Gas or Diesel

[C_B_]

My Son is looking to get a 2015 Ford F-350 CC SB.

He's trying to decide between the 6.2 gas or pay extra for the 6.7 diesel.


He currently has a 6.0 diesel so he knows how the diesel pulls.

Question is how good will the 6.2 gasser do pulling his Cedar Creek 362BBS with a GVWR of 14,000 lbs.


Thanks in advance for your input.

C.B.

[pnichols]

Vulcaneer wrote:
Another important thing is...at what RPM.

"At what RPM" can be taken care of completely by overall vehicle gearing. That doesn't mean gearing is always correct for a gasser to provide one with the drive axle torque needed at one's desired speed. However, "correct" gasser gearing can convert it's horsepower to - if it's horsepower is the same as any diesel it's being compared to - the same pulling power as the diesel. That's why I mentioned gearing in my earlier comments above.

Vulcaneer wrote:
Another important thing is...at what RPM. If it makes the Torque (and HP) at a much lower RPM, then the comfort of towing is much better. And your seat of the pants feeling is much better.

Your above words of "comfort" and "seat of the pants feeling" is exactly what I had in mind when I used the word "preference" in my earlier comments above.

For instance in my case: I get a great kick in the seat of the pants from my RV's V10 engine when I press down the gas pedal after the tranny shifts a gear to increase the V10's RPM so as to tap more horsepower. This is the same effect a diesel of equivalent horsepower will produce - just without the gear change.

My "preference" is a high RPM engine - not a thumping/rumbling beast. I much preference the spirited whine of the V10 when pulling up grades and accelerating. Nowadays high RPM engines that are also reliable can be mass produced so as to last a long time ... Ford's truck V10 is an example. For several decades this was not the case - so low RPM diesels became popular all over the world for three reasons - reliably back then being one of them. The other two reasons probably being kick in the seat of the pants without gear changes and ease of production of diesel fuel all over the world as compared to the processes required for gasoline.

[Vulcaneer]

pnichols wrote:

tdeal823 wrote:
Once you have the torque of a diesel at your foot anything else will be like pulling with a KIA.

That's purely a matter of preference and not based on the physics of horsepower conversion.

The only torque that matters is the torque actually being applied to the drive axle(s) ... and what it takes to make that is horsepower conversion by the proper overall vehicle gearing so as to transform that horsepower into drive axle torque.

Diesels pull different than gassers, not intrinsically better than gassers. Thoroughly read and absorb this discussion thread to understand what's really going on with the two different ways of pulling a load:

http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/27698336/srt/pa/pging/1/page/1

Well....that is NOT the only thing that matters. Nor is the HP conversion. Another important thing is...at what RPM. If it makes the Torque (and HP) at a much lower RPM, then the comfort of towing is much better. And your seat of the pants feeling is much better. That is the biggest difference between diesel and gas towing capability and comfort.

Diesel produces the torque and HP at lower RPM. And the curves are much flatter...from bottom to top of the rpm range.

[pnichols]

tdeal823 wrote:
Once you have the torque of a diesel at your foot anything else will be like pulling with a KIA.

That's purely a matter of preference and not based on the physics of horsepower conversion.

The only torque that matters is the torque actually being applied to the drive axle(s) ... and what it takes to make that is horsepower conversion by the proper overall vehicle gearing so as to transform that horsepower into drive axle torque.

Diesels pull different than gassers, not intrinsically better than gassers. Thoroughly read and absorb this discussion thread to understand what's really going on with the two different ways of pulling a load:

http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/27698336/srt/pa/pging/1/page/1

[tdeal823]

DutchmenSport wrote:
Regardless of size, .. if he's a diesel man now, he'll be disappointed if he goes back to gas.

True statement. Once you have the torque of a diesel at your foot anything else will be like pulling with a KIA.
The camper is at that point of diesel territory anyway unless it is all flat towing.

[brholt]

wintersun wrote:
It is not a question of gas versus diesel when the Ford trucks with a gas engine are not rated to tow the planned weight. Two choices, go with diesel or get a lighter trailer.

Hum, looking at Ford's specifications the 6.2 is rated to pull up to 15,000 lb's with the 4.3 axel ratio. You may not want to do it but it falls within Ford's specifications.

[Grit_dog]

C.B. wrote:
My Son is looking to get a 2015 Ford F-350 CC SB.

He's trying to decide between the 6.2 gas or pay extra for the 6.7 diesel.


He currently has a 6.0 diesel so he knows how the diesel pulls.

Question is how good will the 6.2 gasser do pulling his Cedar Creek 362BBS with a GVWR of 14,000 lbs.


Thanks in advance for your input.

C.B.

It will pull that camper like absolute crap. But you prolly heard that already in the last 3 pages.
With a 4klb enclosed single axle snow machine trailer my 13 F250 6.2 is an 8.5 mpg, gas sucking, 2nd gear up hill to keep 50 mph pooch.
Quite possibly the most underwhelming gas V8 in the last 20 years except for the Triton V8s.

[rhagfo]

wintersun wrote:
It is not a question of gas versus diesel when the Ford trucks with a gas engine are not rated to tow the planned weight. Two choices, go with diesel or get a lighter trailer.

It is amazingly simple minded for someone to state that because they have not had to spend thousands on diesel engine repairs that this is the norm. I don't know specifics about the Cummins used in the Ram pickups but the GM and Ford diesels have all had their share of problems that cost $4,000 to $15,000 repair and lots of these repairs were needed on engines with less than 100,000 miles of use. Easy enough to scan the diesel forums and find the information.

When I read all the problems with the diesel engines I decided to buy a new truck and get the warranty instead of buying a used one. With gas I would have been comfortable buying a used truck.

Nor is the norm that every diesel NEEDS thousands in repairs!

Once again just because the Ford/Navistar 6.0 and 6.4 were miserable Diesel engine don't use their repair history as the "NORM".
There are many Cummins and Duramax owners that don't spend huge amounts on maintenance, or repairs.
Just oil and fuel filters and normal antifreeze changes.

[wintersun]

It is not a question of gas versus diesel when the Ford trucks with a gas engine are not rated to tow the planned weight. Two choices, go with diesel or get a lighter trailer.

It is amazingly simple minded for someone to state that because they have not had to spend thousands on diesel engine repairs that this is the norm. I don't know specifics about the Cummins used in the Ram pickups but the GM and Ford diesels have all had their share of problems that cost $4,000 to $15,000 repair and lots of these repairs were needed on engines with less than 100,000 miles of use. Easy enough to scan the diesel forums and find the information.

When I read all the problems with the diesel engines I decided to buy a new truck and get the warranty instead of buying a used one. With gas I would have been comfortable buying a used truck.

[RJCorazza]

I have the 6.2L gas with 3.73 rear. It pulls my 9000 lb trailer well, but if were pulling more I would want a diesel. Diesel Makes about twice the torque, and won't be screaming. I forget the actual numbers, but I'm pretty sure that the diesel makes the same HP at about 1/2 the rpms.
I will say I was impressed with the tow/haul mode downshifting when applying the brake.

[Dave_H_M]

I went from a psd to the 6.2 F250 with 4.30's and I am not looking back. This truck fits well into my needs since I am only pulling a 11.5 fifth wheel.

i say each to his own.

[rhagfo]

Supercharged wrote:

DutchmenSport wrote:
Regardless of size, .. if he's a diesel man now, he'll be disappointed if he goes back to gas.

He will miss the smell, shake, oil on your feet. High price of fuel and high cost to repair the diesel.

Well thi one woke up Supercharged!

Well I would rather get Diesel on my hands working on a truck than gas, it stinks, makes my eyes water. Diesel will wash off with simple soap.
There are many gassers far stinker than a diesel, and pulling power no comparison.

[ol_Bombero-JC]

Supercharged wrote:

DutchmenSport wrote:
Regardless of size, .. if he's a diesel man now, he'll be disappointed if he goes back to gas.

He will miss the smell, shake, oil on your feet. High price of fuel and high cost to repair the diesel.

OP: Ignore the drivel. Wastegate is open.

Hmmmmmm - currently diesel in So. CA is about 30 cents less than gas.

My diesel is now 10 years old - haven't spent a dime on repairs.

No oil on the feet - and IMO that odor you get - - may be *your* Five Day Deodorant Pads are on day ten (or more).

Only thing "shakey" is your opinion, ROTFL..:S

BTW - When HDTs go back to gas engines..........your opinion & credibility will be dramatically enhanced..:W

Hold your breath.

~

[wintersun]

The F-350 if you can get it with the 4.30 gears has a maximum tow capacity of 15,000 lbs. Without the 4.30 gears it has a 13,100 towing capacity. You can see if the F-350 with the gas engine can be special ordered with 4.30 gears.

The alternative is to go with the diesel engine and either 3.73 or 4.30 gears depending upon the platform, F-350 or F-450.

With a 14,000 lb. trailer I would also want the downgrade braking provided by the diesel with its exhaust brake and not want to be relying 100% on the trailer's brakes.

[rhagfo]

If he has towed it with a Diesel before, he will not be happy with gas, that $8,000 is not all written off there is a residual on trade in. The are also deals, well worth the additional actual $4,000. It is one of those things you pay for what you get, may will say they are satisfied with their gas engines, Owners of Diesels say they are Happy with the way they pull.

Get the Diesel.

[ford_truck_guy]

Road Runners wrote:

coolbreeze01 wrote:
If he tows in the mountains, the diesel is nice to have. Have they fixed the exhaust brake on the Ford to work as well as Ram and GM's?

I was not aware that the Ford Super Duty trucks were equipped with exhaust brakes. My truck has a braking capability, but it is with the transmission which shifts down and takes advantage of engine compression to slow the truck.

Do the newer Fords actually use the exhaust for braking?

Here is MY dash in the 2015 in my driveway.. the button to the left at the bottom is the exhaust brake button...