Do all lightweight large TT's tow terribly, or just ours?

[BoilerEE]

Hello RV.net forums friends! It's been a while, but I'm back, and with a completely different rig now. We've had a couple of different large truck campers, a 42' Titanium 5th wheel, and multiple cargo trailers up to 10k# and 30', so I consider myself a fairly experienced RVer.

Thinking I knew what I was doing, we decided to try an SUV/TT combo, and I'm happy that we're only trying it (will be driving back to Alaska for the summer so my wife and I can do our Guard/Reserve duty for the year and then selling the rig up there and flying home). The reason I'm glad is, it tows terribly!!! Here are the details:

2015 Suburban LTZ
2013 Passport Ultra Lite 3220BH
14K Equal-i-zer hitch (tried a 6K on the dealer's advice, and it was way too sloppy, so I just setup my 14K I had from previous setups, and it's better, but still floaty).

So, I spent some time at the scales today and here's what I learned:
Suburban is right at 5980# empty, with Steer axle 3080 and drive 2900.
The height to the front wheel well unloaded is 35 1/2"

I didn't run across without the WD bars attached, but the wheel well height was 36 1/8" with no weight distribution.

With the Equal-i-zer adjusted, my weights are:
Steer: 2840 (240# less than unloaded) and height of wheel well is 35 7/8"
Drive: 3960
Trailer: 5960
Gross: 12760

I'm thinking I could probably put in one more washer to dial in a little more WD and get the Steer axle closer to the unloaded weight, but I'm wondering if not matter what I do the real problem is that I've got a ton of surface area and very little weight. Is this just the way it is with a light and large TT? Is there anything I'm missing?

As you can see, it's dead-nuts level (which makes my OCD happy) -- I just wish it was as nice to drive as it is to look at!

M%Eo6MepSZWYAax5bVlnXA by BoilerEE, on Flickr

[Jimbee]

When it comes to stability tongue weight is your friend with longer trailers! If your Passport is like mine your fresh water tank is at the front of the camper under the bed. Try towing with the fresh water tank full as this may add enough weight to help with the see-saw affect these longer trailers sometimes are plagued with.

Good luck!

[dthfsa]

I had a 28 foot passport for 9 years. When I towed with my 07 F150, 2 wheel drive, 5.4 Crew cab I had to run the nose of the trailer slightly lower. If I left it level it would feel loose on the highway, specially around big trucks.
At the time I had an WD hitch with 2 friction sway controllers.
with my experience I would suggest running slightly nose down and use the WD to level the vehicle.

[dodge_guy]

What is your loaded tongue weight! On my trailer I had too much tongue weight and it pushed my Excursion around o was over 15%! I Moved stuff around to get it to 12% and it towed much better. Sometimes too much tongue weight is as bad as too little. I would also recommend using a Reese Dual Cam hitch.

The Burb can handle that trailer if set up properly with a good sway control hitch.

[LVJJJ]

When I bot a "new" '05 27' Trail Cruiser had to reset the equal-I-zer hitch on my '94 GMC Suburban k-1500. Thought the tongue height was about the same as the '04 Tahoe we got rid of. Set it up the same but turns out the Trail C was lower than the Tahoe so it sat a little high like yours does. So I lowered the height of the adjustable hitch to the lowest hole, added some washers and solved the handling problem. Now there is a slight squat at the rear of the Burb but the TT is quite level. So, I think you may be starting your hitch adjustment with the ball a little high.

[epeters]

We recently moved to the Nash 29S and found the current WDH we had worked fine, except I felt the trailer waggling a bit more than I was used to (I have 10+ years of towing our prior trailer). I decided to upgrade my hitch to the Reece Dual cam. Now it tows smoothly.

Most of the prior advice still applies. I had the load balance correct with the appropriate weight on hitch, the front wheel well measurement was spot on, tires are aired up to their max (51 lbs) and they do just fine.

After ensuring the additional washer, tire pressure, load balancing etc, then maybe consider a different hitch. For me, it made towing a tiring experience to being comfortable once again.

[APT]

TW percentage seems a little low. If you have a chance to get the three axle weights again, can you also get the weights with just the trailer tongue on ball?

I would restore more front axle weight, target 100% restoration. Add another washer or two. When you do that, you may need to lower the ball mount one set of holes.

My WDH is very picky about being set up correctly. THe same vehicle can feel scary at 55mph or rock solid at 75mph just varying the WDH adjustment. My TT also tows well behind my friends's 1-ton with no WD, so the trailer itself is stable.

[eHoefler]

Your steer axle is too light, drop the hitch to get the trailer level and keep adding washers until the steer axle has the same weight or more than unloaded. Preferably more.

[busterbrown73]

That's pretty adventurous trip to Alaska with your Burb and a 35' travel trailer in tow. I used to own a Yukon XL Denali that I pulled with my current Keystone Bullet 308bhs, the fraternal twin to your Passport. So this is my take on your choice of TV.

If you ever looked under your Suburban's underbody, take a look at the suspension components, including drive axles, shocks/struts, and spring mounts. Now head on over to your nearest GMC dealer and look at the underpinnings of a 3/4 or 1 ton truck. My Yukon XL's components looked fragile to say the least. Absolutely no comparison in performance and handling.

The reason I point this out is that I had the same opinion about my trailer when I first hitched up to my Yukon. These long trailers do not bode well with a 1/2 ton build quality. I had to upgrade a $3000 Hensley hitch to eliminate sway and trailer movement. In doing so, I ran over payload with a substantially heavier hitch.

I didn't want to but ultimately I knew I had to. At the beginning of last year camping season, I upgraded to a new Ram 2500 Megacab. With an enormously larger wheelbase and suspension to boot, My 35' tow behind does not misbehave, even with the mid grade Blue Ox Sway Pro I originally had.

The drive is so much more relaxed and enjoying. Now, my wife drives about half our mile during any given trip without trepidation or irritation. (at least never irritated with piloting our rig; with me, that's another story). I just wanted to give you some insight these very long pull-behinds.

Remember too, even with just you and the DW, your payload is limited to around 1400-1500 lbs. At 15% TW on a 7600 GVWR trailer, your dropping close to 1140 lbs on the hitch ball. Add another 100 lbs for your WDH and I bet your remaining payload will be less than 250 lbs. For me, that's not much margin for travel across an entire continent with 7000 lbs in tow.

[theoldwizard1]

Tongue weight is important.

So are tow vehicle tires. You want LT (light truck) tires not P (passenger car). Heavier side wall construction.

[goducks10]

https://www.rvusa.com/rv-guide/2013-keystone-passport-ultra-lite-grand-touring-travel-trailer-floorp...

According to the specs of your TT you've got 14" C rated TT tires. IMO jumping to a stiffer D rated in a 15" could help.

[lawrosa]

As stated here just add one washer at a time and do several passes over the scale. Get the weight without WD hooked up too.

Input here..


http://towingplanner.com/ActualWeights/TravelTrailerCatScales

You want to do one washer at a time becuase as you raise the rear with a washer the truck may lower itself . That will add even more weight to the front of the truck.

But its my opinion you probably will end up putting all the washers in to tilt the head back as far as possible.

You have a lot of TW it would seem.

I would also drop the ball a hole... Better to have the trailer nose down some.

And no. You dont need more TW... I have no clue why anyone here is suggesting that.

His front end is light due to the air ride. When the rear of the truck lifts with the air ride it takes the tension off the WD bars.

He needs to over tension so the truck lowers itself in the rear.

[ScottG]

My advice is to make small steps.
If you lower the front end it will automatically tighten the spring bars so don't make an adjustment there until you know it's needed.
If you add or subtract washers or links, do it one at a time.

Let us know how it works out!

[BoilerEE]

Thanks for the help everyone - I'll keep working with it and see if I can get it dialed in better! I'll post back when I get it sorted -- always a learning experience!

[1320Fastback]

Little more tongue weight will make a huge difference in stability and max out the psi on the tow vehicles tires.

[Durb]

If your auto leveling is pumping up the rear it will unload your weight distribution and defeat your anti-sway benefit of the Equalizer. It will also harden your rear suspension and make it serve as a fulcrum to help unload your front tires. You might try to pull the fuse on that system (if possible) and set up your hitch as though auto level didn't exist. Then give it a try.

Thanks for your service.