Which engine for a used Winnebago Journey?

[siguccs]

I'd like to buy a 36 ft used Winnebago Journey. For the price I can afford, there are two engines available, Cat 7.2 liter or Cummins 5.9 liter.
Do you think one is significantly better than the other? My main concers are power in the hills and reliability.

Thanks!

[RCtime]

John Wayne wrote:
Are both allison transmissions the same, or does the 5.9 have a smaller 5 speed and the cat a bigger 6 speed?

The Allison 3000 transmission came standard with the Cat. engine.
a 6 speed and more robust transmission.

The allison 2500 5 speed came standard with the cummins engine, with an option for an upgrade for a Allison 3000 transmission.

Personally I would opt for the Cat./Allison combo and would only consider the Cummins if it had been ordered with the optional upgrade to the Allison 3000.

This was when I was shopping for a new Journey in 2004, and found my like new 2002 Journey.

[smlranger]

We owned a 2002 36' Journey for 8 years with the CAT 3126E 330 HP engine and the Allison MH3000 transmission. Never had any problems. The CAT ran flawlessly and had good power for that size coach. I would not want less torque/HP than the 330 in that size coach.

[tatest]

I would choose the C-7 Cat over a 5.9 Cummins. Even if the Cummins has the inflated 300 HP rating and the Cat is rated low (300 HP rather than 330 or 360) the 16% larger Cat has 30-40% more torque and will be generating the power at lower RPM.

Other sizes? I would probably choose the 8.3 Cummins over a C-7 for the same reason, but might choose a C-9 over a C-series, because the 9 is more comparable to Cummins similar size ISL. But sinceyour choices this time are C-7 vs B-series, the C-7 was the engine upgrade on the Journey. It was a pretty expensive upgrade. It came with a heavier grade transmission to handle the extra torque, and that was a big part of the cost difference.

[chloe_s_ranch]

A few years ago we had similar size rv, a 2006 Winnebago Tour 36 rd, with the 350hp Cat C7 engine. It was a little slow up mountain grades, especially towing our Jeep Wrangler. I wouldn't want a smaller engine powering that heavy of a motorhome, especially if you are towing, or doing a lot of mountain driving.

[John_Wayne]

Are both allison transmissions the same, or does the 5.9 have a smaller 5 speed and the cat a bigger 6 speed?

[tinkerer]

I would opt for the C7 CAT. My experience with the small Cummins has not been good on my motorhome and my farm machinery. The design is good but the problems always come back to poor quality control of the components made in their Brazilian factory. If you get a good one they are good but if you get a bad one it gets very expensive.:)

[DSDP_Don]

In similar sized engines like the Cat C-7 vs the ISC, I would take the Cummins. When it comes to the Cat C-7 vs the Cummins ISB, I would definitely by the Cat. It's a well built engine and is definitely more powerful.

Just make sure what transmission the two have. The Cat should be mated to the Allison 3000, but the smaller ISB might be mated to the Allison 2500. The Allison 2500 would always be a deal breaker because you can never uprate the power on the engine because the trans is maxed out at torque and HP.

[Fleet_Man]

Buy the coach that is in the better overall condition and best satisfies your desires as something to live in. Yes, the Cat has more pulling power and will get you up the hills faster but the Cummins will also do the job, just not as quickly. We bought ours new and I was very concerned about the power differences between the two choices. My first trip with it, Cabbage Hill near Pendleton, OR, the pull from Ogden, UT to Evanston, WY and the "hill" just east of Laramie, WY were my test pulls. The ISB-02/2500MH combination got me up those hills, pulling a 4,000# toad quite comfortably. Not as spunky as the Corvette I used to have but faster than my Ford PSD pulling a 27' TT over the same route.

[cudntherd]

Cat does have On the Highway Trucks... Check out the CT660.
http://www.cat.com/en_US/products/new/equipment/on-highway-trucks/on-highway-trucks/18463770.html

[DownTheAvenue]

Big Katuna wrote:

DownTheAvenue wrote:
The Cummins 5.9 may not have as much power as the Cat, but I think the Cummins is a better choice. It is absolutely bullet proof, and more places are equipped to ork on the Cummins as the Cat. Capable Cat service centers will continue to decline since Cat is no longer in over the road engines.

Total nonsense. Any diesel house that works on Cummins will work on the CAT.
There are zillions of CATs in dump trucks and buses and boats. I'll take torque over brand any day. Would I take a C7 over an ISC? No.

My statement is not total nonsense. It is a fact. There is NO market share of Cat engines in the USA over the road. Cat is not marketing their engines for over the road in the USA. Actually, I believe they have exited the entire North American market, but I don't know for sure. As the existing over the road engines continue to go off line, there will be less demand for service. With less demand, the available centers for servicing these engines will shrink. Simple economics and common sense.

Having said that, there are many Cat engines that have given exemplary service, but they will not last forever, and every new commercial vehicle will not be powered by a Cat engine!

[ScottG]

I agree they are both good enhines. I would not let one or the other sway my purchase choice.
Heck, I'd be more concerned about the colors and tire age.

[Two_Jayhawks]

They are both excellent engines and easily serviced anywhere. But if everything else is equal here I would choose the 7.2L over the 5.9L all day long.

[Big_Katuna]

DownTheAvenue wrote:
The Cummins 5.9 may not have as much power as the Cat, but I think the Cummins is a better choice. It is absolutely bullet proof, and more places are equipped to ork on the Cummins as the Cat. Capable Cat service centers will continue to decline since Cat is no longer in over the road engines.

Total nonsense. Any diesel house that works on Cummins will work on the CAT.
There are zillions of CATs in dump trucks and buses and boats. I'll take torque over brand any day. Would I take a C7 over an ISC? No.

[FIRE_UP]

siguccs wrote:
I'd like to buy a 36 ft used Winnebago Journey. For the price I can afford, there are two engines available, Cat 7.2 liter or Cummins 5.9 liter.
Do you think one is significantly better than the other? My main concers are power in the hills and reliability.

Thanks!

As usual, there will be biased opinions here. I've only owned a CAT in our present coach, a coach that is simaler but, a step up from a Journey. Ours is an '04 Itasca Horizon 36GD with the C-7 330HP CAT and the Allison MH3000 trans. It's been a great coach and, a great engine. I've had "0" problems with that engine. Yes, there are reports of issues with certain parts of the later generation C-7 engine but, the one thing that's important is, you only read of reports on here.

What about the zillion owners of CATs out there, in motor homes, trucks, long haul machines and more, that have not had any issues and, don't report every spit and sputter on a forum??? And, I'm by far, no Cummins expert, not even close but, as I understand it, Cummins has had its share of issues over the years too.

Those of you that know Cummins better might chime in here and speak of wrist pin issues, something about a warning of heating but, it's too late by then, something like that. Again, I'm not trying to sway you one way or another. Keep an open mind.

One thing that no one can deny, there's no substitute for Cubic Inches. The 7.2 C-7 is a larger engine than the 5.9 Cummins. The C-7, in all three versions, 300, 330 and 350 horse power, all put out, 860 ft. lbs. of torque at around 1400 or so RPM. If I recall, that 5.9 puts out around 600 but, I need Cummins experts to verify that number is either high or low.

One of the benefits of owning a Cummins is, Cummins has sort of "authorized" the use of things like the "Banks Kit" for its engines. CAT, on the other hand, is very "tight-lipped" about just about everything on their engines and, to the best of my knowledge, there no approved Banks type kits that can be installed on them. You can "chip" them if you like but, there's mixed results on that too.

So, while CAT has ceased production of over the road engines for at least the U.S. Market, as has been stated, there's tons of parts still available, there's plenty of CAT techs hanging around, that is IF YOU SHOULD NEED EITHER ONE OR BOTH.

Scott

[RayChez]

I have the Cat 3126-E which is basicly the same as the C-7 except no smog devices on it and it is a better engine then a 5.9 Cummins. More torque for sure and I have never had any problem servicing my Cat engine at any Cat or Freight liner shops.

I had a couple of 5.9 Cummins blow up on me in the year 2000 brand new, so I stay away from the ISB Cummins. Just my experience with both, but do what you want to do, not what I have or MR Doe.