F350 payload dispute

[bighog01]

New F350 SRW that I'm considering says 3326 lbs on the payload sticker with a 11500 GVWR. I asked for this info before the dealer had it brought in from another dealer. Salesperson and fleet manager say that its actually 4164 lbs because the factory invoice says the trucks shipping weight is 7336 lbs. Now I'm sure that's weighed with minimal diesel I. The tank. Isn't the door sticker the law? I always thought so. I'm not obligated to buy this truck and I have no deposit on it. Right now I'm not feeling comfortable hitching my Fuzion to it.

[ShinerBock]

TomG2 wrote:

ShinerBock wrote:
Thank goodness I am not moderator because I would have tossed you out a while back ago for these vindictive remarks.

Do you even know the definition of vindictive? It is all about revenge and I have nothing to be revengeful of. I do question people who play fast and loose with possibly dangerous misinformation. Toss me if you like.

You are purposely bringing up the "moderator" word out of spite and revenge for Marty proving you wrong. Instead of just accepting, learning from it, and moving on, you are doubling down with vindictive comments. So yeah, I know what it means.

[transamz9]

TomG2 wrote:

transamz9 wrote:
...snip...... If the asker ask me directly then I will tell them that if they have to ask the question then they should play the safe card and follow the sticker.

We are on the same page. I would rather be on the same team as the Ford Motor Company engineers and lawyers than on board with those that say, "Ratings be danged". I guess that is why I am not a moderator.

No, I don't think we are on the exact same page. You just snipped the part you agree with.

[blt2ski]

Tom,

My.family.has.many.engineers.ing. including one.that designed part of the lunar module.
The engineer be danged part, also.refers back to.another set of engineers, IE the.ones that designed the roads. Those are the engineer specs one needs to.follow! You could design.a.vehicle.to.handle a.million lbs per 10" width.tire. How much.of that 2 million per tire can.you.put on the highway? 10,000 lbs. Any.more, you are over the engineer design spec of the road. We.can go.back to 245s, 9500 per axle. If a dual, 20 or 19k per axle. WhAt part of that is the engineer spec you need to follow do you not understand?
I've worked.with.many engineers.and architects in the past. Most understand that at times, they.have to follow another set of design.specs to make something fall into play.
My c2500 has stock 16" tires. My 05 dually Chevy.Xmas had stock 215 tires. Per bridge laws in this state 22000 lbs max. I.get 20,000 as that slower amount. I did.not.run.down the road.that heavy! That would be.dumb in more.ways.than one! That rig was licensed at 14000. 500 lbs more than axle ratings.

[TomG2]

ShinerBock wrote:
Thank goodness I am not moderator because I would have tossed you out a while back ago for these vindictive remarks.

Do you even know the definition of vindictive? It is all about revenge and I have nothing to be revengeful of. I do question people who play fast and loose with possibly dangerous misinformation. Toss me if you like.

[ShinerBock]

TomG2 wrote:


We are on the same page. I would rather be on the same team as the Ford Motor Company engineers and lawyers than on board with those that say, "Ratings be danged".

And the EPA and US DOT. Their emissions certifications and highways standards also dictate the max GVWR of certain trucks depending on what class they are in.

I actually worked for multiple truck and engine manufacturers. How many have you worked for?

TomG2 wrote:
I guess that is why I am not a moderator.

Thank goodness I am not moderator because I would have tossed you out a while back ago for these vindictive remarks.

[TomG2]

transamz9 wrote:
...snip...... If the asker ask me directly then I will tell them that if they have to ask the question then they should play the safe card and follow the sticker.

We are on the same page. I would rather be on the same team as the Ford Motor Company engineers and lawyers than on board with those that say, "Ratings be danged". I guess that is why I am not a moderator.

[transamz9]

TomG2 wrote:
Some members believe axle ratings but not GVWR. Did the engineers get stupid between the time they rated the axles and the time they assigned a value for the total vehicle? I doubt it. If it was just axle ratings that matter, they could sling bigger and bigger rear axles under a F-150 to get any rating they wanted up to F-450 range. There is a lot more to a pickup than just the axles. Believe it or not.

If the government didn't class trucks in multiple classes then the auto manufacturer would probably do just what you are saying. Like was said earlier though, it is much cheaper for them to use the same axle across the line and just derate them by putting a lighter spring with it or lighter tire.

If a person ever has a question of what a truck can handle and don't care to take the time to do some homework then the best thing that can be done is follow the little stickers. If a newly comes on here looking for answers then they can get all the info they need. There's plenty of posters saying to follow the stickers and then there are plenty saying it can handle more. It doesn't matter if it's a mod posting it or not.

If someone comes on here and ask if a truck can tow something and someone says no because it is going to be 500# over a rating I'm not going to tell the person asking the question yes it will but I will tell the person saying no that they are wrong. If the asker ask me directly then I will tell them that if they have to ask the question then they should play the safe card and follow the sticker.

[ShinerBock]

spoon059 wrote:

TomG2 wrote:
I am not going to argue with the moderator over these things.

As he continues to argue...

I am starting to think that he is doing it on purpose at this point.

[TomG2]

blt2ski wrote:
I was in construction, owning the company for 35 years.

Yes, religion and politics are out.
're the 10,000 lbs on 245 rubber. I can't in a single wheel rig, put 10,000 lbs on the 245-70-19.5 tires rated to 5400 lbs that were on the front of my dump truck!

Marty

The original implication was that you sometimes carried 10,000 pounds on your 2500 pickup. Someone even pointed out the oversize wheels and tires that you had on it. We ran twelve tandem dump trucks, five semi's along with a dozen pickups and work trailers, so towing is nothing new to me.

As far as your statement that "Manufactures engineer ratings be danged." I think that says it all. Being an engineer myself, I think we deserve better, but that is just me.

[spoon059]

TomG2 wrote:
I am not going to argue with the moderator over these things.

As he continues to argue...

[blt2ski]

I was in construction, owning the company for 35 years.

Yes, religion and politics are out.
're the 10,000 lbs on 245 rubber. I can't in a single wheel rig, put 10,000 lbs on the 245-70-19.5 tires rated to 5400 lbs that were on the front of my dump truck! Max, 4750 per tire, or 9500 per axle in this state. If you come, that is A alL you get here. You can change rim Siam to 22.5 or even 24", you will get a max of 9500 lbs on those tires. Manufactures engineer ratings be danged.
The engineer that as specs the max load per tire on the road, is the one that designed/engineered the road! The engineer ratings from remanufactured are not enforced by you state Patrol, or mine!

I'll be looking up Texas weight laws on a computer to verify this. I know what federal law states.....

Marty

[TomG2]

blt2ski wrote:
Tom,
I.also said it would be.per the law! Door sticker rating are not legal from an enforcement standpoint.

Marty

I never said that the door stickers are the legal limit. Quote me on that one. Everyone knows that. Throwing around numbers like 10,000 pounds on the back of a pickup is where I have questions. I realize that factory weight ratings are conservative. Many of us have exceeded them. I do wonder at the wisdom of a moderator dismissing them out of hand for the benefit of new users who may not be "Experts".

Some members believe axle ratings but not GVWR. Did the engineers get stupid between the time they rated the axles and the time they assigned a value for the total vehicle? I doubt it. If it was just axle ratings that matter, they could sling bigger and bigger rear axles under a F-150 to get any rating they wanted up to F-450 range. There is a lot more to a pickup than just the axles. Believe it or not.

I am not going to argue with the moderator over these things. I know how that turns out. Keep on telling it your way. We have a saying in the construction business which applies but it would get me kicked off here. "It's your monkey, you can .... .. ........ ... ......

[blt2ski]

Tom,
I.also said it would be.per the law! Door sticker rating are not legal from an enforcement standpoint. Wadcutter pointed that out in post two. He also stated that multiple times over the years. As have other enforcement officers.
I've stated in this thread, going both ways, you.can be under a manufacture rating, be illegal. You can be over, and legal!
I've looked up, taken classes, took state cdl test. Been pulled over....

Marty

[TomG2]

ShinerBock wrote:
Okay, from now on, no one use examples in front of Tom. He takes them a bit too literal.

Right. 10,000 pounds on the rear axle of a 2500 pickup is too easy to challenge. Keep it loosy goosy. Like the politicians.

[ShinerBock]

Okay, from now on, no one use examples in front of Tom. He takes them a bit too literal.