Going from pop-up to hard side, big mistake?

[raztec]

I've got a Palomino Bronco pop-up TC on a 3500 SRW Dodge Diesel short box. It's only about 1200lbs empty and the truck pulls as if it's not even there. I've got stock suspension and air bags.

I'm getting kinda of tired of popping it up and down during short stops, so am thinking of trading it in for a hard side Northstar without basement. This one weighs about 1800lbs empty. So again I should have no problem with my truck.

However, I've never had a hard shell TC and am not sure if I'll regret this decision or not. It's a $15,000 decision so I'm trying to get as much feedback as possible from others. For those who've had experience with both a pop-up and hard side TCs I'd love to hear what your thoughts are on this swap.

1. Did you notice a big difference in gas mileage, handling?

2. How about off road handling? I'm not talking serious off road, but the occasional dirt road off the beaten path to mountain lakes and sort. Does the hard side TC rock and roll a lot compared to the pop-up?

3. Is the comfort, convenience and warmth you get in a hard side worth the extra cost in fuel or handling?

4. Are all these points moot if I have a 1 ton diesel truck that can carry the extra load with ease?

5. If you were to do it again, which would you choose, hard side or pop-up, and why?

Thanks for any insights.

Cheers,

[GeoBoy]

I never had a popup but did own a Northstar Arrow 8.5 on my 1 ton SRW and it handled beautifully. No basement and only 90" wide makes a big difference. Your 1 ton Dodge duelly won't even know it is there. Go for it, you won't regret ever buying a Northstar camper.

[69_Avion]

Rbertalotto wrote:
I had a hardside....went to a Palomino Pop-Up....Next spring I'll sell the pop-up and buy another hardside.

Stealth camping is a big issue with the pop-up. I can't stand always putting up the top and taking it down for a simple rest area stop or to make a cup of coffee. PITA!

I like the pop-up for going through the woods. Doesn't hit as many branches. But ATVs are now used for most woods travel. With the price of trucks and campers, the cost is to great to damage them.

As far as handling...I see no difference. My truck handled both without issue or concern. But my hardside was only 600 pounds more than the pop-up.

That is what I do. There is no doubt that a pop-up can go further back than a hard side. I don't need to go that far back. I'll just bring two quads and I'll go further back than any camper.
All I need to be able to do with my camper is to go back far enough to get a good camping spot. After that, the quads are what I need. Especially if you get your quads licensed so that you can run them on the road if you need to.

[woodhog]

I am in the hardside camp, also the Northstar camp...

Northstar without basement. This one weighs about 1800lbs empty. So again I should have no problem with my truck.

We only have the Northstar Arrow model, also the Dodge Diesel SRW and we sometimes gross over 11,000 pounds on the road..

Be sure to work out your weight calculations , I found the payload for our trucks to be a bit on the light side, changed out the wheels and tires, added stable loads....

They do make an excellent camper and company support is second to none.

[joerg68]

This album has lots of pictures of our Outfitter:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/104581754261901190566/albums/5649697271345346881
We have the electric roof lift, a north-south bed, a full wet bath with shower, and all sorts of amenities.

Just for the record: I don't get paid by Outfittermfg. There are many companies that make a good product. We chose our TC not for the manufacturer, but for the specific features that were important to us.

[Rbertalotto]

I had a hardside....went to a Palomino Pop-Up....Next spring I'll sell the pop-up and buy another hardside.

Stealth camping is a big issue with the pop-up. I can't stand always putting up the top and taking it down for a simple rest area stop or to make a cup of coffee. PITA!

I like the pop-up for going through the woods. Doesn't hit as many branches. But ATVs are now used for most woods travel. With the price of trucks and campers, the cost is to great to damage them.

As far as handling...I see no difference. My truck handled both without issue or concern. But my hardside was only 600 pounds more than the pop-up.

[dadwolf2]

Like Dave/crosscheck just said; my camper has a 7.5 cu ft refrigerator with separate freezer too and I wouldn't bother trying to go as high as the pop-up section to break in. A small pry bar would take care of virtually any of our RV doors.

I have the deepest respect for Jefe4x4. A smaller/lighter hardside can & will go into some rough areas. Jefe's superior offroad driving skills and experience will take him farther into backcountry than me and my pop-up!! And I too have done my share of TC repairs.

[crosscheck]

quote:The hardsided provides twice as much storage space and will have a larger frige and other benefits over a popup. I have found it convenient to have the upper bed area as a temporary place to leave items during the day. I have no worries about the camper being broken into during the day while we are off exploring but with a popup I would want to lower it and then raise it again on our return. Even stopping at a store for food and other items is easier with the hardside camper.Quote

Our pop-up is one of the larger ones that have a lot of options so you do pay the price in a heavier unit similar to same sized hard side TC.I know that I don,t go out of my way to make it through some of the places I see similar units being taken in trip reports. It,s hard on the rigging.
Our pop-up has lots of storage including 2 upper cabinets, a large 7.5 cuft 2 door fridge/freezer and lots of other amenities that you will find in any other kind of RV. Getting groceries is no different than a hard side except for the 30 seconds it takes to pop up the roof to the height where my wife can stand up in (5'6".)
Breaking into a pop-up or hardside is no different. Give me a good pry bar and I will be in in seconds, wrecking the door in the meantime.

Lots of people still think of pop-ups as four walls,a cranked up roof and a lightbulb. There are still those types around who are into the hardcore 4X4 action that want a light and low pop-up TC but there is a growing market for larger,roomier, more equiped units.

Dave

[wintersun]

Everyone's needs are different and what price they are willing to pay in dollars or convenience. If I was exploring true backcountry trails in places like Colorado or Utah I would want a popup to have as low a center of gravity as possible.

In places like California and Oregon and Montana and Idaho there is little need for a popup as the hardsided campers are fine on the dirt roads and this includes the USFS roads built to accommodate logging companies.

The hardsided provides twice as much storage space and will have a larger frige and other benefits over a popup. I have found it convenient to have the upper bed area as a temporary place to leave items during the day. I have no worries about the camper being broken into during the day while we are off exploring but with a popup I would want to lower it and then raise it again on our return. Even stopping at a store for food and other items is easier with the hardside camper.

If the factory says the camper is 1800 lbs. I would bet its actual dry weight will be closer to 2200 lbs. and when fully loaded for a trip it will be close to 2800 lbs. which is not a great load for your truck but a more accurate estimation of the weight you will be carrying. Easy to verify at a local CAT scale before the camper is loaded and in its fully loaded state for a trip.

[jefe_4x4]

Dadwolf brings up an important issue regarding a small hardside compared to a more spacious soft side. How much tolerance do you have to claustrophobia? Jeanie and I have no claustro and find it comforting to snuggle up into the cave for the night in the middle of the forest...or the desert... or city center.
Generally, form follows function: the old engineer's adage. We followed the path of many on here with car camping; tent camping; backpacking; camping in a station wagon; then a pickup; then one day happened to look in the Recycler (a So. Cal. kind of Craigslist) and found a small, 3 yr. old, hardside Lance camper for $6500. We wrapped up the deal within a few hours. It was just fate, not any advance planning that brought us to this point. Except for the lack of a four season package (who needs that in So. Cal.?) we have gotten used to having one of the smallest, narrowest, least tall, lightest full service TC around. Yes, @ 10 foot, 2 inch, height is an issue that we try to resolve by having the truck as low as we can and using common sense when we're in the woods. Have we ever been stopped by being too tall to continue? Yes, my son Matt was on the Usal Road with the rig and met a downed tree across the roadway which he could have passed if he were only 8-1/2 feet tall.
We are planning a 16 week trip around the boundary states (U.S.), counterclockwise and I cannot think of a better platform for Nat'nl Forest/Nat'nl Parks/ grasslands/monuments/BLM/public campgrounds/State Parks/County parks/stealth camping in cities/weekly fine hotels as a modus operandi through 28 boundary states.
I am no expert on soft side campers so I cannot respond as one who has had both. Everyone has differing requirements. My brother has a long bed OUTFITTER! that he likes a lot. It may be only him, but he has had a lot of trouble with it. But now he's used to it and can fix anything.
So, in the end, would it be a mistake to go to a small, hard side camper on a one-ton? Not by me. You can see by the various answers how across-the-spectrum we TC people are. Younger folks like the soft sides better as they have a lower height; are more in tune with nature and more like tent camping which many just came over from. Older folks like the lack of noise and lack of set up you get with a hard side.
But only you must weigh all the pros and cons and move away from your indecision.
jefe

[crosscheck]

raztec wrote:

crosscheck wrote:

Regarding lifting the roof, when we pull in for lunch, it takes 30 seconds with the remote to raise the top enough so we can stand without hitting our heads on something so with the legs and the top all electric and controlled by the remote, the top for us is a non issue.

Which pop-up do you have that has electric remote control for the top?

The brand of pop-up is in my signiture(Outfitter)

Dave

[MKish]

I think Outfitter and Hallmark have an electric roof option. I can't imagine needing it--even with a boat on the roof my Northstar opens effortlessly. Now, remote latch undoers would be cool cuz I'm short!

Some of these posts saying how much work a popup is are coming from folks referring to tent trailers which of course are a bit more labor intensive.

I'm sure you'll like the Northstar. It's still pretty small and they are nice campers. BC is a lot wetter than where I camp!

[raztec]

crosscheck wrote:

Regarding lifting the roof, when we pull in for lunch, it takes 30 seconds with the remote to raise the top enough so we can stand without hitting our heads on something so with the legs and the top all electric and controlled by the remote, the top for us is a non issue.

Which pop-up do you have that has electric remote control for the top?

[crosscheck]

There were 2 main reasons for us going from a hard side to a pop-up.

1. Height. Our previous TC had a basement and even without anA/C unit, was close to 11' high. We like to take our canoe along with us and this was almost impossible. Guess I could have gone with a trailer but where we like to camp, it is not practical. I had punctured the skin a few time rubbing into low hanging branches and damaged the skylights so for those of us who like to camp in more remote, bushy areas, a pop-up is nice.

2. Rock and roll. In the wind and on rough roads, the higher the TC, the more the rig rock and rolls no matter how many mods to your suspension/tires etc.

Where we lived in the north central part of BC, TC,s were very popular and for every pop-up there were 100 hard sides and that was because of the cooler, wet weather.

Now we live in the south of BC and we tend to camp where the weather is dryer and warmer.

Regarding lifting the roof, when we pull in for lunch, it takes 30 seconds with the remote to raise the top enough so we can stand without hitting our heads on something so with the legs and the top all electric and controlled by the remote, the top for us is a non issue.

I could live with a narrow, non-basement, small east/west bed, light hard side for the camping we are doing.

The only cons that I have found re: the pop-up is a little less quiet, a little cooler and when the wind blows hard on the desert, sand will find it,s way into the inside through the upper windows no matter how well the Velcro is done up.

Dave

[dadwolf2]

joerg68 wrote:
the airy/roomy feel in the popup is much nicer -

That's what I noticed the instant I went into our pop-up. I feel claustrophobic in a hardside with all the walls closing in on me in the tight space.

Other people have mentioned storage space being limited in a pop-up. Perhaps in some pop-ups but when I show people how much storage is in the Outfitter they are always amazed. I would put our storage capability against most hardsides of the same general size.

And what/where is canvas on a pop-up??