Is this a can of worms?

[mleekamp]

Okay, A friend with 3/4 ton Dodge noted my 1500 (half ton) has too little tow capacity. True, there is a difference, I don't argue that at all. But look at this...

in 2000, I had a 2500HD Chevy with a 10k tow rating (WD hitch)
in 2005, I had an F150 with 9500k tow rating (WD)
today, I have a 1500 GMC with a 9700k tow rating (WD)

I also currently have a 1979 Chevy with a 5k tow rating (WD).

My point to my friend is that over the years, the 1500 has become what the old 3/4 ton trucks were...they evolved. I keep within my tow rating no matter what, but am I correct thinking the half ton trucks have double capacity than what they used to?

Remember the 1500HD's? Ford even had F250 and F250 Super Duty (before it became just the SD model).

What do you think?

[MeandMyLabs]

No doubt the tow ratings have increased on the 1/2 ton trucks of all makes. The question is, are they building a better truck now or just adjusting their tow ratings to be more competitive and removing the built in safety margin previously incorporated. Personally, I think a little of both. Transmissions are much better today with 6 speed options which allow a better towing performance out of the same size and HP of engine.

I will state this however after recently going from an F150 5.4 4 speed to a 2500 HD 6.0 6 speed pulling the same trailer with the same WDH. The F150 had plenty of power to easily pull my toy hauler but the 3/4 ton has way more stability in windy situations. With the heavier springs and drive train the comfort difference is night and day. If one must use the 1/2 ton as a daily driver, then maybe it is a good option with the correct setup otherwise, heavy duty is better...hands down!

[blt2ski]

Water-Bug wrote:
I had a 1990 Chevy 2500 std cab, 8' bed, 2wd, 350cid, 5 speed manual. Today it would be a 1500. It only had 5 lug wheels. Fact is, it was a 1500 short bed extended cab chasis that had a little extra hauling capacity, because it had a regular cab on it, so they badged it a 2500.

Part of this issue is when that body style came out, GM changed the badging/gvwr for a couple of years, then went back to more or less as it is today, and before that. In 88, you couldnot get a K3500 dually, on a SW! IIRC the same in 89. It was 90 before you could get a dualy not in the older 80's body style. The 3500 was a typical 8600gvwr 2500 as most of us would call it. In 89, they came out with a 8600 2500, that had the 350 in it. you had to get a 3500 to get the 454! Other than badging, BOTH were identical!

1500's at the time had a 6000 or 6600 gvwr. 2500's had the 7200 gvwr. Later the 7200 became a ld2500 as the 8600 2500 came back, the 3500 sw became a 9200 gvwr, and a dually with a 10 or 10.5K gvwr came out!

Lots of playing with gvwr's and badging thru the years. Hence why it is usualy better to look at the gvwr/axle ratings than the badging!

Marty

[Henry]

I've always been more concerned about stopping than pulling. If it can't stop it, it probably shouldn't be pulling it.
One man's opinion,

[Jarlaxle]

GM sold what was essentially a heavy-half as a 2500 for a while...no idea why. Now, they go the opposite way: the 1500HD is essentially a downbadged 2500.

[Water-Bug]

I had a 1990 Chevy 2500 std cab, 8' bed, 2wd, 350cid, 5 speed manual. Today it would be a 1500. It only had 5 lug wheels. Fact is, it was a 1500 short bed extended cab chasis that had a little extra hauling capacity, because it had a regular cab on it, so they badged it a 2500.

[lbrjet]

fla-gypsy wrote:

goducks10 wrote:

Vulcaneer wrote:

Bob Landry wrote:
You can hit over $60K for a F150 King Ranch with all the whistles and bells. That's a lot of coin for any truck, let alone basically a grocery getter.

F-150 trucks in Texas must be painted in gold leaf. I'll bet you can exceed $45K....But $60K? What kind of bells and whistles are on those babies?

It's not $60,000 but a bit over $54,000 I haven't seen $60,000 but getting to $55,000 is pretty easy with a platinum. Not sure what else you can get to hit $60,000
http://www.inventory.ford.com/services/inventory/WindowSticker.pdf?vin=1FTFW1ET0DFC13177

I just priced out an 2013 F-250 XL crew cab 6.2L/3.73 with every option needed for towing and to make it comfortable, look good and it was 32K after incentives. Paying ridiculous amounts of money for fluff never made any sense to me. I bought my 09 F-250 XL CC with a 6.8L/4.10 with all towing and power options for 30K. Why would anyone pay more?

2009 was a great year to purchase right after the stock market crash. We bought our car in late March and dealers were falling all over us with deals and the salesmen couldn't believe we were paying cash.

I don't want carpet in my truck so that meant the F250 XL model. Added the IBC, cloth split seats, power windows/door locks and 4X4 for 32K. Perfect for me. Also wanted manual controls for heat/AC as I hate climate control with a passion.

[APT]

fla-gypsy wrote:

I just priced out an 2013 F-250 XL crew cab 6.2L/3.73 with every option needed for towing and to make it comfortable, look good and it was 32K after incentives. Paying ridiculous amounts of money for fluff never made any sense to me. I bought my 09 F-250 XL CC with a 6.8L/4.10 with all towing and power options for 30K. Why would anyone pay more?

Because I don't drive XL model vehicles. I spend a lot of time in my vehicles, so I'm willing to pay an extra $5-8k for the "same truck" with all the extra fluff. The $2k navigation system I hate, but I love the large screen for the backup camera. That is before the $8K diesel option for someone who wants that.

But this is why there are $20k of options on the "same truck", and $40k spread between regular cab 2wd XL and crew cab 4WD Platinum/Denali/Longhorn trims. The market wants a variety of choices.

People also get discounts of over $10k off MSRP for full sized trucks. So comparing $32k after rebates to $60k MSRP is just as good as "news media" distortion.

[Lowsuv]

my first new car was a 1972 C20 suburban with the 402 big block, 3 speed turbo hydro. i could be wrong but the gvw of that 1972 eight lug C20 was about 7200 ? pounds or so. it was the envy of all campers in the campground .
nobody bought 8 lug trucks then .
travel trailers in 1972 were 16 feet single axle . a big trailer was a 22 foot double axle. the trailer height was about 9 feet on average.
in 1972 cadillac sedans with an ez-lift were shown in the ads , towing .
now a small trailer is a 21 footer and a big one is a 36 footer . they are 10.5 feet high .
trailer weights went up big time in the last 40 years.
made possible by big bad diesel pickups.
duramax is the class of the field , but even a cummins/powerstroke trumps the darling of the soccer parents crowd , the f 150 ecoboost .
an f150 is not an 8 lug pickup no matter how fancy the nav system and moonroof .

[fla-gypsy]

goducks10 wrote:

Vulcaneer wrote:

Bob Landry wrote:
You can hit over $60K for a F150 King Ranch with all the whistles and bells. That's a lot of coin for any truck, let alone basically a grocery getter.

F-150 trucks in Texas must be painted in gold leaf. I'll bet you can exceed $45K....But $60K? What kind of bells and whistles are on those babies?

It's not $60,000 but a bit over $54,000 I haven't seen $60,000 but getting to $55,000 is pretty easy with a platinum. Not sure what else you can get to hit $60,000
http://www.inventory.ford.com/services/inventory/WindowSticker.pdf?vin=1FTFW1ET0DFC13177

I just priced out an 2013 F-250 XL crew cab 6.2L/3.73 with every option needed for towing and to make it comfortable, look good and it was 32K after incentives. Paying ridiculous amounts of money for fluff never made any sense to me. I bought my 09 F-250 XL CC with a 6.8L/4.10 with all towing and power options for 30K. Why would anyone pay more?

[goducks10]

Vulcaneer wrote:

Bob Landry wrote:
You can hit over $60K for a F150 King Ranch with all the whistles and bells. That's a lot of coin for any truck, let alone basically a grocery getter.

F-150 trucks in Texas must be painted in gold leaf. I'll bet you can exceed $45K....But $60K? What kind of bells and whistles are on those babies?

It's not $60,000 but a bit over $54,000 I haven't seen $60,000 but getting to $55,000 is pretty easy with a platinum. Not sure what else you can get to hit $60,000
http://www.inventory.ford.com/services/inventory/WindowSticker.pdf?vin=1FTFW1ET0DFC13177

[mleekamp]

Pretty much what I thought...of course 3/4 tons are better....and yes, 1/2 tons have come a long way.

Good points on the bed load capability.

No, I don't tow 9700k trailer! Much less than that. Thing is we had the truck before the trailer....so we matched a trailer to the truck.

Maybe next time I will have 3/4 ton or more...who knows...a 5th wheel could be next (years down the road!)

[ArcticDodge]

Yes - it's true that 1/2 tons are better than they were 15 years ago. HOWEVER, there is no comparison that the added strenght and stability of a 3/4 or 1 ton makes for a better tow rig period.

[fla-gypsy]

1/2 tons are better than they used to be. 3/4 tons are better than they used to be. 1 tons are better then they used to be. There is a LOT more to towing than the listed tow rating of any of these vehicles.

[45Ricochet]

LOL
Who would have thought of 400HP/800TQ ten years ago :B And now we have a pickup which is rated to tow a 30,000 lb load :E Got to love the HP wars!