Air Shocks

[Montana_Mike]

What about air shocks on a towing rig. Anyone use these instead of air bags? Or is that to much pressure on the shock mounts?

[Montana_Mike]

Thanks for all the help. As soon as the snow goes away I will adjust my hitch and then go from there. I really enjoy reading all the info and learning from ones with many years.

[usmc616]

I prefer the Roadmaster Active Suspension. When unloaded the ride is not rougher and it helps in cornering.

[jaycocreek]

I've had air shocks before. In my opinion air bags or Hellwig helper springs are a far better option. Used all three.

[Hondavalk]

goducks10 wrote:
If you're adding air bags then the proper way to use air bags and a WDH is to load the back of the truck with your camping gear then inflate the bags to restore the rear to it's original hgt.

Then hitch up the TT coupler and use the WDH to restore the front of the truck to near it's original hgt.

Thats exactly what I do also. I have a Reese DC and I installed the air bags to return the truck to the height it was when I set up the DC.

[goducks10]

If you're adding air bags then the proper way to use air bags and a WDH is to load the back of the truck with your camping gear then inflate the bags to restore the rear to it's original hgt.

Then hitch up the TT coupler and use the WDH to restore the front of the truck to near it's original hgt.

[JJBIRISH]

By leveraging a portion of the tongue weight back to the trailer axles, you effectively should be leveraging the steering axle back to a 0 weight loss… while the rest of the weight is still on the hitch…

[APT]

Real people scaled weights show that about equal amount of weight is transferred to the front axle as to the trailer axles. The same amount as both is removed from the rear axle. Consider this example:

A trailer with 1000 pounds of TW. Drop the tongue on the ball.
Front axle loses 400 pounds
Rear axle adds 1400 pounds
Net 1000 pound TW

Apply WD bars
Front axle same as no trailer
Rear axle adds 800 pounds over no trailer, so removes 600 from no WDH at +1400 pounds
trailer adds 200 pounds
Net 1000 pounds of TW.

If one can understand that example, that 1000 pounds of TW increases rear axle by 140% of TW and decreases front axle by 40% of TW, then maybe he could understand how overloaded a TV can appear. Nose high/rear end sag huh?

There are lots of overloaded 3/4 tons too, many are diesel crew cabs towing 5th wheel RVs. Again, they may be overloaded too! 2000 pounds of payload with 15k tow ratings. People want to buy 12k dry with 2k dry pin weight end up 1000 pounds over GVWR quickly. Why are people surprised? Adding weight centered over the rear axle is not the same as adding weight 4 feet behind it. There is little affect on front axle weight of 5th wheels and rear suspension aids may be helpful. But they again can mask overweight situations. And I rarely see 3/4 tons towing trailers that appear overloaded.

[Lynnmor]

Ron Gratz wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:
Just for grins, an example would be a trailer with 1000lbs of tongue weight. You adjust the WDH to put about 500lbs on both the front and rear axle. Add some cargo in the bed. That might put the front down 1/2" and the rear down several inches. Do you really want to drive with the headlights blinding oncoming traffic?

A trailer with 1000# TW and a correctly adjusted WDH would not add 500# on the front axle. After adjusting the WDH, the net load change on the front axle would be approximately zero, and a load of about 750# would be added to the rear axle.
If a trailer-induced load of 750# plus "some cargo" in the bed causes the rear to drop "several inches" the TV's rear axle probably is overloaded.

As APT posted, a properly adjusted WDH might result in a rear-end sag of about 1.5-2". It's very unusual to hear of more than 2" sag with a properly adjusted WDH. From the reports I've read, 1" is more common than 2".

Ron

If the load change were "approximately zero" then where did the weight distribute to?
I understand that one wouldn't want to transfer fully 1/2 the weight to the front, I was trying to show that front and rear spring rates may be quite different causing the rear sag problem on some trucks.
Just Google F250 rear sag and read.

[APT]

Most pickups are designed such that the rear is a little higher than the front unloaded. Take a look at any half ton pickup truck forum for front end spacers to "level" the truck unloaded/lightly loaded. Clearly these people don't tow/haul anything significant. Same could be said of people who put aftermarket exhausts on their trucks.

My prior TV was a 2003 F-150 Supercrew. Lariat, 4WD, lots of options, low payload, about 1300 pounds. Great all around truck for our family for 8+ years. I used it for many landscape supplies where a loader dumps a yard of various materials in the truck bed. I had been across the scales empty to 1500 pounds over GVWR. While the weight was more central over the rear axle than a trailer hitch, I know what the truck stance was for the various weights and how it drove (for short trips) at lower than RV towing highway speeds. Near GVWR, the truck looked level.

So when I see nose high/rear low TVs pulling RVs, I know either the WDH is not adjusted well or they are very overloaded. People often report their scaled weights on this forum. Most people are pleased with the subjective how it tows. Some are surprised to find out where they stand with respect to their ratings. This is my reasoning for saying the rear suspension aids mask an overloaded situation.

Now browse the Towing and TV areas. Every couple weeks there is a somewhat lengthy thread asking how to adjust a WDH on a vehicle with air bags. Different OEMs recommend different methods. The geometry of the Reese dual cam WDH causes the cam lobes to move with respect to the detents on the WD bars based on how much force on the bars and the ball height. These are reasons why I say rear suspension aids complicate WDH adjustment.

[Ron_Gratz]

Lynnmor wrote:
Just for grins, an example would be a trailer with 1000lbs of tongue weight. You adjust the WDH to put about 500lbs on both the front and rear axle. Add some cargo in the bed. That might put the front down 1/2" and the rear down several inches. Do you really want to drive with the headlights blinding oncoming traffic?

A trailer with 1000# TW and a correctly adjusted WDH would not add 500# on the front axle. After adjusting the WDH, the net load change on the front axle would be approximately zero, and a load of about 750# would be added to the rear axle.
If a trailer-induced load of 750# plus "some cargo" in the bed causes the rear to drop "several inches" the TV's rear axle probably is overloaded.

As APT posted, a properly adjusted WDH might result in a rear-end sag of about 1.5-2". It's very unusual to hear of more than 2" sag with a properly adjusted WDH. From the reports I've read, 1" is more common than 2".

Ron

[Spappy]

X2 on Goodyear bags. Really awesome.
Spap

[Montana_Mike]

I should probably readjust my hitch again. I have added gear and one more battery up front.

[Montana_Mike]

No just needs raised a little when hitched. Don't really notice it except the headlamps are a bit high. The equalizer hitch does a pretty good job too. 04 F150 shortbed with a 5.4. Does really well towing.

[Lynnmor]

Ron Gratz wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:
If you have soft rear springs then even a correctly adjusted WDH will not raise the truck to where it should be.

Are you saying the rear end should be raised to the unhitched height? If so, why?

Ron

Just for grins, an example would be a trailer with 1000lbs of tongue weight. You adjust the WDH to put about 500lbs on both the front and rear axle. Add some cargo in the bed. That might put the front down 1/2" and the rear down several inches. Do you really want to drive with the headlights blinding oncoming traffic?