Payload Ratings are a farce

[Dutch_Oven_Man]

Spent months shopping for a new Superduty, ended up ordering one that fit our criteria- XLT, Powerstroke, 3.55 rear-end, Camper package, fifth wheel, etc. We were debating back and forth between a F250 SRW and F350 SRW, ended up with the F250.

The dealer, technical specs in the promo material and everything else from Ford states the payload is 3,450 lbs. I knew with options this number would come down, especially with the diesel. But I was pretty shocked when the sticker on the door said the actual payload is 2,130 lbs. A whole 1,300 lbs less!! Our XLT is pretty basic, but I get it that the diesel and 4x4 adds to this weight, but a 2,130 payload is pretty light for any serious towing. I looked at a F350 SRW on the lot and the door sticker said 2,500 lbs, still really light.

Anyway, I'm not going to worry about it, I've pulled over 100,000 miles on an old F250 with lower ratings with the same camper with no issues. It's just really misleading all the material that is out there touting one number, but in real life, it's much different. My old truck was before the payload numbers were put on the door jamb, so I've been overweight for 17 years and didn't really know it. I have always been within my "owners manual" payload number and combined gross weights, but I'm sure I was 500+ lbs over on payload if they would have measured/reported payload the same in 2001.

I have to say, despite the disappointing door sticker payload numbers, you would never know it...these new trucks are light years ahead of the old ones in handling, power and stopping.

[Lexx]

My 2017 F450 has a payload sticker of 3900 lbs! Now I know the truck is capable of more, but I'm not going to tempt fate. And I was warned that in places like British Columbia, their real weight police will impound your trailer if you are overweight.

Yes, I see lots of folks towing heavy trailers with what would appear to be less than adequately robust tow vehicles. Just last week, I watched what looked like a Dodge Durango tow a pretty good sized trailer. We were on the flatlands of Alberta where it is windy. His tow vehicle and trailer were weaving in opposite directions as he struggled to maintain his speed and lane.

I decided I wasn't going to follow his and cruised on by at 115 KMH. I had zero handling issues and our rig felt rock steady.

Our trailer isn't all that heavy, but I'm reassured that our tow vehicle can handle most conditions safely and comfortably.

[blt2ski]

burningman wrote:
You guys should see the post some guy put on a Dodge truck forum wanting to know what mods would be good so he can haul 50,000 pounds with his 2500... don’t worry, he says he’ll get a “3500 axle” if need be.

Haul, as in in the bed, or tow a 50,000 lb trailer? If towing 50,000 lbs, it could take nothing more than a paid for tag totaling the weight of truck and trailer. Assuming he meets other legal requirements.
If he means literally having a 50,000 lb load in the bed.....He never succeed! He will need at least 4 if not 5 axles, with 20" of tire width per side, 40" total per axle to support the load per road design engineers specs.

One way is easy doable, other, not worth the effort.

Marty

[burningman]

You guys should see the post some guy put on a Dodge truck forum wanting to know what mods would be good so he can haul 50,000 pounds with his 2500... don’t worry, he says he’ll get a “3500 axle” if need be.

[MFL]

I see many over weight TVs in my area towing/carrying whatever! This morning, what I saw, was an issue for the real weight police, as it was obviously unsafe. It was a late model truck, I think 1/2 ton, but in intersection, heavy traffic, only a glimpse, I was turning West, him East. He had a large fiberglass, nice truck camper on truck, and a 26'-28' TT hooked to the receiver. My reason for thinking 1/2T, is the truck rear bumper, and TT tongue were nearly touching the street.

Not meaning to hijack, but this thread has about run it's course.

Jerry

[Grit_dog]

Lwiddis wrote:
I would be more than disappointed. Hopping mad. Heck, my well equipped 2015 Tahoe has a payload of 1,595.

Well you better get your red face on because that's the paper payload rating of pretty much every 3/4T diesel crew cab on the road.....
OPs point was on that supports the non weight cops arguments on here daily. Payload ratings on these types of trucks are a Farce and unless you read the sticker you wouldn't know how bad you were overloaded, within reason, because the truck doesn't know the difference.

BTW you should be mad if you're a believer that a HD payload half ton with a higher paper payload is MORE capable than a 3/4 ton. Another farce. It's called marketing.

[burningman]

The actual real-world capacity difference between 3/4 tons and one tons is imaginary.
They’re literally the same vehicle.
If you believe a 3/4 ton diesel really has the same or similar capability as a gas half ton because of the rating sticker, put an 11.5 foot camper on each and go for a drive.
The 3/4 ton - or one ton - will do a LOT more than the sticker says, safely and easily.

I agree about one thing... no one but RV forum guys worry about “staying within the numbers”.
The rest of the world uses their trucks for what they can really do.

[spud1957]

mbopp wrote:
That 3450# payload is for a gas engine. I've always maintained if you want a Diesel go with a 1-ton since 3/4-ton Diesels don't have much more payload than a 1/2-ton gasser.

This is your problem. Your dealer gave you the payload for a 6.2!!!

They are idiots!!

S

[blt2ski]

Myredracer,

Those stickers with payloads, are supposed to be for that vehicle, how it was manufactured from a given builder. Be it a car, truck, RV trailer etc. Including any and all options as equipped. Is it perfectly exact. NO! But, per a poster that worked in GM lines, their goal was to be no more than plus minus 5 or 10 lbs of actual, based on known weights of options etc. Reality is, pretty dang close for all practical purposes. I've found them to be with in 20 lbs. That is usually multiple scale increment that I have used. I have not used a truck scale using 1 lb increments.
Those numbers are close enough for me.

Marty

[myredracer]

Try going to a scale to find the actual payload and you might get even more of a surprise. Our F250 is waaay less than the sticker figure (around 700-800 lbs IIRC). Mostly due to the cap, bed liner and hitch head but not sure why otherwise. But it's still a lot more than we need.

I sure wish we didn't have all the added weight of the 4x4 junk that takes away a fair bit of payload compared to the same truck in a 4x2 version. Do the sticker payload figures reflect the actual/true added wt. of the 4x4 drivetrain compared to a 4x2?

[Fordlover]

Dutch Oven Man wrote:
Spent months shopping for a new Superduty, ended up ordering one that fit our criteria- XLT, Powerstroke, 3.55 rear-end, Camper package, fifth wheel, etc. We were debating back and forth between a F250 SRW and F350 SRW, ended up with the F250.

The dealer, technical specs in the promo material and everything else from Ford states the payload is 3,450 lbs. I knew with options this number would come down, especially with the diesel. But I was pretty shocked when the sticker on the door said the actual payload is 2,130 lbs. A whole 1,300 lbs less!! Our XLT is pretty basic, but I get it that the diesel and 4x4 adds to this weight, but a 2,130 payload is pretty light for any serious towing. I looked at a F350 SRW on the lot and the door sticker said 2,500 lbs, still really light.

Anyway, I'm not going to worry about it, I've pulled over 100,000 miles on an old F250 with lower ratings with the same camper with no issues. It's just really misleading all the material that is out there touting one number, but in real life, it's much different. My old truck was before the payload numbers were put on the door jamb, so I've been overweight for 17 years and didn't really know it. I have always been within my "owners manual" payload number and combined gross weights, but I'm sure I was 500+ lbs over on payload if they would have measured/reported payload the same in 2001.

I have to say, despite the disappointing door sticker payload numbers, you would never know it...these new trucks are light years ahead of the old ones in handling, power and stopping.

Well, I suppose Ford could list the lowest possible payload # for the Super Duty instead on the chart, but honestly I don't think that would be as helpful, certainly wouldn't have been useful to me while truck shopping.

I did what was suggested elsewhere in the thread, find a similar truck to what you want, and check out the door sticker, understanding that the number could be off by a few lbs.

I would personally never buy a Diesel 250/2500, I just wouldn't be happy with the advertised payload capacity. As it is, I am very pleased with both the ride and the payload (1.5 tons) on my Gas 250.

[blt2ski]

Lantley wrote:

blt2ski wrote:
Last I checked, door sticker was a warranty weight rating only! not a true legal one if pulled over by true weight cops. I have yet to get a ticket being over the door sticker numbers from a CVEO, as long as I had a paid for license higher than I weighed, and was under the Federal Bridge Law limits per axel!

So in a nutshell, the door sticker payload ratings are a farce, "EXCEPT" to the manufacture, or a civil lawyer in a civil suit, and even in the civil side......being over may not be that big a deal!

Marty

Just because it is not a legal(as in ticketable offense) rating. Does not mean it should be ignored or it has no merit.

True, as many have noted, the manufacture ratings can mean and do mean many things. How you work with them is up to you the end user! Just as the tires on my bobcat, max weight rating is 4500 lbs, as long as I am under 25mph, Same tires going over 25 mph is limited to 3000 lbs. Look up ANY 10.50x 16.5 8 ply tire, and you will see the same limits, be it a chevron tread tractor tire as I have, or a hwy/traction LT tire as many of us had in the past on truck, ie 60's into the 80's......ratings can mean many things per the end user.

marty

[Lantley]

blt2ski wrote:
Last I checked, door sticker was a warranty weight rating only! not a true legal one if pulled over by true weight cops. I have yet to get a ticket being over the door sticker numbers from a CVEO, as long as I had a paid for license higher than I weighed, and was under the Federal Bridge Law limits per axel!

So in a nutshell, the door sticker payload ratings are a farce, "EXCEPT" to the manufacture, or a civil lawyer in a civil suit, and even in the civil side......being over may not be that big a deal!

Marty

Just because it is not a legal(as in ticketable offense) rating. Does not mean it should be ignored or it has no merit.

[demiles]

Dutch Oven Man wrote:
Let me preface by saying I'm not an engineer, but I'm pretty mechanically mindedand a mathematician by trade, so I deal with numbers all day. What Ford does is not possible in the math world; there is not a realistic combination of numbers that keep you within specs on any of these trucks. It's like they have a group of engineers that come up with the GVWR, and different group that comes up with the Tow Ratings, a separate group that comes up with Payloads, another GCWR, etc...Then, after everyone comes up with their own numbers, they independently send their numbers to the printer for the various technical and promo material and door stickers without ever consulting each other.

If you look at just tow ratings, you will be way over somewhere else. If you hit your max GVWR, you will probably be way over in Payload. If you stay within payload, you will not even be close to the max of any other number. Even with a F450, I'm not sure you could hit the max in any of their stated numbers and not be over in some other number.

Use common sense, use the stated numbers as a guide, but don't drive yourself crazy trying to come within the right combination of numbers. It's like trying to hit all of your ideal numbers that your doctor says are "perfect"- you will be miserable trying to hit all your numbers and you will still be deficient in something!

If you actually take the time to read through all of Ford’s towing guide, it is very informative, describes precisely how they determine TWR and defines key definitions for consumers. The problem is most will never get past the TWR chart or the TV commercials. Consumers need to educate themselves before they purchase equipment, it’s not difficult but does take a bit of time and effort. There is no industry wide standard for determining the GVWR of a vehicle, manufacturers can do what they want. Some will set GVWR just to insert the vehicle in a particular class. Some tests under SAE j2807 require the vehicle be loaded to GVWR and/or RGAWR so it does contribute to TWR in some ways.

[ACZL]

I would suspect the empty weight of the OP's 250 will be about 8,000-8,300. With a max of 10,000, OP won't be close to 2,000 payload