Kodiak 2014 279RBSL Looks like a lemon

[Seattle_Lion]

My wife and I purchased our first TT about two weeks ago. Since my signature went on the dotted line the problems grow worse. First of all, I have never done any RV'ing; my wife has done some before we met. To assure that we have a good experience, I decided to buy a brand new 2014 TT. We have our first camping trip scheduled to begin this Wednesday. However, things are just not going well:

• We appeared at the dealer service center on Wednesday 6/26 as agreed, but were told that there was a "small" water leak that needed to be fixed and the dealer would deliver it the next day
• Thursday rolled around and got a call that the process was taking a bit longer. They would deliver on Friday.
• The TT arrived on Friday and we received our orientation. We hooked up to a hose on our property using a pressure regulator and filter. All seemed very good.
• Saturday: we started moving gear into the TT and we were purging the fresh water tank to get out the chlorine. We noticed water coming from the shower. We called the dealer who suggested we try some silicone caulk around the shower. We did this and the leak appeared to be gone. We resumed city water and went to bed.
• Sunday Morning: The membrane covering the bottom of the TT looked pregnant and water was streaming out of the opening for the low water drain valves. We disconnected city water. There was also water on the floor coming from the shower area.
• Sunday morning a bit later: We managed to reach the dealer and expressed our frustration and concern. I spoke to the sales manager who seemed more intent on forestalling a law suit than helping me. He did agree to have the TT picked up in the morning.

That's where we are now. We have made substantial deposits to the campground (it is July 4 weekend, after all) and the dog kennel; all non-refundable. My wife says that her family bought many TT's, often used, and never had this much trouble.

As for me, I am very frustrated. At the least, I expected the dealer to find us a substitute we could use on our planned trip. I thought that we could just do an exchange for the same model. The sales manager took great pains to explain that the warranty was between us and the manufacturer (Dutchman, Thor Industries) and not him. In all my years of purchasing vehicles I have never heard that before.

I reminded him that his dealership Fife RV in Fife Washington, owed its customers better treatment. He was completely unwilling to commit to anything beyond taking it in for service.

I don't have any previous experience to compare with this, but I am a very unhappy camper right now. I am concerned that even if they fix the leak, we could get mold below the floor that could prove toxic to us. Since this is the 2nd attempt in less than a week to deal with a water leak, I expected a lot more help from Fife RV in Fife WA.

What is your experience with RV dealers and with TT's like mine? Am I being unreasonable? Do I have some recourse if my vacation has to be cancelled?

(Sorry I got into this whole RV thing)

[Seattle_Lion]

westend wrote:
So, now it looks like lemonade? :W

The thing with PEX pipe is that the fittings need to be crimped exactly to offer durability with no leaks. A crimper with a bad or failing jaw set will crimp the fitting onto the pipe and look secure but may be just a bit out of round. As pressure or movement of the pipes occur, the fittings will leak or part from the pipe.

If you haven't discovered them yet, you might want to read about water regulators and their purpose in RV water systems. There are many threads on the Forum about them.

Good to see that your first trip went off well.

I have a regulator and have been using it from the start.

[Doug33]

Seattle Lion wrote:
There are fingerprints all over from careless assembly workers and bad dealer detailing (Fife RV).

Ever get a car back from the mechanic after a repair or oil change? I don't even want to touch the steering wheel because of the dirt and grease all over it. I don't blame the mechanic - they work hard and their hands get dirty. I blame management for not having someone clean up the vehicle afterward.

[westend]

So, now it looks like lemonade? :W

The thing with PEX pipe is that the fittings need to be crimped exactly to offer durability with no leaks. A crimper with a bad or failing jaw set will crimp the fitting onto the pipe and look secure but may be just a bit out of round. As pressure or movement of the pipes occur, the fittings will leak or part from the pipe.

If you haven't discovered them yet, you might want to read about water regulators and their purpose in RV water systems. There are many threads on the Forum about them.

Good to see that your first trip went off well.

[Seattle_Lion]

We completed our first trip (see the trip report post)with no problems at all. I purchase an extended warranty with the TT, so I have no worries about later developments. In addition, I have been in contact with Dutchmen warranty managers and they have recorded the entire, sad story of our problems. They are also replacing the rubber belly pan. When that is done, the dealer can inspect for mold or other problems.

I agree that fit and finish leave a lot to be desired. I found some silicone material on the back of the couch (will have the dealer manage that). There are fingerprints all over from careless assembly workers and bad dealer detailing (Fife RV). I installed the TV's so they worked without a problem.

Thanks for all of the good advice. Our trip was an unqualified success and we are off again this coming weekend.

Bob

[Crawfordville]

WOW - what a story. I'm glad that you will have a happy ending - Hopefully!! I just posted an issue with our new TT - window leaks. From reading other posts sounds like this industry needs an overhaul and competition.

Good Luck. Looking forward to an update.

Karen

[DiskDoctr]

Glad to hear your repairs went well. My compliments on your patience.

One thing I would suggest is for you to request an additional 1 yr warranty on top of whatever you have now and at least a 5 year warranty against mold and rot.

Why?

It's a brand new rig. Now it is a "repaired" rig. Did they refund you about 20%-30% of the difference between new and used? Maybe a bit much, but it's not unreasonable to expect a concession for the soaking of your rig.

If they object, simply ask if they are confident in their repairs and that no long term damage was caused by the water leaks. If they are confident, this concession of a longer warranty shouldn't cost them a thing. If they are wrong, they will bear the costs, not you- as it should be.

[Doug33]

Congrats on getting the repairs done and hopefully your nightmare is over and you can enjoy your rig. I believe my Keystone is owned by Thor also....

[2012Coleman]

I will not own anything THOR ever again

X10 My namesake 2012 coleman is a disaster in the fit and finish area, although it was the best I had seen in the time we were shopping. THOR products present well, but is quickly goes down hill after that. Hey Moderator - is it possible to change my user name?

[hilandfrog]

Seattle Lion wrote:
....The one today wanted to be sure I was being treated well.

We towed the trailer home this afternoon.
...
...
Thanks for all the good wishes. I will report back from the field.

Bob

Glad things seemed to work out, sure hope you have time to sleep in that thing at least 1 night before you tow it somewhere to sleep in it. STUFF may come up 🙂
Making a list prior to leaving may be a less frustrated first time expierance, what ever you do remember "no one is dying" and its up to you to have fun.
Have a great 4th.

Repo

[Seattle_Lion]

We got the TT back today. It turned out that 4 PEX fittings failed; not all at once but one after the other. The dealer replaced all of the PEX and used very high quality fittings. I called Dutchmen's VP quality and Warranty. He followed up with two of his managers. One called yesterday and authorized the work along with a new belly pan. The one today wanted to be sure I was being treated well.

We towed the trailer home this afternoon. It was our first time towing this trailer...first time towing anything for me, but my wife is fairly experienced. It towed beautifully. I have it on city water and thankfully no more leaks. Even the shower is leak free. We leave tomorrow afternoon on our first trip with the trailer. First time with any trailer for me.

Apparently Dutchmen can't get their act together with assembly quality. Though both QC managers I talked with said that each trailer gets pressure tested. I suspect the testers are less than diligent or they use too low a pressure to find issues. Since they now use PEX, I don't understand why there is an issue with any city water pressure. PEX should be rated schedule 40 which can easily handle 100psi. Another mystery maybe you can solve for me.

Thanks for all the good wishes. I will report back from the field.

Bob

[wallacemf]

Our first RV was a 2006 Kodiak 30BHSL bunkhouse. It was a disaster as well, I see that they have not goten any better.

Mine was missing caulk in several places on the outside, the bunkhouse door and water heater opening leaked massively. The bunk mattress was replaced by the dealer. The slide also leaked from day one and never stopped leaking.

Our first night in it, the kids were afraid of sleeping in the the bunks, so my 5-year old son slept on the jack knife sofa. It was bolted into a plywood platform using undersize lag bolts. In the middle of the night the bolts tore out of the plywood and the couch flipped, my son rolled off into the stove and cut his head open. I fixed that with hex bolts w/washers when we got home.

Then slowly, the frame started bending towards the back, due to the infamous BAL Norco aluminum frame. The countertop started to bend visibly, you could sit a level on it, and the level would rock. No help from Dutchmen/THOR, out of warranty, although it was a known issue at that point, many of the 28ft+ units were bending due to this frame. My understanding was, the fix was to add additional outriggers towards the rear.

I gave up on this disaster in 2008, and traded it in for a new Jayco...what a difference in quality! Only had one minor issue and Jayco authorized the fix under warranty. We just traded that Jayco on a new 2013 Jay Flight 28BHBE for more room, and couldn't be happier.

I will not own anything THOR ever again, unless it's an Airstream. And it's too bad they acquired Airstream, I hope it doesn't ruin the good Airstream name or quality...

[westend]

Well, after they replace the plumbing, you should have some increased confidence about your fresh water system. Too bad it started out so miserably, though.

[Seattle_Lion]

Here is the latest update. The dealer repaired the bad PEX connection and tested again. Almost immediately,another PEX connector leaked massively.Wisely, the dealer is going to replace all of the PEX in the trailer. The service rep noted that there were three more connections than required. He will eliminate these. Maybe I will be able to go camping on 7/3.

Bob

[Roundtwo-40]

I sure am sorry for your troubles, in no way should you be going through this. Here is my questionn for the dealer, if they DO pressure test the water systems at factory QA (seems easy enough to do) AND they did ANY kind of dealer prep at the dealer (That I am assuming you paid extra for....) Followed by your PDI when you were going through it (I know you said yours was less than stellar..) That was 3 chances for them to detect this particular fault (unless it came loose during the tow home in which case I would eat my hat). I don't suppose you got any kind of check list of the prep? May be interesting reading.. I hope they treat you right and you get the rig you paid for and deserve and I hope you keep camping and enjoy RVing, you will be able to tell this story and laugh about it, in later years 🙂
Best wishes.