"Dry Weight" Questions

[ChristyFord]

If "dealer installed options" are not counted in the dry weight of a travel trailer, is there a rule of thumb estimate to include when calculating potential GVW? And what would constitute those options? I can't see why the a/c unit and fridge would be "options," why would those ever be left out of a trailer, but what do I know.

Also, when looking at specs I see "hitch weight" listed, is that a separate weight or is that included in the dry weight? Or is that meaning what the tongue weight would be if you towed it as-is?

https://www.rvusa.com/rv-guide/2017-forest-river-grey-wolf-toy-hauler-floorplan-19rr-tr32338

[silverfz]

I do the same dry weight plus 1000 lb for tow vehicle. My camper at pickup was 450lb lighter then the manufacture site. So I ended with a camper that can be loaded for 3300 lb of stuff. The max I have seen on a couple of week trip loaded was 7400 . I never could see it getting to 9300 max.

[tinner12002]

gmw photos wrote:

tinner12002 wrote:
...snip


And that my friend is why you see 3/4 ton trucks pulling tri-axle toy haulers with GVWR at 21K, but it only weighs 14K empty...nope I don't buy your explanation either. Not safe in anyway shape or form in my opinion!

So let's see here. I stated that one should know what the actual weight of his truck and trailer is.
And you're not buying that in any shape and form ?

Ok, y'all can do this whole thing any way you like, but I prefer to take all four of my trailers and all three of my trucks over the CAT scale to determine what they really weigh, not "dry weight", not "stated GVWR", but actual, on the road weight, and make my determinations from there.

Carry on, men.

What I was referring to was the idea that you think its ok to have a smaller TV on a trailer that could be rated to haul more than what the TV can safely carry or tow. I do agree that people need to know the weight of what they are towing but as I mentioned, you don't buy a 3/4 ton truck to pull say a 17K GVWR toy hauler that has a dry weight of say 12K thinking well I'm only going to put 1K pounds more in it so my truck will be okay pulling it when if your hauler is loaded you could be way over what your TV can tow, that's what I disagree with.

[mike-s]

SoundGuy wrote:

ktmrfs wrote:
it does include the weigh of full propane tanks.

Not necessarily ... with my own 2014 Freedom Express the weight of propane gas that would eventually be added to the tanks by the dealer is not included in the trailer's listed UVW, on current models it is.

In the US, the law is clear:

49 CFR 571.110 S4.3.5 (dealing with federally required weight labels, and has been in effect for a long time) says "If the vehicle is a recreation vehicle trailer and is equipped with a propane supply, the weight of full propane tanks must be included in the vehicle's unloaded vehicle weight."

[Grit_dog]

gmw photos wrote:
A popular recurring theme around here is to "go with the trailer GVWR".

My trailer actually weighs right at 4100 pounds. It's GVWR is 6000 pounds.
Using the logic of simply going by the GVWR would rule out some tow vehicles that in reality would be perfectly capable of towing this trailer.

I prefer to think in terms of "approximately dry weight, plus 1000 pounds or so". That seems to come out pretty close.

But those that are concerned with inventory of every bud light in the camper fridge for weight purposes (There are better reason me to inventory the fridge, like to not run out of beer 30 minform town) likely are the ones that should be worried about it due to their lack of experience.
Anyone who can go hook the same trailer to a real truck and tell a discernible difference in 500 or even 1000lbs is either more perceptive than I, or thinking too hard about it.

[Cummins12V98]

tinner12002 wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:
Ya better have more truck than what you THINK.

MY DRV came to me 18,075#. The GVWR IS 21K. So one could estimate a max realistic pin of 5,250# @25% pin. Not oh no! My loaded RV weighs 23k with 25% pin at 5,750# or more.

Know your real world truck axle weights to determine what the rear axle can CARRY.

Just courious as to why if your RV is rated at 21K as a GVWR you are weighing 23K...kinda overloading your RV aren't you...just asking.

Have a lot of CHIT! I am within MORryd's specs on their IS system even being well over 8K on each axle. It was inspected at MORryde while adding 3" risers, they said it's just right. I was considering the 9k axles but the system is basically the same as the 8K with the brake pads being the same but rotors are larger and calipers are bigger. 8K brakes stop the rig great.

I changed out the 5/8" bolts to 3/4" frame bolts that hold the pin box to the frame. Frame is no different than the 23K models.

[gmw_photos]

tinner12002 wrote:
...snip


And that my friend is why you see 3/4 ton trucks pulling tri-axle toy haulers with GVWR at 21K, but it only weighs 14K empty...nope I don't buy your explanation either. Not safe in anyway shape or form in my opinion!

So let's see here. I stated that one should know what the actual weight of his truck and trailer is.
And you're not buying that in any shape and form ?

Ok, y'all can do this whole thing any way you like, but I prefer to take all four of my trailers and all three of my trucks over the CAT scale to determine what they really weigh, not "dry weight", not "stated GVWR", but actual, on the road weight, and make my determinations from there.

Carry on, men.

[tinner12002]

gmw photos wrote:
Agreed that in time we tend to "gain weight". I weighed this trailer and truck again this spring because I was resetting the WD hitch. Since the spring of 2012 to the spring of 2017, I've gain 100 pounds. Some of that was in the truck ( more tools ) and some in the trailer.

The point of my post is that it's best to know what the truck weighs, and know what the trailer weighs, rather than just making assumptions such as "go by GVWR of the trailer to determine if you have enough truck".

Some trailers really do weigh close to their stated GVWR. A few, like mine weigh considerably less. In my case, it's a small trailer that is equipped with two axles. Since they fit tandem 3K axles, they assigned a 6K GVWR on a trailer that really weighs 4K pounds ready to roll.

So in this case, brochure dry weight (3060) and yellow sticker weight ( 3327 pounds, it was within 150 pounds of what the trailer weighed, the day I brought it home ) were a LOT closer than "just going by GVWR".

One thing that is interesting to me as I follow these threads is that some posters try to take issues down to a one phrase fits all solution. It's almost as though folks seem to assume newbies are dumb as a box of rocks, and therefore we gotta make it simple for them.
Others go into great detail, making a seemingly basic thing ( go to the scale, get weighed ) seem like rocket science.

Somewhere in all of it may actually be some grains of wisdom.

As the man said: stay within your axle ratings. Hitch it well with a quality WD hitch. Wear your seat belt, and go drive somewhere and camp.

And that my friend is why you see 3/4 ton trucks pulling tri-axle toy haulers with GVWR at 21K, but it only weighs 14K empty...nope I don't buy your explanation either. Not safe in anyway shape or form in my opinion!

[tinner12002]

Cummins12V98 wrote:
Ya better have more truck than what you THINK.

MY DRV came to me 18,075#. The GVWR IS 21K. So one could estimate a max realistic pin of 5,250# @25% pin. Not oh no! My loaded RV weighs 23k with 25% pin at 5,750# or more.

Know your real world truck axle weights to determine what the rear axle can CARRY.

Just courious as to why if your RV is rated at 21K as a GVWR you are weighing 23K...kinda overloading your RV aren't you...just asking.

[tinner12002]

I think the OP should be more worried about what the GVWR is than the dry weight.

[silverfz]

My trailer came as per online company resource with a Dry weight of 6800 lb. On pickup it weight was 6333. I guess the one on the manual was the fully loaded version with some outside kitchen option which I did not have.

the max I have seen my camper is 7500 on a long trip . My gvwr is 9600 lb. Not sure if I will get close as that trip we were carrying a lot.

[gmw_photos]

Agreed that in time we tend to "gain weight". I weighed this trailer and truck again this spring because I was resetting the WD hitch. Since the spring of 2012 to the spring of 2017, I've gain 100 pounds. Some of that was in the truck ( more tools ) and some in the trailer.

The point of my post is that it's best to know what the truck weighs, and know what the trailer weighs, rather than just making assumptions such as "go by GVWR of the trailer to determine if you have enough truck".

Some trailers really do weigh close to their stated GVWR. A few, like mine weigh considerably less. In my case, it's a small trailer that is equipped with two axles. Since they fit tandem 3K axles, they assigned a 6K GVWR on a trailer that really weighs 4K pounds ready to roll.

So in this case, brochure dry weight (3060) and yellow sticker weight ( 3327 pounds, it was within 150 pounds of what the trailer weighed, the day I brought it home ) were a LOT closer than "just going by GVWR".

One thing that is interesting to me as I follow these threads is that some posters try to take issues down to a one phrase fits all solution. It's almost as though folks seem to assume newbies are dumb as a box of rocks, and therefore we gotta make it simple for them.
Others go into great detail, making a seemingly basic thing ( go to the scale, get weighed ) seem like rocket science.

Somewhere in all of it may actually be some grains of wisdom.

As the man said: stay within your axle ratings. Hitch it well with a quality WD hitch. Wear your seat belt, and go drive somewhere and camp.

[Cummins12V98]

gmw photos wrote:
A popular recurring theme around here is to "go with the trailer GVWR".

My trailer actually weighs right at 4100 pounds. It's GVWR is 6000 pounds.
Using the logic of simply going by the GVWR would rule out some tow vehicles that in reality would be perfectly capable of towing this trailer.

I prefer to think in terms of "approximately dry weight, plus 1000 pounds or so". That seems to come out pretty close.

Maybe for YOU but you are the exception, the larger RV you have the more "STUFF" a person will add to their rig. Weekend warrior or full timer may make a difference but maybe not. The GVWR method is a guide, bottom line KNOW what your TV can CARRY when towing a 5er.

[gmw_photos]

A popular recurring theme around here is to "go with the trailer GVWR".

My trailer actually weighs right at 4100 pounds. It's GVWR is 6000 pounds.
Using the logic of simply going by the GVWR would rule out some tow vehicles that in reality would be perfectly capable of towing this trailer.

I prefer to think in terms of "approximately dry weight, plus 1000 pounds or so". That seems to come out pretty close.

[RinconVTR]

With LP tanks and battery removed, my Grand Design 2800bh tongue weight is still well over 100lbs more than the dry weight called out in advertisements and their web site.

We can make all sort of assumptions how the OEM's come up with this "magazine" dry weights, but I've never had one come close to those "dry weights" and "unloaded weights" no matter what I remove.