F350 drew or F450

[oldav]

I am planning on ordering a new truck to tow a fifth wheel and sometimes a truck camper. The issues I am having trouble with regarding the F350 or F450 are which features are more important. The F350 has 500 lbs more carrying capacity and the F450 heavier components. My fifth wheel is only 13000 lbs and I will not be going any larger. The truck campers I am looking at are in the 5000 lb range. So, which features are more important to consider?

[Threebigfords]

HMS Beagle wrote:
Looks like they did go for bigger brakes on the F450 in 2017. That would be a good reason to consider. In 2015 -16 they were listed as the same, one reason I didn't look hard for an F450. Also in 2WD, the turning radius comes at the expense of a monobeam front end and ride quality. In 4WD, no difference.

Yeah, well, they also incorrectly listed the 2015 as having a Dana 110 on their website, when in fact the 2015/16 F450's come with the Dana S130 rated for 16k and bigger brakes all around than the F350. Also there is no 2wd option for the F450 in 2015/16.

Just proves it pays to do your homework on the trucks your interested in. Can't even count on the manufacturers to get the specs right!

[HMS_Beagle]

Looks like they did go for bigger brakes on the F450 in 2017. That would be a good reason to consider. In 2015 -16 they were listed as the same, one reason I didn't look hard for an F450. Also in 2WD, the turning radius comes at the expense of a monobeam front end and ride quality. In 4WD, no difference.

[mkirsch]

Well looking at the specs on Ford's website...
http://www.ford.com/trucks/super-duty/2017/models/f450-xl/?gclid=CjwKEAiA_9nFBRCsurz7y_Px8xoSJAAUqvKCWSzE-KonSBdt1i--B1Y7C33E2OhLgkskeftj_6h7hBoCKarw_wcB&searchid=217072714|13434000754|267852822994&s_kwcid=AL!2519!3!61611883594!b!!g!!2017%20ford%20%2Bf%20%2B450%20pickup&ef_id=WKtXswAABQ2IvgrC:20170301141419:s

FAWR is the same between F350 and F450
RAWR is the same between F350 and F450 (actually F350 is higher in some cases)

Main difference is tires and brakes. F450 has 19.5" wheels and tires, and larger brakes front and rear.

[jimh406]

The rated slide in camper weight is always less than actual payload. Plus, isn't your truck 2 wheel drive?

[Kayteg1]

jimh425 wrote:
It shows a truck camper payload of 4510 for the F450 vs 5010 for the F350 crew.

This is sticker from my F350 supercab dually.
If you think Ford engineers know more about weight distribution than I do - I am up for a challenge.
Just drove the beast to scales today.
About 8000 lb with full tank.
4500lb on front axle.
Rear axle is 9900lb rated, so looks like I can drop 6400 on it.


Click For Full-Size Image.

[oldav]

Thanks for the replays. I guess I'll go by the old adage "go big or go home". The 450 will insure no regrets.

[Reality_Check]

Brakes... Single best reason to go 450.

Go C&C if weight is an issue.

I find it interesting that in discussions about the p/u versions of the 350/450, people get all hung up on the 500# difference, or whatever it might be that week, yet, half the threads about weight on this forum our about people carrying well more than the stated/listed/advised limits. Yet narry a whisper about stopping said weight.

A maxed out truck is just that; everything is at the limit, not just the capacity. Personally, I think stopping is a whole lot more important than how fast I can get up that hill.

To each his own.

[tjhjunior]

Go drive a new 2017 cab and chassis with the 6.7 and see what you think!
It will ride real stiff until you get your 6000 pounds on it.

[ticki2]

Boatycall wrote:
Ford intentionally de-programs the motor in a commercial/C&C version for longevity. They've done this for quite some time.

That doesn't seem like a negative thing , especially if using the truck to capacity or beyond . Most manufacturers did the same thing with gas engines in commercial trucks for the same reason .

[Boatycall]

tjhjunior wrote:
It would really be worth a look at the
chassis cab 450 and 550 if you are going to haul a truck camper
and a larger trailer.

I would not recommend a cab&chassis because Ford intentionally de-programs the motor in a commercial/C&C version for longevity. They've done this for quite some time. A programmer can bring it up to Superduty specs AND better, but instantly voids your warranty.

The C&C F450/550 stock tune is 330Hp, 750ftlbs torque.
2017 Ford F450 Cab Chassis specs

The same 6.7L in the consumer pickup is rated @ 440hp, 925ftlbs torque.
2017 Ford Superduty specs

HP/Tq numbers are at the very bottom of each page.

As far as brake size, I mentioned bigger brakes on the F450 vs. F350. The difference is pretty substantial. We're talking over an inch larger front and rear.

Taken from the same page as the HP/Tq #'s---

Front (rotor diameter)
14.29" (F-250/F-350)
15.39" (F-450)

Rear (rotor diameter)
14.29" (F-250/F-350)
15.75" (F-450)

[tjhjunior]

We had the same question. The 2017 f450 pickup has a slightly
larger diameter rear axle than the f350 pickup if you look in the specs. Ford went with
a new rear axle in their super duty for 2017 but their spec diameter
seems to increase with the model ranges from 350 on up to
the chassis cab 550. It would really be worth a look at the
chassis cab 450 and 550 if you are going to haul a truck camper
and a larger trailer. Those trailer tongue weights can put you
over your rear axle rating fast. Your actual cost in a chassis cab might be less even with putting a nice flatbed on it with boxes. You could get leather, nav and such if you
like. Just watch for that rear axle ratio. Maybe go for the 4.30,
but interestingly the GVWR and frame thickness gets downgraded
in some of the Ford chassis cabs when choosing something other than
4.88. This will affect licensing and your insurance.

[jimh406]

Either a F450 or F350 will carry a truck camper. In some years, the F450 with 4.30 gearing is much more capable of high loads and has bigger brakes. You can find the towing guides here. http://www.fleet.ford.com/towing-guides/

In the 2017, things seem different. It shows a truck camper payload of 4510 for the F450 vs 5010 for the F350 crew. Also, only a 700 lb advantage for the F450 for fifth wheel towing.

It would be interesting to see the difference in how the 2017 F350 vs F450 turns, but otherwise, they are pretty close. The 4.30s will probably still tow a bit better, but at the cost of MPG.

Assuming the deals are still better on the F350s, I think looking hard at the F350 makes sense.

[jmtandem]

The truck campers I am looking at are in the 5000 lb range. So, which features are more important to consider?

I would probably go with the 450 to be able to carry the camper. Also, something to consider are the commercial tires that the 450 uses. Not every tire shop sells/services commercial size tires.

[Kayteg1]

HMS Beagle wrote:
I haven't heard of many Dana 80s breaking.

Mine broke on 1999 F450.
When I bought the truck it was low on diff oil, so that might be due to some neglect.
Those things don't break often, but when they do, it comes with huge price tag.
Rebuilding at the time exceed the truck value.
I settled for used one for $5500 installed at Reno Ford.