Slider Hitch = More Control Backing Up?

[Retired_02]

My limited experience of two years with a 5th wheel was preceded with 20 years of travel trailer experience. I found it much more difficult to back up with a 5th wheel, especially if you are trying to reposition the unit a few feet to the side while backing.

I have read explanations that with the pivot point for a 5th wheel being right over the axle, this makes it difficult to move the kingpin laterally to the side. You can crank the front end of your vehicle around - the center of the rear axle does not move that much to the side.

In contrast, the travel trailer has the pivot point several feet behind the rear axle. You crank your front end around and the trailer hitch pivot point moves quite a bit to the side and trailer can be backed up and repositioned to the side more easily.

Although I have a slider hitch, I never used the slider as the contoured nosecone of the fifth wheel allowed fairly tight turns without using the slider. But after several instances where I was having difficulty backing up, it finally dawned on me. By sliding the 5th wheel hitch to the rear, the pivot point is also transferred behind the axle.

I then experimented with backing up using the slider. I found I can crank my front end around and get the trailer to respond much more than when the hitch is over the axle. It is not as much as travel trailer as the distance is only 10-12". But the change in handling is clearly evident. If you are backing into a spot and don't have a lot distance back and forth, you can more easily get the trailer to move a foot or two to one side or the other.

Using the slider puts some wag into the tail like a travel trailer. Wag that makes it easier to control backing up a 5th wheel.

Users of slider hitches - do you agree?

[Retired_02]

JIMNLIN wrote:

Retired wrote:
Using the slider puts some wag into the tail like a travel trailer. Wag that makes it easier to control backing up a 5th wheel.

Users of slider hitches - do you agree?

100 percent.
Not a new thing as manual operated sliding hitch owners have been doing this since the hitch industry gave us a sliding hitch and advertised that fact

JIMNLIN, I wish that they had advertised the fact that a slider adds to maneuverability when backing up. There was nothing in the manuals with my Curt Hitch. I also researched forums about techniques in backing a FW. Nothing ever mentioned about using the slider to cause FW to turn more quickly and tighter.

It may have to wait until next spring, but I would like to do a controlled experiment in an empty parking lot with painted parking lines. Start with unit at the same exact spot, with FW and truck in a straight line.

First time with hitch in forward position; kingpin over the axle. Crank wheels fully over and back up until trailer is at tight angle. Measure the angle and the distance to the rear the trailer has moved.

Second time with the slider to the rear: kingpin behind the axle. Crank wheels fully and back up until you reach the same measured angle as first one. Then measure the distance to the rear the trailer has moved. It should be less and would be basic way to measure the tighter turning circle enabled through use of slider in the rear position. Will be interesting to see what difference there will be.

[WeBeFulltimers]

This 20 year trucker agrees...It's all in the set up!

[JIMNLIN]

Retired wrote:
Using the slider puts some wag into the tail like a travel trailer. Wag that makes it easier to control backing up a 5th wheel.

Users of slider hitches - do you agree?

100 percent.
Not a new thing as manual operated sliding hitch owners have been doing this since the hitch industry gave us a sliding hitch and advertised that fact.

My limited experience of two years with a 5th wheel was preceded with 20 years of travel trailer experience. I found it much more difficult to back up with a 5th wheel, especially if you are trying to reposition the unit a few feet to the side while backing.

I have many years of backing GN/5th wheel/bumper pull trailers around construction worksites and loading yard docks , plus my RVs, but I find a GN/5th wheel hitch trailer doesn't react as quick as a bumper pull trailer and requires more steering input.

[Me_Again]

IN THE BEGINNING, most people do not pull far enough ahead, which is part of the set-up! I say pull ahead 1.5 times what you use to think was needed, and you will soon learn to the required skill set to back a 5th wheel. I use to back my 29' Sea Ray boat around the front corner of my house and into a large garage in the back. Then I got a bigger boat that stay in the water and a 26' 5th wheel. Had a much harder time getting the 5th wheel in to the garage than the boat! Chris

[C-Bears]

When we are on the road for extended periods of time it takes two or three stops at different CG's to shake the rust off.

You are 100% correct Retired02, the set-up is the most important step.

[jevanb]

Retired 02 wrote:




the key to backing a FW is all in the set-up.

right on.. I could put my tt anywhere and then with the 5er you have to set up and now I can put that longer trailer in tighter spots then the TT, the set up is the key, get the front tires in position before you place it in reverse

[MTPockets1]

I have had slider in shortbed truck and backed in both positions, I now have long bed dully with no slider. I also had several boats and a travel trailer.... Backing gets easier with time and practice. Each has it's own characteristic and at the point you become comfortable, then that becomes the easiest. In other words, there was a time I felt backing the boat or trailer was easiest, I now feel my long bed dully is easiest as I've grown more proficient.

[Retired_02]

C-Bears wrote:
Yes and no. What you are saying is correct. In my younger days I drove truck/tractor/trailers. There was a noticeable difference in backing up a conventional tractor (long nose) and a cab-over type tractor (no nose). When you change pivot points, weather it be the capture plate, the sliding rear axles on the trailer, or a shorter front steer axle difference, you change how that rig handles backing up.

What I believe makes it easier for most folks to back up their FW's is practice, practice, practice, and doing it the exact same every time. I suppose if you were going to slide your hitch back each and every time and always did it that way then it could be a good way to go.

C-Bears, I totally agree with the practice, practice, practice. In recent travels, we camped in wide variety of national, state & private campgrounds in a 33' FW. Some camping sites were very tight and challenging to get into. Having now experimented with maneuvering with slider in back position, I think I would have had far less difficulty with slider back.

You can make the FW react more quickly in less distance. That makes the effort of moving the slider back worthwhile when faced with a tight fit into a campsite. So, not necessary to use slider unless it would be helpful.

I know from speaking with a long time professional truck driver, that the key to backing a FW is all in the set-up. How you pull up and position your rig before backing makes it work or not work. I do need more practice, but when trying to back into a tight campsite, I now know that I have the slider as a tool to help as well. Thanks for your response.

[N-Trouble]

I can't see moving the pivot point back 12" making that much of a difference. Your still nowhere close to the pivot point of a TT.

[avvidclif1]

I've been meaning to try the "slide it back" to back up. Just to see how much effect it had. So far I haven't needed it for clearance issues and don't have too many problems with the trailer backing. Laziness I guess, why add one more step?

[Jack_Diane_Free]

When I had a large 5er I used a Superglide Automatic slider and really did not find much difference between backing the 5er and previous and current TT.

[C-Bears]

Yes and no. What you are saying is correct. In my younger days I drove truck/tractor/trailers. There was a noticeable difference in backing up a conventional tractor (long nose) and a cab-over type tractor (no nose). When you change pivot points, weather it be the capture plate, the sliding rear axles on the trailer, or a shorter front steer axle difference, you change how that rig handles backing up.

What I believe makes it easier for most folks to back up their FW's is practice, practice, practice, and doing it the exact same every time. I suppose if you were going to slide your hitch back each and every time and always did it that way then it could be a good way to go.