PATRIOT ACT required personal info before you can negotiate?

[FireRob]

Any one ever told you they can not talk price until they have your name, address, and phone number? Then insist its the law cause of the Patriot Act? One told me this and I couldn't believe they were even saying it.

So I go to the dealership that happens to have the trailer me and my wife like the most. Want to start to find out what they will "really" sell the trailer for and when they start asking questions about me I give them the same answer I give them all. "I will give you my email but, Your not getting my address and phone number until we agree to buy" My main reason is I refuse to give any dealer my phone number because I will get a bunch of unwanted phone calls. I tell each dealer, "Look, I am serious about buying and will be making a purchase in the next couple weeks. This is your one shot to give me your best price. If you don't hear back from me in one week, it means I bought from some one else with a better price then you. I do not want you calling me"

The previous seven RV dealers did not have a problem with this and this is my same technique I used when buying my truck six weeks ago.

They told me it is against the law to talk price with out my info....So does that mean they need the personal info of everyone who looks at their web site or reads the window sticker on a trailer in their lot??? I don't think so!

I was on my way out the door when the manager tried to explain the same thing the sales rep said. I told them how ridiculous it was and that the dealers I talked to earlier that did not mention it once. His response was "their breaking the law and could get a heavy fine"

I told them "OK Ill play along. But once I leave here if I get one phone call I will never set foot on your lot again and I will tell everyone about my experience here" (how's it go? Make one customer happy he tells a friend, Pi$$ him off he tells everyone)

OK so after this long rant any truth to this? I am now well aware of what the patriot act says about paying cash for a car over $10K and what the dealer is required to do but it says nothing about in order to negotiate price??? At least I couldn't find anything.

Should I just let it go or do something about it? (besides go on this tirade on a public forum?)

Thanks for letting me vent and I do want to hear your ideas on the matter.

[Passin_Thru]

That's good info Wyo. My wife and I go in to the dealership after we have all the info and take our dinner from a to-go place. We sit down and eat and watch them sweat. They will walk by, look at how much we have left to eat, and then go back and moan. We have left 1 dealership with exactly what we wanted on Feb 29 at 11:30PM and we had them so tired they would have given it away I believe. It wa worth 6 hours of negotiating too and they even offered free extended warranty if we would come back thee next day to finish paperwork and wait for the final wash job. We buy ours using the internet and going to 3 dealers and just playing them for days. If they call we just say we are working on it but have a better offer.

[thomasmnile]

Think what sales guy told the OP was an extreme stretch of the truth. When we bought our new TT and financed through the dealer's bank line (B of A) there were a couple of Patriot Act related loan documents we had to sign because it's a Federal compliance issue for the bank. But to talk price before purchase...............Nah! Just want to keep the OP on the hook to play him.

[FireRob]

mhardin wrote:
I can't believe this thread has gone on for 5 pages. .

I am shocked also. When I started the tread I figured I would get a few people to tell me to quit my whining and either buy it from him or someone else and that no one would really care. Guess I was wrong.

Going to an RV show tomorrow and really looking forward to it.

[mhardin]

I can't believe this thread has gone on for 5 pages. When a salesperson asks you for personal information before closing, walk and tell him why. There are other dealers.

I once wanted to buy a new truck and the salesperson took me to truck section. Everything there was after-market customized. I told him I wanted an unmodified, factory, truck. The salesman told me "you can't buy them like that anymore". I told him I'm not stupid, show me the trucks. He reiterated that all new trucks came with after-market customization. I told him I'm not stupid and walked. Bought the truck the same day at a dealer about 15 miles away.

[dadmomh]

Agree with dahkota. A dealer shouldn't need anything other than your first name - if you want to give it to them - until you're ready to hand over the check or sign the papers.

So, so glad that we now have the Do Not Call Registry....means we only get about half dozen recorded calls a day. Seems the gov't can't even trace the people because they buy blocks of numbers so quickly that they can't keep up with them. I sure don't want some dealer bothering me with his song and dance when I'm not ready. First name should be quite enough.

[Thom02099]

Interesting situation.

1 - Any time someone makes a statement, in this type of scenario, that "it is the law", I would say "Show me that law". This particular dealership presumably has used this ploy hundreds of times. They've trained their people to say this and perhaps quote small portions of the law, taken out of context. I would politely tell them that, since they are familiar with that law, to give me the pertinent information, in the context of our conversation, ie, to start a preliminary price negotiation. Ask them if they have a printed copy of that law IN TOTAL that I could read.

2 - Running your credit report without your specific written permission (in a face-to-face contact) is a very definite violation of credit law under FCRA. There must be a permissible reason for it, and since you have not granted permission, there is no reason for it. File a complaint against the dealership under FCRA.

[Campinfan]

give then the phone number of your obnoxious neighbor...co worker etc. lol

[Huntindog]

They are wanting to find out your credit record.

For one thing, this can tell them if you are capable of buying a unit... And just how bad they can stick it to you. Those with worse credit get worse terms... Much worse than they can really get. Dealers are aware that poor credit risks are just happy to get financed. And that great credit risks likely know that they are able to drive a very hard bargain because of it.

The dealer is an adversary. They know it, and realize that to beat the adversary, the first step is find out as much as they can about rhem.

Know your opponent.

When I bought my TV new back in 2010, the dealer started asking and writing down all of my info.. I asked if he was doing a credit app... "It's just a standard form"
I said don't bother with it, as I will be writing you a check, when the truck arrives.

Negotiations sped up dramatically. He knew that I had the ultimate power. CASH. Money talks, and can easily walk.... Right to the next dealer.

[opnspaces]

Interesting replies on the topic.

Personally I have no problem giving the salesman my phone number. If I'm serious about buying they are going to need it. If I wasn't serious and they call I thank them for the call and tell them I already bought a car. They are always polite and I have never received a second call after we hang up.

[mrkoje]

skripo wrote:


I was looking for a very particular car that only one dealer had.

If that's the case and it was in fact "unique" and I knew I had the only one I would have politely told you to pound sand on your offer.

Glad it worked out for you though.

[SprinklerMan]

How do you tell when a salesman is lying ? Their lips are moving

[Ron3rd]

"Any one ever told you they can not talk price until they have your name, address, and phone number? Then insist its the law cause of the Patriot Act?"

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!

That's a new one! What will they lie about next?

[dspencer]

loulou57 wrote:

dspencer wrote:
I'm a manager in the car business in the Midwest and I can tell you like the others here, they flat out lied to you. The Patriot Act has nothing to do with making you give your personal information to a dealer when your shopping around for a camper or vehicle.

Now as one of the other posters stated that a dealer required him to give all of his personal information when he was paying with a cashier's check. This practice went out many years ago in most dealerships. It was geared towards giving the dealer the opportunity to look at your credit report and see if you could afford to pay cash or not :h There thinking was that if you have bad credit you can't afford to pay cash. It has nothing to do with gathering personal information for the required Govt. forms. It was nothing but a sham practice that most dealers has quit using these days.

If you are paying cash, what concern would it be to a dealer, your credit score? He is getting his money. Is he just nosey? Here, you have to ask permission and have a signed document to be able to check someone's credit rating. It comes under the privacy act.

The explanation is that they look at your credit score to determine if your check is good and if it isn't do they have a chance of recovering anything. As I stated it's a farce that most reputable dealers gave up long ago.

[dave54]

obgraham wrote:
I'm sort of with OP on not wanting a bunch of calls when I'm only at the looking around stage. Some of these guys are really persistent.

I have a simple solution -- I give them a cell number that I no longer have. They're happy, and I move on without wasting my time arguing.

X2

Whenever a salesman asks for address and phone I give him one. Usually one I just make up on the spot.

When we actually start filling out the sales paperwork I give him the real one.