Weight question

[Mi2bugz]

I have a:

2012 Dodge Ram 1500 4.7L V8 65RFE trans quad cab 4x2 Rambox 6'4" bed
GVWR 6700
GAWR 3700 front / 3900 rear
GCWR 11,250
3.55 axle
Bumper says: 5000 lbs max gross trailer weight / 500 lbs max tongue weight

RV dealer says trailer life towing guide says can tow 7300 (I see that also) BUT ram trucks.com says max trailer 5950. They recommend the husky weight distribution hitch.

We were looking at a 2018 Avenger ATI 27DBS based on the towing guides limits. Actual weight is 6450 tongue weight 742 (tongue weight not actually weighed on scale...yet).Only 3 occupants on average 250 lbs per person (per dealer) in TT. RV dealer says we do NOT need to include weight of passengers and TV cargo in weight factor (GCWR). Unless I read it wrong...I read you DO need to factor in passengers, gas and TV cargo. So since reading ram trucks.com limits I am second guessing choice.

My questions are:

1) what weights do I go by (I am guessing manufacturer for safety/insurance/NHTSA/DOT regulations)?

2) after telling dealer about my concerns the dealer says (in writing...text message) "GM said you should be able to pull that camper still", "I can't see your truck only being able to pull 5900 lbs and being a V8". Being a V8 I was surprised to see the weight listed by manufacturer as 5950. Does that sound low for a V8?

3) does weight distribution hitch allow hitch to hold more weight then bumper states (500 max tongue)

4) at 6450 TT weight I need to be between 645 and 967 (10-15%) on the tongue correct?

5) I have ridden in a TV towing a TT before and felt extremely ill from my the push and pull (no up and down or side/side) motion. Is the forward/backward motion normal when pulling TT's? If it is normal...can anything help reduce it?

6) we only have 3 payments left on truck so we really don't want to have a truck and TT payment. Are my only options upgrading the TV if we really want the Avenger? Or are there modifications to the TV we can make to make it capable of towing 6450 and supplies...legally?

Sorry lots of questions but would like some insight from people with experience NOT making a commission. TYIA ~ Nicole

[dodge_guy]

Mi2bugz wrote:
Thank you all for your advice. I truly appreciate it. I don't have much experience with towing or mechanics but my husband was an OTR tractor trailer driver so I am confident in his towing capabilities. He has mentioned multiple times wanting a TT so this is going to be a surprise for him. Hence why so many questions. He is a wounded warrior battling PTSD and doesn't like to get out and do anything where there are crowds. Figured this would be the perfect activity to do as a family that would let him be in a comfort zone in smaller camping/rv parks with the ability to go to his space (in TT) if needed. Think we have decided to upgrade his truck and then I will surprise him with a TT. Again....thank you all.

Very good. And when you do go shopping add 1200-1500lbs to the trailers dry weight. then you will be close to what you are going to be towing when loaded for a trip. after you have the trailer you want then take it fully loaded for a trip weigh it and get the tongue weight at 12%. this will make it tow properly. Lots of details yes, but once you get it set up right you will be very happy wit it.

[Grit_dog]

Getting a truck with a little more snort and carrying capacity will make the experience more pleasant for sure, but, now, knowing more about the equation (your husbands capability/ experience), I'd say get him involved, as much as you want to make it a surprise.
Again, depends on where and how far you're towing. Also, a happy medium, a bit lighter and smaller trailer may be a viable option. If you already have a good pickup that you know well and like, you can find many campers that are within its capabilities and you're travel expectations.

Also, thank your husband for his service as well!

[Mi2bugz]

Thank you all for your advice. I truly appreciate it. I don't have much experience with towing or mechanics but my husband was an OTR tractor trailer driver so I am confident in his towing capabilities. He has mentioned multiple times wanting a TT so this is going to be a surprise for him. Hence why so many questions. He is a wounded warrior battling PTSD and doesn't like to get out and do anything where there are crowds. Figured this would be the perfect activity to do as a family that would let him be in a comfort zone in smaller camping/rv parks with the ability to go to his space (in TT) if needed. Think we have decided to upgrade his truck and then I will surprise him with a TT. Again....thank you all.

[Grit_dog]

You don’t necessarily need a brand new truck though.
You can upgrade to a similar year/Miles/condition as yours for only a reasonable upcharge if you’re a saavy buyer

[Grit_dog]

ScottG wrote:
Way, way too much trailer for that truck. You will hate the combination.

Yeah pretty much spot on. Especially given you have zero towing experience or mechanical aptitude. Good thing you’re asking questions before purchasing.

To break it down more, chassis will handle that much trailer fine with proper mods.
4.7 and 3.55s will be a turd on anything but flat low altitude traveling.

I’d tow that all day with your truck from a safety standpoint (including trailer brakes and airbags and a wdh with the squishy coil rear end). I’d balk most at the power.
BUT it depends on your intended use. Short day trips to campgrounds in the flatlands, letter rip. X country, and mountains? Nope

[sgfrye]

dodge guy wrote:
Well first off if the trailer actual weight is 6450lbs, then when loaded for a trip with propane, battery clothes, food, cooking utensils, towels chairs and anything else you will likely bring will put you around 7700lbs loaded for a trip. too much for the 4.7L.

And the weight on the bumper is for the bumper itself, the hitch has a different rating for WD hitch.

either bigger truck or smaller trailer. if you want to keep the trailer below 6000lbs then look for a trailer with a dry weight of 4500lbs.

good basic advice because its not possible to test drive a potential new rig to the cat scales.

[ScottG]

Way, way too much trailer for that truck. You will hate the combination.

[ppine]

Salesmen around the world are famous for telling you that your truck will handle the largest trailer no problem. "You won't even know it is back there."
Actually you will be accutely aware of it.

Your truck is rated for around 6,000 pounds. Your trailer weighs more than that empty. You either need a lighter trailer or a heavier truck.

If you are going to tow in the mountains and turkey trails it is best not to max out your truck, and much better to stay several thousand pounds under the weight your truck is rated for.

[dodge_guy]

Well first off if the trailer actual weight is 6450lbs, then when loaded for a trip with propane, battery clothes, food, cooking utensils, towels chairs and anything else you will likely bring will put you around 7700lbs loaded for a trip. too much for the 4.7L.

And the weight on the bumper is for the bumper itself, the hitch has a different rating for WD hitch.

either bigger truck or smaller trailer. if you want to keep the trailer below 6000lbs then look for a trailer with a dry weight of 4500lbs.

[APT]

In order to comfortably, safely, and reliably tow a 4000+ pound TT with your truck, you should have the following:

Heavy Duty Transmission cooler (usually part of HD towing or trailering equipment packages). If you are unsure, consult your window sticker if you have it or the Ram dealer. Towing anything high waled takes a lot of power. This means the transmission is shifting a lot in order to keep the engine in it's power making range, which is very much different than unloaded. Every shift means extra heat.

A brake controller. I highly recommend a proportional one such as Tekonsha's Prodigy line (P2/P3). Their cost is reasonable at $120-150. Installation and adjustment are simple. Braking performance is smooth and strong when needed.

Your truck requires a WDH to tow anything over 500 pounds of TW. That's about 4000 pounds loaded and 3200-3500 pounds dry. So you will likely need one and holes will also likely be drilled into the trailer's A-frame. I recommend one with integrated sway control. They tend to cost about $500 compared to $300 for standard. Owners that have had both report noticeable improvements. Learn how to adjust the WDH you end up buying.

If you have the above and towed the proposed Avenger model, I estimate your truck will be 500 pounds over GCWR, GVWR, and tow rating as well as over rear axle. I do not expect a comfortable experience with that combination due to the soft suspension. Performance may also not be acceptable. That V8 is weak and the transmission and axle gears will not help it.

Your questions show lack of experience. That's fine we all have to start somewhere. I do not recommend starting out with first RV towing overloaded.

My Advice: Rent a similar TT similar for a week/weekend. Gain some experience. Or sell the truck, use the cash from equity to buy a used TT. Buy a more capable truck. Any 2011+ 3/4 ton would make towing most TTs as effortless as possible allowing you to enjoy the drive and camping experience.

[kennywg11]

Well, we have found, sold and refurb'd over 200 vintage travel trailers in the last six years.
We have been asked all these questions, over and over, usually from gals, who make up 75% of our buyers.

First, please humble yourself, and go get a guy who has personal experience in this kind of towing selection to assist..

Second, forget a 27 ft TT to start with - too big, too heavy, too complicated for a newbie. Most or all of the desirable features are available in a 18 to 22 ft lighter easier to manage TT.

Third, join a girls' TT group and/or forum. You'll get real-life answers and advice, and make life-long friends.

Good luck. Happy Camping !
Ken in Colorado, camper, hiker, and RV'er since 1974.
www.vintage-travel-trailer.com

[Mi2bugz]

@bobbo - thank you for your time in posting all of that info. Really really helps

@mitch - truck does have the square 2" piece and your photo looks really similar to what they showed us. They said we had the place for the brake but not the "guts" of it so they would have to install it.

[MitchF150]

Well, there should already be holes drilled in the frame to accommodate a frame mounted hitch. That's what they include from the factory if you have the basic "tow package"..

In other words, it should already have a 2" square hitch that looks something like this.



Plus, you will need the big 7 pin electric plugin to the trailer for the electric trailer brakes...

When it's all said and done, at the minimum, it should look like this with the WD bars attached and all.



Do you have a brake controller?

On edit, the "tow/haul" button does not add any more "power"... It only changes how the trans shifts. In other words, it will make the engine rev more to get into it's power band, so expect some 3000+ rpms at times.. 😉

Mitch

[Mi2bugz]

It does have the tow button. Not sure what it is called but the manual says it gives it more power (runs at higher RPM's).