factory vs dealer vs loaded weights

[myredracer]

We are now on our 3rd TT - 29' and 6800 lb GVWR. After having read a lot of threads and discussions on TT weights and what your TT ends up weighing after you have it all loaded up for camping, I decided it would be an interesting exercise to weigh everything to see what happens from the time it left the factory to when it is fully loaded for camping. Interesting results...

I have weighed each and every item that is going into our unit as a mod or upgrade, light to heavy - weighed it all. From roof vent covers to Dexter EZ-Flex upgrade. Weights show to the nearest pound because of kg to lb conversion and because of things I weighed on a scale at home. Actual net item weights were used and did not include anything else such as packaging.

I weighed our TT on the way home from the dealer. I actually went through 2 scales and both sets of weights are essentially the same so there is no error in the scaled weights. After getting home I discovered that the fresh water holding tank was partially full. I emptied the tank using a 2 quart container and it came to 194 lbs so I deducted that weight. I deducted 2 propane tanks at 55 lbs each and 1 battery at 56 lbs. I also deducted any mods/upgrades the dealer did for us (I turned over parts to them and already had the weights).

After accounting for the water and mods/upgrades, the TT is 190 lbs heavier than when it left the factory. I also confirmed the actual weight as it left the factory via email to them and it's the same figure as I found on the sticker inside our TT (took a while to find it and it's not yellow).

I am not sure where the extra weight has come from. I can't think of anything the dealer would have added other than propane tanks and the battery. Do they possibly add anything else to a TT after it gets weighed at the factory? Spare tire maybe? 190 lbs is a lot more than a weighing error. If it was 19 lbs, I'd ignore it.

The total weight of ALL modifications and upgrades is 119 lbs. That includes a few heavier things like water filtration, EZ-Flex equalizers, shock absorbers and also the WDH snap-up brackets + cam arms.

On our first camping trip out this year, we loaded everything into it that we would for any normal camping weekend. The pass-through has all the usual stuff like BBQ, outdoor carpet, folding chairs, wheel chocks, sewer fittings, leveling blocks, etc., etc. The kitchen was loaded with all the usual things like coffee maker, toaster, dishes, cutlery, food, pots, etc., etc. The rest of the interior was loaded with clothes, bathroom stuff (towels, toiletries), some books, DVDs, toolbox, etc., etc. The loaded weight could be a little higher if loaded for a longer trip, but I doubt by very much especially when you consider that you typically grocery shop along the way.

The total weight of ALL cargo loaded into our TT came to 555 lbs.

The total weight of all modifications and upgrades is 119 lbs.

TOTAL additional weight of top of the factory UVW is 674 lbs.

People frequently say that the weight of your TT is in the order of 1500 lbs added on top of the factory UVW. I have to say that I disagree and that for the "average" 28-30'-ish TT, the additional weight above your UVW after fully loaded for camping is more likely to be in the order of 700 lbs (cargo + allowance for some mods/upgrades) which is about 1/2 of the often quoted 1500 lb figure. Water in holding tanks and anything above the norm that you'd carry like say bikes, generator, etc. would of course be on top of that. Perhaps for some, additional weight of 1500 lbs is due to factory options that did not get included in a final weighing before it left the factory or for reasons similar to why we have an unaccounted for 190 lbs?

Another thing of note is that sometimes people say that you can shift cargo around in your TT to adjust tongue wt. If we're only talking about 600 lbs, I'm not so sure that's really feasible. You'd have to relocate a lot of items from the pass-through to the rear or a lot of interior things to the pass-through, neither of which are practical in my eyes.

In summary, it was an interesting exercise.

[dadmomh]

Agree with the 1000# wiggle room. After moving all the "stuff" from our HTT into the TT, I couldn't believe how much cr** had migrated in there. I was responsible for the 5 tablecloths - I don't know why either - and some odds and ends. DH was responsible for enough tools to build a whole new HTT. We swore that Rocky would be on a lifetime diet, unlike the ROO. We carry a good supply of "just in case" meals, either boxed or canned. I'm trying to focus on boxed or really lightweight now. We hauled a Dutch Oven around for most of the 8 seasons with the ROO and used it only once or twice a season. Now it stays with the camping stuff until we know we're going to use it, then back where it came from. Instead of having 7 or 8 games, we only play Scrabble, dominoes and cards, so that's all that goes.

I'm reading some books on Minimalism, primarily for this houseful of clutter, but am trying to apply it to Rocky also. If we haven't used something in X amount of time, it goes. With the ROO, our rules on clothes was that if it fit in the small laundry basket we each had, it could go, otherwise, NO. Now we have a small wardrobe each, but trying to keep it to no more than about 5 days each.....amazing that most campgrounds have laundry facilities. We don't mind taking a couple of hours one afternoon or evening and running a bit of laundry.

[myredracer]

korbe wrote:
You may have made an error while adding the weight of each and every item in the rig. May I suggest you weigh each item a second time - just to make sure.

Good suggestion and first thing I would have thought of, but with an engineering degree and MBA, I think I'm pretty good with numbers and weighing stuff, lol. However, many years have gone by, and I know I'm not always right. (Just ask DW too - I'm ALWAYS wrong.)

[fla-gypsy]

I have always considered 1000# as the expected weight added

[Terryallan]

ah64id wrote:
I never got to weigh my camper before we put anything in it, but I have weighed it many times since.

According to the brochure my camper weighs 6350, and the white piece of paper says 6220.

The lightest it has ever been was without food or water, but our normal camping load was still in there (chairs, sheets, leveling blocks, dutch ovens, propane, batteries, etc). The TAW was 6580lbs and probably 1000 of tongue weight, or more??

We have been as high as 7580lbs on the trailer axles with an approx 1200lbs of tongue weight, for a total of around 8500-8700lbs (some of the TAW is from the WD hitch). That's over 2,000 lbs heavier than we where told the new empty weight was, and our camper does not have stuff everywhere.

On the TAW 7580lbs trip we had full water (56 gals, one reference says 56 fresh tank one says 56 including water heater, never verified which is correct), about 2-3 gallons in black tank, food for a weekend (so not full), clothes for 5, sheets/bags, memory foam mattress topper, full propane, 2ea 90# batteries, all cast iron pots, welded on trailer hitch with 2 adult bikes on a carrier, etc.

The things I have hard mounted to the trailer that where not factory are, rear receiver hitch, 2nd spare tire/mount, vent covers, 2ga accumulator tank, replace 1 G24 battery with 2 90# 6v's, 1500w MSW inverter, 2 inline transfer relays, Dexter EZ-Flex, Centramatic wheel balancers, L brackets for hitch, memory foam mattress, fridge vent fan, and I am sure a couple other things.

Our camper is certainly not over-packed, crowded, or lacking additional storage space. We do keep stuff in there that isn't used over often, like board games, spare blankets and a few spare parts, but when needed it sure is handy.

Little things add up, as I am sure I have close to 100# of cast iron cookware, and 120# of additional battery. Between those 2 things and a hot water heater/accumulator combo I am nearly 300# heavier and we haven't even started talking sheets/clothes/chairs/blocks/chalks/utensils/extra spare tire/etc....

Before the battery/inverter and receiver hitch where installed our TAW was normally 7,000 ± 200lbs.

But to Terryallan, you comment about NO WAY a person could actually walk around is pretty ridiculous. Even out 18CK (which was pretty full with 3 kids) had about 1500lbs of stuff over new empty weight.

No. I stand by it. Notice. I said STUFF, not water. I don't see HOW you could walk around in one loaded with 1500lb of STUFF. Especially a 18CK. Not a lot of storage space in there. Our 23T had every nook, and cranny full, including toys for the grand kids. and still only 550lb over dry. Unless of course, like Lucy, y'all collect rocks. We have been camping for 30 years, and if any thing. Our camper gets lighter, not heavier. The less I carry, the less I have to deal with. We don't use it, out it comes.

[wmoses]

myredracer wrote:
...I have weighed each and every item that is going into our unit as a mod or upgrade, light to heavy - weighed it all.
...
The total weight of ALL modifications and upgrades is 119 lbs. That includes a few heavier things like water filtration, EZ-Flex equalizers, shock absorbers and also the WDH snap-up brackets + cam arms.

On our first camping trip out this year, we loaded everything into it that we would for any normal camping weekend. The pass-through has all the usual stuff like BBQ, outdoor carpet, folding chairs, wheel chocks, sewer fittings, leveling blocks, etc., etc. The kitchen was loaded with all the usual things like coffee maker, toaster, dishes, cutlery, food, pots, etc., etc. The rest of the interior was loaded with clothes, bathroom stuff (towels, toiletries), some books, DVDs, toolbox, etc., etc. The loaded weight could be a little higher if loaded for a longer trip, but I doubt by very much especially when you consider that you typically grocery shop along the way.

The total weight of ALL cargo loaded into our TT came to 555 lbs.

The total weight of all modifications and upgrades is 119 lbs.

TOTAL additional weight of top of the factory UVW is 674 lbs.

People frequently say that the weight of your TT is in the order of 1500 lbs added on top of the factory UVW. I have to say that I disagree and that for the "average" 28-30'-ish TT, the additional weight above your UVW after fully loaded for camping is more likely to be in the order of 700 lbs (cargo + allowance for some mods/upgrades) which is about 1/2 of the often quoted 1500 lb figure.
...
Another thing of note is that sometimes people say that you can shift cargo around in your TT to adjust tongue wt. If we're only talking about 600 lbs, I'm not so sure that's really feasible. You'd have to relocate a lot of items from the pass-through to the rear or a lot of interior things to the pass-through, neither of which are practical in my eyes.

In summary, it was an interesting exercise.

Interesting indeed! It would also be interesting to see the replies that follow.

I too disagree with the nominal 1500# allowance for "stuff" - always thought that it was excessive. After all you are going "camping". In my previous RV my all up weight exceeding the UVW was about 800#. In the new RV I have about the same stuff, maybe 100# more so it is getting up a bit, but I have hit a plateau and don't expect it to increase any more. Too much junk brought means too much junk to handle when you get there.

That said, it is just the two of us, BUT when we had kids we didn't bring any more junk either - just their clothes. They just had to do without whatever while on the trip and focus on the camping and the outdoors. Some folk have a different view.

As for shifting weight - I am one of those who say that it can be done but I appreciate what you are getting at with regard to whether or not it is practicable. However, if you have a fore-aft imbalance and see sway then I would think that you'd find a way to move the weights back and forth. Remember - moving a weight from one end to the other provides a double benefit as there is a negative weight and a positive weight in that shift, so a little can often go a long way.

[korbe]

You may have made an error while adding the weight of each and every item in the rig. May I suggest you weigh each item a second time - just to make sure.

[Old-Biscuit]

3000# PLUS

Course that was when we FT.

Now...5vr camp ready has maybe 800#

[goducks10]

Our last TT we had it a factory sticker weight of #6289. Loaded up we were at 72-7300lbs. Our current 5'er has a dry sticker weight of #7185, loaded up we're right around 9000lbs. We put all the stuff that went into the truck when we had the TT. Now it all goes in the 5'er.

I agree the smaller the TT obviously the less you can carry. Everyone takes different things when camping.

[AH64ID]

I never got to weigh my camper before we put anything in it, but I have weighed it many times since.

According to the brochure my camper weighs 6350, and the white piece of paper says 6220.

The lightest it has ever been was without food or water, but our normal camping load was still in there (chairs, sheets, leveling blocks, dutch ovens, propane, batteries, etc). The TAW was 6580lbs and probably 1000 of tongue weight, or more??

We have been as high as 7580lbs on the trailer axles with an approx 1200lbs of tongue weight, for a total of around 8500-8700lbs (some of the TAW is from the WD hitch). That's over 2,000 lbs heavier than we where told the new empty weight was, and our camper does not have stuff everywhere.

On the TAW 7580lbs trip we had full water (56 gals, one reference says 56 fresh tank one says 56 including water heater, never verified which is correct), about 2-3 gallons in black tank, food for a weekend (so not full), clothes for 5, sheets/bags, memory foam mattress topper, full propane, 2ea 90# batteries, all cast iron pots, welded on trailer hitch with 2 adult bikes on a carrier, etc.

The things I have hard mounted to the trailer that where not factory are, rear receiver hitch, 2nd spare tire/mount, vent covers, 2ga accumulator tank, replace 1 G24 battery with 2 90# 6v's, 1500w MSW inverter, 2 inline transfer relays, Dexter EZ-Flex, Centramatic wheel balancers, L brackets for hitch, memory foam mattress, fridge vent fan, and I am sure a couple other things.

Our camper is certainly not over-packed, crowded, or lacking additional storage space. We do keep stuff in there that isn't used over often, like board games, spare blankets and a few spare parts, but when needed it sure is handy.

Little things add up, as I am sure I have close to 100# of cast iron cookware, and 120# of additional battery. Between those 2 things and a hot water heater/accumulator combo I am nearly 300# heavier and we haven't even started talking sheets/clothes/chairs/blocks/chalks/utensils/extra spare tire/etc....

Before the battery/inverter and receiver hitch where installed our TAW was normally 7,000 ± 200lbs.

But to Terryallan, you comment about NO WAY a person could actually walk around is pretty ridiculous. Even out 18CK (which was pretty full with 3 kids) had about 1500lbs of stuff over new empty weight.

[fla-gypsy]

Just give the wife a little time, you will make it to 1000# yet.

[Clattertruck]

If you can't get your additional loaded weight up to the 1000 lbs. figure then you are not bringing enough beer.

[Terryallan]

I really would like to see the inside of a TT that has 1500lb of stuff loaded into it. There is NO WAY a person could actually walk around in it. We have stuff in every nook, and cranny. And still less than 600lbs. Even with the water heater full of water.

[APT]

You have stuff for two people. I have stuff for 5. While not 5/2 worth more weight, that does mean more.

I know what we take. Everything. That's how we travel. Every trip a couple more things that we have bought from a previous trip. We take lots of toys, bikes, games and activities.

[the_bear_II]

Wow.... If I had to weigh everything we have put into our trailer, I wouldn't have any time left to go camping.

I always figure there is a fudge factor in the manufacturers weight ratings. Deliberately lower than tested actual gross weights to limit liability issues.

I just make sure my tow vehicle has extra capacity to tow the trailer and make sure everything is well maintained, especially tires and tire pressures.

[myredracer]

JJBIRISH wrote:
Did you do the most important weight for the trailer loaded for camping… that would be the heaviest wheel… not all trailers weigh the same side to side or front to rear on the road…everything is based from the heaviest wheel… you could find you have one tire overloaded and the others underloaded…

One scale was a large platform that took in the complete truck + TT combined and the other was both TT axles together. Both results were essentially the same. You do bring up a good point. It would be good to know the loading difference between wheels. Shouldn't be a problem with our load range D tires? On one of the scales I can easily run through on one side or the other.