Have a truck - suspension questions

[wfs989]

I recently purchased a 2005 Dodge 3500 dually and am wondering what to do about suspension. We are looking for a 2006 or later AF 990 and am going to install Torklift tiedowns. Depending upon which AF 990 year we get, dry weight will be around 3,500 pounds. My question is what would you recommend ? I have read on the forum and mfg's websites about Torklift stable loads, Timbrins, Big Wig sway bar, and airbags.
Any personal suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your help. We live in the middle of Washington state.

[d3500ram]

Jefe- good observations. Your explanation makes logical sense... and yea, I do not envision that bottom overload having any movement to it. I will admit that my set-up unladen rides stiff but it sure rides nice and level when I am loaded up... wet camping weight is about 4000# and handles fantastic.

I think I will probably take the felling wedges out as most of my driving right now is without camper. In fact, I did both of these add-ons at the same time... I might need to try it without the wedges this fall when I put the camper back on.

[jefe_4x4]

d3500ram,
I like your idea. Cheap and fits the space between the bottom two springs, spreading out the stress. However, I find using anything in conjunction with the lower actual overload spring makes the ride Oh-so stiff. Why? Do you actually think that thick lower spring has any flex? I think not. It's an end of travel support block. It's just the last stop on an out of control freight train. Further, when the lower overload is bottomed out the physics of frame twisting starts to take over. The stiffer the spring pack, the more twist transferred to the frame or the front springs if not equally stiffened. Maybe I'm paranoid about this, but I found out on some off-road style trucks, especially older Ford frames that flex at will, that you want to maximize the spring flexing to minimize the frame flexing. Something has to flex somewhere when you get the axles all twisted up and it might as well be the springs not the frame, especially with a TC on board.
As a historical footnote, Jeeps (capital J) starting with the WWII Willys/Ford had many thin leaves with good flexibility off-road and allowing little frame flexing. By about the CJ era in the 1950's to 1986 the springs were stiffer and transferred some of the twist to the frame, which by this time was more robust than the MB era. But the cross members, spring hangers and body bushings took it in the shorts. The YJ model in 1987 went back to a more playable spring set and there was even less frame flexing with a stiffer yet frame.
I have thought about this a lot and appreciate the Dodge front coil springs as they take over much of the suspension travel from the much stiffened suspension on the rear axle.
Oh, lots to consider. I still like the simplicity of your idea. Maybe because I have a lot of brightly colored plastic wedges laying in my chainsaw kit.
jefe

[Grit_dog]

Homemade Stableloads

Here you go.

[Ski_Pro_3]

Grit dog wrote:
FYI, I started a thread on the felling wedge stable loads on the tow rig forum just recently for anyone looking at doing that.

Can you post a link to it? I looked over the past couple pages in "Tow Vehicles" forum and couldn't find it.

[JohnAM]

I am carrying a Lance 1191 on a DRW 06 Dodge. Stableloads and Monomax shocks are all that I have added. Considering adding a sway bar but not airbags.

[Grit_dog]

FYI, I started a thread on the felling wedge stable loads on the tow rig forum just recently for anyone looking at doing that.
To the op, I will say this. You'll get the camper home with nothing but stock suspension, but you'll need something.
WIth a 3500 dually suspension, maybe not air bags, but for sure something to engage all the springs or it will sag a bunch just to get the springs to pick up the load.
Top of my head, upper and lower stable loads or home made whatever and a sway bar, but you can put some temp blocks in the suspension to see how well it controls the overall sag before deciding.

Phil, thanks for the info.

[GeoBoy]

d3500ram wrote:
For increasing when the lower overload springs engage, I used wood felling wedges. I originally used zip ties like below:



As strong as zip ties might be, I felt the over time they would wear and perhaps lose the wedges. I could never get them as tight as I hoped... I changed to hose clamps:





I place a total of 4 (2 ea. spring pack on front and rear.)


These along with home-made spacers on the uppers to engage the top overloads sooner make my ride perfectly level for very little expense.



All of these add-ons make the truck ride nice and level and smooth with a load. Unladen, it rides hard and stiff... sort of like a truck should, but that's OK (I have a car to grocery shopping.)

I found these to be the most cost effective way to level my combination.

Your camper will be at least 1,000 lbs. heavier than the Northstar Arrow this truck is carrying.
My AF 990 weighs 4,880 lbs. with 3/4 tank of water. You definitly need a Big Wig rear sway bar, bags or Timbrens and then go from there. Good luck.

[Phil_C]

I’ve been lurking around since we started looking for our camper last year.

Finally a question I can offer input on! We have a 2004.5 QC DRW Cummins and a 2016 AF 996 loaded which is just a bit heavier than what you have, full of water and stuff I have to be pushing close to 5000 lbs. Haven’t weighed it yet to be sure. Truck handles it fine as it was but I made it a bit better by:

Replaced all the shocks since it had about 270,000 miles on them, went with Monomax on the front and the RS 9000 on the back.

Installed airbags, I was told by the dealer this is what they recommend. I wouldn’t bother with this first though.

As the other poster has pictures of I too went with tree wedges, though I drilled a 3/8” hole in that lower spring and through the wedges, ground out part of that hole in the wedge to hot glue a square nut in it and then routed a slot towards the thin end for the clamps to just lay in. They can’t back out with the bolt and if I want to spend the money for Stable Loads it’s drilled already.

I also lowered the bump stop for the upper load springs with 2x2x1/4 inch square tubing.

I blow up the air bags to lift bed and separate the springs and install the wedges with the bolt through the lower spring and clamp, then set the shocks to nine, lower the bags back to 5 psi. I make sure the tires are up on pressure and I’m good to go.

I have been in 40 -50 MPH cross wind with this with no problem, Haven't yet felt the need for a sway bar, but I believe that would be next on my list. I did find that 25 miles on a bumpy dirt road made the “Cheap Camper Dude Stable loads” start pushing out so that was the reason for the holes and bolt.

That said I have had this setup just at one year and I've yet to travel more than 200 miles from home on trips yet. It's amazing what these trucks will do considering the GVWR on the door...


Phil

[jmckelvy]

My 06 has Bilstein 4600 shocks, Stable Loads, and a Hellwig sway bar. Doesn't need anything else. Fully loaded ready for extended trip I weigh slightly less than 13K lbs.

[2BLAZERS]

wfs989 wrote:
I recently purchased a 2005 Dodge 3500 dually and am wondering what to do about suspension. We are looking for a 2006 or later AF 990 and am going to install Torklift tiedowns. Depending upon which AF 990 year we get, dry weight will be around 3,500 pounds. My question is what would you recommend ? I have read on the forum and mfg's websites about Torklift stable loads, Timbrins, Big Wig sway bar, and airbags.
Any personal suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your help. We live in the middle of Washington state.

And since your Wet Weight will be closer to 5k pounds. AF 990 and anything else AF is really freaking heavy.

1. I'd suggest nothing until you get the camper on...
2. You will notice a big difference in handling with the Big Wig sway bar and some stable loads.
3. Bang for the buck I really like SuperSprings on my last two trucks for carrying my AF 1150. And for the $400, they are 1/4 the cost of airbags.

And P.S. glad your putting it on a dually!

[Herb36]

Just airbags. I have a 2004 Dodge 3500 diesel with a 1181 stuck in the back and been all over the country without a problem. However I do like d3500RAM and his idea with log splinters If I think I need them thats the way to go.

[d3500ram]

For increasing when the lower overload springs engage, I used wood felling wedges. I originally used zip ties like below:



As strong as zip ties might be, I felt the over time they would wear and perhaps lose the wedges. I could never get them as tight as I hoped... I changed to hose clamps:





I place a total of 4 (2 ea. spring pack on front and rear.)


These along with home-made spacers on the uppers to engage the top overloads sooner make my ride perfectly level for very little expense.



All of these add-ons make the truck ride nice and level and smooth with a load. Unladen, it rides hard and stiff... sort of like a truck should, but that's OK (I have a car to grocery shopping.)

I found these to be the most cost effective way to level my combination.

[Joe417]

Wait till you get it on the truck. You may not want to add anything. Our TC was quite stable before adding anything and we have less truck than you.

Of course that will depend on the individual. We don't put down stabilizers when we park for the night. Some put down all four jacks. It just doesn't bother us.

I will say, adding a Hellwig sway bar really stopped the body roll on curves, with and without the TC.