in nature, they will be deleted! I will get this stick'd to the top for future parusing for those that need this type of info.

Added 6-23-04

We are getting closer to answers I am looking for etc.

Stuff like Ken's - T-Bone posts are good. There are a few others of you that have not posted, some with a 9 point question and answer type to figure out how you went with one or the other. If you are one of those, PLEASE repost in this thread. I may have to look up whom has done this and PM you, but if you think this is you, you now know what to do.

Also, for those of you with $ per gallon for either fuel right now, I would prefer to see a post with ...."in my area, diesel is typically .10 less than unleaded" then explain your numbers. As currently in the Seattle area, diesel and unleaded are any where from 2.05 -2.30 per gallon, with mid test .10 more and premium about .20 more, with equal high low splits. Two weeks ago those prices were upwards of .30 -.40 per gallon more. people were posting $ per gallon that were for me. "I wish" If someone is reading your post a year from now, they may want to know where your paying 1.65, when the price of fuel is over $3 per gallon. Let's keep prices out of it if possible.

Bert and tin tipi, got into a good discusion on the pros and cons of RPM's, drive train etc. I would prefer to NOT see the quote of the other in responding threads, maybe just write a quick wording of re tranny gearing, instead of the whole 40 words or so in that paragragh, so the repsonse is shorter if possible quicker and easier to read etc.

I have deleted some 15+/- posts, that were off topic etc. Please note, I am trying to keep this at the top, as the ONLY gas/diesel thread in this area. So if one is trying to decide, we do not have to go thru this BS any more. As such, I will be deleting ANY future posts close to resembling this type of topic. I may have to change "this" title to a better one, if one has a better sounding title, to be more positive, better claification, let me know here, or in a PM/e-mail, what ever you feel most comfortible with.

Again thank you for all of you that are keeping responses positive, etc.

Also we could use a few more positive reasons to go gas, as many can see I have both gas and diesel, both have a place! Both have positive reasons to buy that fuel, lets keep the threads etc to that purpose only!

Marty

[brant_c]

Drove a 1998 5.9 gas Ram 2500 Crew Cab Short Bed 4X4 towing a 28 feet prowler. It screamed on the hills.

Updated to a 2008 Ford F150 5.4 Triton Crew Cab Short Bed FX4. It screamed on the hills.

Updated again to a 2015 F250 Crew Cab Short Bed. It pulls effortlessly. I'm sold. I was always afraid to pull the trigger on a diesel. I think the more I read the more I made myself hesitant. My wife just said, "Just buy the diesel and we'll deal with what ever comes like we always do!"

Wife is awesome...

[Steakman]

I continue to be reminded that I am forever greatful, I have a diesel vehicle without DPF. It does little for the environment & reduces mileage. EGR is long gone as well....good riddance to all that needless BS.

Cheer folks, have a great long weekend.!

[harmanrk]

pullin2 wrote:
So being new* to the diesel game, do you mind explaining what is meant by "forced drive...to regen"? Is this something that happens when the truck is driven for short commutes and doesn't get warm? I use an old Corolla for daily/city drives. The truck usually goes 3-400 miles whenever I start it. Does the truck go into limp mode (slow, like it does when out of DEF)?

You are correct on the meaning and typical cause of the message. Short trips, where the engine does not heat up are hard on the DPF system on modern diesels. In most cases, when the filter is full, and needs to be cleaned, the regen process is enabled, and the filter is burnt clean along the trip (As it would on your several hundred mile trips), however if the typical driving pattern for the truck does not allow it to reach normal conditions, where the regen can occur (fully up to temp), the process will not start. If this goes on too long, with the DPF reading full, it will indicate it needs to be driven to clean. (Get me out on the highway and open the throttle, message) If this is not done, the vehicle will eventually go into limp (reduced power) mode, which then requires a trip to the dealer, to clean the filter, as you do not have the power to reach normal conditions for the regen to occur (catch 22)

[pullin2]

FishOnOne wrote:

Redwoodcamper wrote:

Some people who short trip will do much better was a gas powered truck. The last thing they want is a forced drive down the road to regen their soot clogged dpf.

New diesel owner here. Was intending to go gas, but found one I couldn't pass up sitting on the dealer's lot the day before Christmas Eve. Apparently dealers are keen to sell on the last few days of the year.

So being new* to the diesel game, do you mind explaining what is meant by "forced drive...to regen"? Is this something that happens when the truck is driven for short commutes and doesn't get warm? I use an old Corolla for daily/city drives. The truck usually goes 3-400 miles whenever I start it. Does the truck go into limp mode (slow, like it does when out of DEF)?

Sorry for the newbie questions, but I'm really not sure what the phrase means.

*Had a 7.3L diesel F250 back in the 90's, but everything's changed so much it's hardly relevant to today.

[larry_barnhart]

I looked at our local chev store and a 2017 4x4 dually crew cab and 6 liter was in the low $40K. work truck model.

chevman

[FishOnOne]

transamz9 wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

Redwoodcamper wrote:
I see no reason to ever own a full size gas truck. People say "cost," but that cost is regained when I sell it. People say maintenance, and several poorly designed diesel of the last fifteen years have given people a bad taste. My last three Cummins have had right about a million miles total on them. How much "extra" did I spend on them? I did one head gasket myself for less than $500 in my driveway and about 10 hrs of work. I've done three water pumps. One alternator. A few serpantine belts. A clutch and one tranny. Nothing more than that was necessary.
How is that more maintenance than a gasoline v8? I've spent more money fixing my wife's gasoline daily drivers than I have my work trucks! And two of the three I sold for 70 percent of what I paid for them. They made me literally tens of thousands of dollars hauling my mini excavator and skid steer around. Not to mention they passed hundreds and hundreds of swaying f150s and underpowered gasoline trucks trying to tow up hills.
I took two of the three trucks to the drag strip for test and tune nights. Had a blast in them, worked in them, enjoyed them, and the whole time if I had a gasoline full size truck I would have been disappointed.
If I was in the wrong financial situation and I only had 5-10k to I vest in a tow rig, I'd still be much happier with an older diesel that I could work on than a "nicer" newer gasoline truck.

Bottom line is trucks are for working. And for each gallon of diesel, more work is done than gas.

Some people who short trip will do much better was a gas powered truck. The last thing they want is a forced drive down the road to regen their soot clogged dpf.

In addition gas powered trucks are so much simpler will less complicated emissions equipment than todays EGR/DPF diesels.

For our farm/ranch trucks we go out of our way to purchase diesel trucks that are not equipped with dpf's and for the MIL we purchased a gas F350 since she just puts around and doesn't really work the truck.

That makes no sense..... I've had a 2013 and now a 2016. My trucks do a lot of slow putting around. My 2013 went thru 1 forced drive down the road regen. It took all of 4 miles.

It makes a lot of sense if your 6.7 cummins is in the shop for CEL after CEL because of soot and all the Chrysler dealer can tell you is to run a diesel additive and drive with your exhaust brake on. After nine months of this nonsense a 5.9 cummins solved the problem.

BTW... the regens took a lot more than 4 miles.

[FishOnOne]

transamz9 wrote:

Steakman wrote:
Mpgs went up with DPF eh...? From what? 10mpg to 12....?

I'm emissions Free - No EGR - straight piped turbo bk - PPE Exh manifolds - AM up/ down pipes...

22 mpg @ 75mph...and tuned such that it doesn't blow black at any EFI Live setting.

I get that with full DPF and DEF still on the factory tune. I can wipe the inside of my tailpipe with a white glove and it's still white. What's your point?

Funny how the DPF diesel crowd always leaves out the regen process when bragging on fuel economy which burns a lot of diesel to clean out the dpf which decreases fuel economy.

[Hitch_Itch]

If money was not an issue than the Diesel is a no brainer but since I dont have unlimited funds its not worth the additional $10,500 option to go with the diesel. Most people post getting 10-12 mpg towing with the diesel. I get 7 mpg towing my 42'-12,500# 5th wheel with my 6.0L gas.

Of course a diesel would pull with ease but my 6.0L can pull my 5th wheel at 75mph through the hills of PA just fine

From a pulling perspective a Diesel will always win but dont rule out a gasser if you dont have an extra $10k+ to spend.

[Jarlaxle]

Steakman wrote:
Mpgs went up with DPF eh...? From what? 10mpg to 12....?

I'm emissions Free - No EGR - straight piped turbo bk - PPE Exh manifolds - AM up/ down pipes...

22 mpg @ 75mph...and tuned such that it doesn't blow black at any EFI Live setting.

The last pre-2007 truck at work got about 9MPG...full-height (13'6") box, 250HP 7.2 Cat, 4.11 final drive. The emission trucks do not top 8MPG and usually get about 7, with lower boxes (12'6" or 13'), equal or less power (250 or 220) from smaller engines (Cummins 6.7s), and TALLER gearing (3.91). One tractor has never topped 5MPG in 150,000+ miles. (The pre-2007 tractors got 6.5-8MPG.)

[Jarlaxle]

transferred wrote:

Steakman wrote:

...In addition gas powered trucks are so much simpler will less complicated emissions equipment than todays EGR/DPF diesels....

Which is why maybe looking at pre DPF vehicles from say 2007 back might be worth it...? All depending on emissions stds in your state / province of course.

Myself, cannot see spending upwards of 99k CAD on a new truck and being forced to put up with the, IMO, stupidity of lower mpgs due to enforced emissions stds. Seems to me that the more emissions cntrl stuff that is added, the lower the mpgs and subsequently ya burn more fuel...Ie: stupidity.

Tuning is where the emphasis aught To be....on both Gas and Diesel vehicles.
Stk

MPGs on diesels actually went up by 20% when DEF came in to the picture. Emissions are basically sorted now. My DPF equipped trucks do a ton of putting around town and I've had no issues.

No, they're not. One of the trucks at work is OOS right now due to constant re-gen problems and the occasional STOP ENGINE light. The repair bill (bad EGR cooler, clogged DPF, and two gallons of fuel in the oil, source as yet unknown) will probably top ten thousand dollars. This is a Freightliner MDT with only 112,000 miles. Diesel power has jumped the shark.

[Steakman]

And yer mileage is..?

[transamz9]

Steakman wrote:
Mpgs went up with DPF eh...? From what? 10mpg to 12....?

I'm emissions Free - No EGR - straight piped turbo bk - PPE Exh manifolds - AM up/ down pipes...

22 mpg @ 75mph...and tuned such that it doesn't blow black at any EFI Live setting.

I get that with full DPF and DEF still on the factory tune. I can wipe the inside of my tailpipe with a white glove and it's still white. What's your point?

[Steakman]

Mpgs went up with DPF eh...? From what? 10mpg to 12....?

I'm emissions Free - No EGR - straight piped turbo bk - PPE Exh manifolds - AM up/ down pipes...

22 mpg @ 75mph...and tuned such that it doesn't blow black at any EFI Live setting.

[Cummins12V98]

Grateful Camper wrote:
Haven't read entire thread, I'm sure both have pro's and cons. I just love the way my diesel sounds.

Just for fun have someone drive it away from you with you standing outside. The fords of your era sound a bit different on the exhaust side of things. Kinds sounds like someone is blowing air thru their loose lips. Especially if it has an aftermarket exhaust.

[transferred]

Steakman wrote:

...In addition gas powered trucks are so much simpler will less complicated emissions equipment than todays EGR/DPF diesels....

Which is why maybe looking at pre DPF vehicles from say 2007 back might be worth it...? All depending on emissions stds in your state / province of course.

Myself, cannot see spending upwards of 99k CAD on a new truck and being forced to put up with the, IMO, stupidity of lower mpgs due to enforced emissions stds. Seems to me that the more emissions cntrl stuff that is added, the lower the mpgs and subsequently ya burn more fuel...Ie: stupidity.

Tuning is where the emphasis aught To be....on both Gas and Diesel vehicles.
Stk

MPGs on diesels actually went up by 20% when DEF came in to the picture. Emissions are basically sorted now. My DPF equipped trucks do a ton of putting around town and I've had no issues.