The Norcold broke (again) and I am going with a Residential.

[bob_b1]

My Norcold 682 model has had the cooling unit replaced once, the eyebrow board once, the temp probe once and the ignition module twice. The ignition module is now shot and I refuse to put more good money into bad.

I found a Vassani 10-cu ft. model from Home Depot that will fit the opening. I bought a Xantrex 1000W modified sine wave inverter with remote power switch and bought a Xantrex Automatic Transfer switch.

Two Southco Grabber Catch Latches have been ordered (as per suggestions here) to keep the doors shut while underway.

A 3/8" gas cap and some wood trim were purchased from Home Depot.

I am hoping to use the existing 2-battery bank to power the fridge and am really looking forward to having a reliable fridge for a change.

The parts are all on order and I would like to tackle the project this weekend.

As there seems to be a lot of postings on the trim work for the fridge, I will try to post my experience on the setup involved prior to the fridge:

• The gas line will need to be capped.
• The inverter install.
• The transfer switch install.
• The removal of the old fridge.
• The sealing of the old vents (if necessary).

***Edit March 24 2014: As promised, I am posting a follow up. See my post from today.

[dave17352]

DryCamper11 wrote:

bob_b wrote:
The Xantrex 1000-watt XPower Inverter wasn't up to the task of starting the Fridge. Even though it had 2000 watts of surge capacity, I still had an overload situation.

Is it overload or battery voltage drop? I don't know that inverter, but it might just need more battery or bigger cables to prevent the voltage from dropping below a voltage alarm level. This is one of the situations where a DC clamp meter with instantaneous surge capabilities and/or a voltmeter with max min voltage capability is nice - it can tell what your surge really is and/or what your voltage drop was.

X2 Keep us informed on your fix. I am curious what caused the problem.

[DryCamper11]

bob_b wrote:
The Xantrex 1000-watt XPower Inverter wasn't up to the task of starting the Fridge. Even though it had 2000 watts of surge capacity, I still had an overload situation.

Is it overload or battery voltage drop? I don't know that inverter, but it might just need more battery or bigger cables to prevent the voltage from dropping below a voltage alarm level. This is one of the situations where a DC clamp meter with instantaneous surge capabilities and/or a voltmeter with max min voltage capability is nice - it can tell what your surge really is and/or what your voltage drop was.

[bob_b1]

Well, I finished the installation. The old fridge really put up a fight upon removal, but the new fridge looks nice.

Unfortunately, The Xantrex 1000-watt XPower Inverter wasn't up to the task of starting the Fridge. Even though it had 2000 watts of surge capacity, I still had an overload situation. I can run the generator to start the fridge, shut off the generator and the inverter will continue running it. The next time it cycles, will overload the inverter.

My next step is to upgrade to the 3000-watt version.

[pigman1]

As to the question on the household fridge, 16 cu ft chest freezer and 3 1/2 cu basement freezer, all three are standard compressor units. The only caveat is that the 3 1/2 cu ft unit has an AC/DC compressor. In all instances I run it on the AC side as the plug is more easily accessible. My small unit is a Fridge Freeze, with a custom thermostat that we have had for a number of years. Pricey now, but not when we bought it.

[Almot]

dave17352 wrote:
My fridge haier fridge uses 100 watts when running. So 8.33 amps per hour when compressor is running.

This is 60AH in 24 hrs at 30% cycle, or 80AH at 40% cycle. Plus inverter losses 10-15%. Plus start-up peaks. Together with other loads and two batteries this is a one-night affair, maybe one night plus one day until lunch when it's not too hot. Then you have to run a generator or go home.

12V compressor fridges are a little more efficient. About 20% more efficient if terms of DC watts per cu.ft, 'cause they have a compressor with no start-up surge and there is no inverter. They are mostly small, like 3.5 c.f. Dometic Cr110, though there are a few bigger models 8-9 c.f. from other brands. Small 12V compressor fridge can run on a small solar panel, yes.

[c_traveler2]

Interesting topic about compressor refrigerator vs absorption refrigerators. I dumped my old Norcold 300.3 (2.7 cu.ft.) for a Domentic CR1110,a 12Vdc compressor refrigerator. I got tried of fighting the losing battle of poor performance and having sunk $400 a year and half ago into it, it was time for a new direction.I have a 85 watt solar panel and 1 group 27 battery and I have had no problem with running out of battery power.

One of things I notice that when you guys were calulating engery consummation of the refrigerator is duty cycle of the compressor once the refrigerator reached set point. Engery consummation isn't all that great at that point.

Last little note,I attend the last Pomona Fairplex RV show here in S. California and found out that some of the new MHs are coming with domestic refrigerators instead of the absortion type.

[dave17352]

My fridge haier fridge uses 100 watts when running. So 8.33 amps per hour when compressor is running. I checked this with my kilowatt meter.

[Almot]

MNtundraRet wrote:
bob b:

Your refrigerator runs 24 hours per day. The sticker you used would account for that. Even using the calculations you gave the number would be 70 amps per 24 hour period. That's not accounting for inverter overhead or any other normal use.

That's why my standard 6 c.f. refrigerator only runs on 120v AC or propane.

Yep. Calculations were wrong, watt-hours instead of watts, but it still comes to 854.7/12=71 AH a day plus 10% inverter loss. Plus, residential use assumes residential 77F room temperature, while in trailer there can be up to 100, especially when you're outside and no fans are running. Count on at least 80 AH per 24 hours.

Plus, other loads - even without 120v loads like microwave you need at least 30-40 AH just to get by. This is 120 AH per 24 hours. So a pair of GC batts will last 24 hours before the charge drops below 50%.

It should be mentioned here that "standard 6 c.f. refrigerator" in RV is a totally different creature, it is an absorption machine with heater, rather than compressor machine. In 120V they draw a lot more power than residential 120V fridge. Still, 120V residential is a power hog, it won't last long on batteries.

[westend]

bob_b wrote:
I saw a used Tripp Lite PV 1250 on Ebay that I almost bought instead. Now I'm wondering if that would have been to way to go. I'll use the Xantrex 1000W that was already ordered and see if it will do the job.

I run a small 120v fridge with a Xantrex Prowatt 1000W.

[DryCamper11]

bob_b wrote:
I saw a used Tripp Lite PV 1250 on Ebay that I almost bought instead. Now I'm wondering if that would have been to way to go. I'll use the Xantrex 1000W that was already ordered and see if it will do the job.

The only problem I've ever had with my Tripp Lite PV 1250 FC was an internal connection that loosened up over 10 years of RV travel vibration. When I pulled 100 amps DC through that connection, it heated up and began to melt the plastic insulator housing - making the burned plastic electrical smell. I opened it up, cleaned the connectors, replaced the plastic, and now it handles 100A easily, with occasional excursions above that.

I was amazed at how internally rugged and heavy it was after looking at a 2000W modern inverter.

[bob_b1]

I saw a used Tripp Lite PV 1250 on Ebay that I almost bought instead. Now I'm wondering if that would have been to way to go. I'll use the Xantrex 1000W that was already ordered and see if it will do the job.

[DryCamper11]

pigman1 wrote:
we run a Tripp Lite PV 1250 FC modified sine wave inverter.... This inverter has run my Kitchen Aid, a 16 cu ft chest freezer, and a 3 1/2 cu ft basement freezer, all at the same time and full of fish on the way down from Alaska this summer. When I made a mistake and caused all three units to start at the same time, we only saw a 90% load indicating on our monitor panel.

I have the same inverter. It's great even when overloaded (but I do have trouble running the microwave on it). I want to make sure I understand what you've posted. If I understand you, you are running residential type freezer coolers on it that have motor driven compressors? Or are they heater element type (typical RV refrigerator that will optionally run on 120VAC) or thermoelectric type refrigerators (both types do not use a motor to drive a compressor).
Thanks for confirming this. I haven't run into anyone else using the Tripp Lite PV 1250 FC MSW inverter. It's a heavy beast, but unbelievably rugged.

[bob_b1]

Thanks for all suggestions on what to do with the old one. I would simply give it away if somebody wants to take it. That way, when the Norcold turns out to be a needy disappointment to the new owner, they'll hopefully remember how much they paid for it;)

[time2roll]

I might buy it if I needed a Norcold fridge.
Show me it works and I would help remove it.

[Gdetrailer]

smkettner wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:

smkettner wrote:
I would still get the ignition module and try to sell the Norcold in working condition.

:h

Wouldn't that be DECEITFUL?.

No.

Give full disclosure of repairs and history. But with an igniter you could at least show that the fridge currently works.

I don't know the cost of repair or the price of a used and repaired unit. If it is worth $100 more than the repair... I would go for it. It is coming out anyway.

Might even be enough to pay for the upgrade to a sine wave inverter.

Yes, it is deceitful to make repairs just to sell it even with full disclosure. It is the same thing as taking an old junker car (remember Yugos?), slapping a scrounged up old battery, a couple of used tires from the wrecking yard then slapping a a higher price than scrap all while you knowingly know that it has been a real piece of junk.

Basically giving used car salesmen a good name... :S

Besides what could you really gain by slapping a $250 board into a 20 yr old fridge? It is OLD, USED and nothing but trouble to the current owner. Patching up junk just nets someone else an expensive door stop.

I pity the poor fool that buys anything from you, I don't work that way, in my world if it is JUNK it goes to JUNK... I don't sell junk, it promotes extremely angry and unhappy "customers". Spent many of my early years working in consumer electronic repairs, learned that long ago..