PULLING 20K OR BETTER

[prodeville]

I'm hearing that you really need a MDT or HDT to pull a fifth wheel over 20k. The MDT is expensive and a used HDT is huge. Is there anybody out there pulling that weight with a 3500/4500 or 350/450 with no problem? What about breaking?
I'm looking at A DRV, Augusta or a Continental.

[Cummins12V98]

IdaD wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:
My truck and RV in Sig tows a combined load of 32,950# CAT scale. DRV is 23k with rear axle at 9,880#. Truck sits level with factory rear air ride suspension. Rock solid in very windy conditions. Also confident descent on 14 percent grades.

No a MDT/HDT is not needed to pull a DRV!!!

What's your RAWR?

I think you know the answer. It's 9,750# that is what it will weigh when I remove the SouthBend clutch, pressure plate and flywheel I won in a drawing and kelp when I clean out some unwanted items.

[RustyJC]

avvidclif1 wrote:

RustyJC wrote:
You can certainly drive a Class 8 tractor if you want, but the point of this thread is that it is not necessary. Some of us prefer not to drive HDTs, and we can tow our heavy 5th wheels just fine with today's available 3500 duallies.

Rusty

Obviously you missed the header in the original post. It asked about pulling a 20k+ 5th wheel. Nothing about dualies or HDT's. I gave an opinion based on price vs capability and threw in ride as a plus. If you need a daily driver buy a prius.

Nothing in the OP about daily drivers, either. The fact of the matter is that, when we're on the road with our 5th wheel, our Ram IS our daily driver, and it's also capable of towing 5th wheels over 20,000 lbs GVWR.

If you like Class 8s, have at it, but the original post asked if it was necessary to use a MDT or Class 8 tractor to pull a 20K+ 5th wheel. The answer is no, it's not, and I've given the numbers to prove it.

Rusty

[avvidclif1]

RustyJC wrote:
You can certainly drive a Class 8 tractor if you want, but the point of this thread is that it is not necessary. Some of us prefer not to drive HDTs, and we can tow our heavy 5th wheels just fine with today's available 3500 duallies.

Rusty

Obviously you missed the header in the original post. It asked about pulling a 20k+ 5th wheel. Nothing about dualies or HDT's. I gave an opinion based on price vs capability and threw in ride as a plus. If you need a daily driver buy a prius.

[SoCalDesertRid1]

jmadren wrote:

SoCalDesertRider wrote:
... It's the same width as a dually pickup, 96". ...

But a pickup dually is only that wide at the rear wheels - the rest is the same as any other pickup. Opening the doors and getting in/out while parked in a regular parking space is not the same in a MDT/HDT.

The cab of my truck is narrower than the bed and rear tires. Not as narrow as a pickup cab, but it is narrower by about 6" or so.

My truck is high enough that doors open above the roofs of many small passenger cars. LOL

I was never one to try to park my long wheelbase dually F350 in a small up front parking space. I always parked out back and walked. So I park my International in the same places I parked my old dually F350. There was no practical change in how I use the new truck versus the old one.

I didn't use my dually F350 as a daily driver, errand running around town vehicle. I don't use the International that way either. I have a Ranger and a Tacoma for errand running and such.

[RustyJC]

Chad Brooks wrote:
Rusty, are you certain on the rear axle being different on ram 3500's ? What package are you referring to?

The 385/900 3500s with the Aisin AS69RC get the 11.8" AAM rear axle. 68RFE trucks get the 11.5" AAM.

Rusty

[IdaD]

NC Hauler wrote:
The RAWR per Ram is 9750# at 65 psi...tires will take 80 psi...AAM rates this rear axle to 11300#. With all 4 tires filled to 80 psi., (max sidewall pressure), per AAM, axle is then rated to 10, 200#...

So just like all levels of pickup truck, the published "max tow" rating is rubbish in the real world.

[Chad_Brooks]

Rusty, are you certain on the rear axle being different on ram 3500's ? What package are you referring to?

[jmadren]

SoCalDesertRider wrote:
... It's the same width as a dually pickup, 96". ...

But a pickup dually is only that wide at the rear wheels - the rest is the same as any other pickup. Opening the doors and getting in/out while parked in a regular parking space is not the same in a MDT/HDT.

[NC_Hauler]

jims1 wrote:
Once you hit the Continental Coach weight range, a true MDT will be needed. The CC coaches are in the 25K+ range. Friends of our have a CC that weighs 27k with empty tanks. For most DRV's and lower brands, you can go with a $70k pickup if you want.
We went with a fully loaded 610 Volvo for $19k already converted with 443000 miles on it.

So you've now moved the weight from 23K,(OP) and went to 25-27K plus..guess you'll get to where you need to justify a semi tractor rig....We were at 23K...It only takes common sense and simple math to figure at what 5er GVW that one would need a semi to tow it...You hit it..though your example is not that of the original post..re-read..
Well, got admit I paid about 63K for my fully loaded 2016 3500...full warranty and extremely comfortable and I can pull it into my carport, take it to drive thru ATM, Micky Dee drive thru, park at grocery store in regular parking places and use it as my daily driver to and from work..I can tow with it and park in church parking lot on Sunday..I can use the bed to haul a load of wood or whatever. use it all the time for any and everything...don't need a semi tractor no matter the price WAAY to big and not very practical in every day life to most...If they're so popular, one would think you would observe piles of them towing 5er's on the highway...I haven't seen it...A select few towing heavy 5er's that can now be towed by a 350/3500 and will argue till they're blue in the face that they're right, everyone else is wrong..Main reason I rarely frequent the escapees forum..extremely rude people ganging up on those that believe the way I do in today's world..The times, they are a changing.

[RustyJC]

You can certainly drive a Class 8 tractor if you want, but the point of this thread is that it is not necessary. Some of us prefer not to drive HDTs, and we can tow our heavy 5th wheels just fine with today's available 3500 duallies.

Rusty

[avvidclif1]

If you've never driven a big rig you would be surprised at the difference in ride. Air ride seats, cab, and suspension make for a very nice ride. Better than any dually, loaded or unloaded. A 2007 and earlier Volvo VNL630 has no smog stuff and will turn inside a F350. The mid cab version w/sleeper when single axled makes a very nice tow rig. They can be had for under 30k with less than 500,000 mi. My 2 cents.

[laknox]

jmadren wrote:

1jeep wrote:
id rather not!

Quite honestly im no weight police member but after towing 15k with a 250 and now the same trailer with a dually I will stick to what the manufacturer has rated for certain loads.

The limiting factor for towing a FW is rear axle load. Almost everything else between the various pickup classes is identical (or can be configured identical) except the rear axle. The ASHS removes that from the equation and gives you better stability and control.

Don't dismiss it out of hand until you've researched it well.

AND an extra axle for braking. Personally, I kinda like these, but don't have the scratch to buy one. 🙂

Lyle

[Hardline]

Just read the new F550s have upped the anti to 40,000lbs

[SoCalDesertRid1]

My MDT is 9' tall at the roof, but it's 4x4 too. Most 2wd heavy MDT on 22.5" wheels are about a foot shorter.

It's the same width as a dually pickup, 96".

MDT come in a multitude of frame lengths, so one can be as short as about 16' and as long as you want it. Mine is a crew cab with 12.5' bed and extra long front frame/bumper, so is about 25' long overall. Without the crew cab and extra long bumper, it would be about 20' long, which is about as long as my F350 crew cab 8' bed pickup. MDT can have beds as short as 9'.

2001 International 4800
33,000 GVWR
12,000 FGAWR
21,000 RGAWR
16,000 UVW
17,000 Payload

[zb39]

OP, looks like a newer 3500 dually will handle it just fine.