MotorTrend Tests the 1500's

[Bionic_Man]

The article

The resident RAM and EcoDiesel haters might not want to read this.

[brulaz]

jerem0621 wrote:

...
But when you drive this Ram the power always seems to be right where you need it.. No crazy shifting and 5,000 RPM wind up to get to the power... It's just there... Depress the pedal slightly and 420 lb/ft of tq are right there low in the powerband...

For Half ton loads the EcoDiesel is a great choice, it gets great MPG towing and the torque is down low in the rpm band and remains fairly constant to 3000 RPM's where the TQ starts to fall off...
...

That's pretty much the Motor Trend take on it as well. They really liked the responsiveness of the RAM EcoD with all that low rpm torque.

As for parts and EcoD availability, I guess RAM didn't expect quite the uptake they have got. Still I'm surprised at the parts issue. They could have done better there.

One of the reasons we ended up with the F150, even with the first year of a new motor (2011 EcoB), is that I knew there were Ford dealers and trucks everywhere. So if that's a concern, and you want more low end torque and HP than a normally aspirated V6, the EcoB's might do.

Motor Trend liked the 2015 2.7 EcoB almost as much as the EcoD if that means anything. Me, I'd still get the 2015 3.5L EcoB in a HD Payload F150. Now that's a real capable "half-ton" 🙂 tow truck. Unfortunately though, it burns gas when towing like similarly capable V8 gas trucks. 😞

[jerem0621]

NinerBikes wrote:

boocoodinkydow wrote:

jerem0621 wrote:
I had an experience today that kind of reminded me of this thread. I was getting my Town & Country serviced at our local dealership and they told me it would be about an hour. I said no problem...I'll go check out the Rams.

As I'm checking out all these shiny trucks I see an EcoDiesel badge and say "EcoDiesel" outloud... I hear someone respond and say "EcoDiesl POS"... I look up to see another customer who claimed that he has a friend that owns one and it's been in the shop for a month because the fuel pressure sensor is on back order...

He then points to his truck.... A Cummins Megacab 2500...then it all became clear to me.... The EcoDiesel isn't a Cummins therefore it's a "POS".

So I replied, "I have a Pentastar in my Van and if I were to buy a Ram it would probably have a Pentastar"... Fella didn't want to talk anymore, lol.

This thread has been entertaining for sure.... But I'm not sure anyone spends $35-50k on a truck purely for MPG.... EVERY SINGLE diesel owner I have known appreciated the extra MPG that a diesel Nets, but that wasn't THE reason they bought a diesel... They needed or wanted power that diesel provides.... Yes, the EcoDiesel isn't as fast as the pentastar, I don't think that's in dispute. But when you drive this Ram the power always seems to be right where you need it.. No crazy shifting and 5,000 RPM wind up to get to the power... It's just there... Depress the pedal slightly and 420 lb/ft of tq are right there low in the powerband...

For Half ton loads the EcoDiesel is a great choice, it gets great MPG towing and the torque is down low in the rpm band and remains fairly constant to 3000 RPM's where the TQ starts to fall off...

Interestingly at 3000 rpm the EcoDiesel is pulling about 400 lb ft and 215 HP....

Thanks!

Jeremiah

A fair assessment, Jeremiah. Thanx. Interesting encounter at the dealership. As an Ed owner, I would be remiss in not admitting to some trepidation over the various maintenance issues that are occurring. I take a bit of resolve in the fact that reports of problems are prevelant on any brand specific forum. Only time will tell if my concerns are founded or not. What is even more alarming, however, are the many instances of non available repair parts. I've actually seen factory buy backs & lemon law settlements simply because of delays in repair parts.

This is a common occurence on German and Italian imported cars and parts, to this day. The Japanese have figured out Just In Time inventory control, so it is much less of a problem for them.

More trucks are being built out of "parts bin" specials from subcontractor vendors, such as engine and engine components, transmissions, etc, that are located abroad. So spare parts will be something you wait for. Get used to it, don't abuse your truck while working it, and hopefully it won't break.

My experience at Hunter Dodge yesterday with a salesman was not the best. All he seemed to care about was me driving home in a new RAM ecodiesel off of his lot, that he had in inventory, that afternoon. Very obnoxious and high pressure closer type of guy. No dealership trades, and he swore up and down that you'd be lucky to get $4000 off on a 2014 Ecodiesl truck. Funny, I have a signed piece of paper with a VIN number on it, that says differently. Go figure. I would not feel comfortable giving them my business. YMMV.

As a tow vehicle, and being on vacation and possibly breaking down far from home, with no parts availability due to lack of spares near by, for weeks, it's really making me rethink if this is something I want to take a chance with.

I suggest taking a look at the Pentastar with 3.55 rear axle ratio. The Pentastar has a good distribution of power and loves to spin and make power. My Pentastar is slightly detuned from the ram Version but my 285 ish HP really put a smile on my face.

The Ram Pentastar with 3.55 will give you about 1800 lbs of payload and about 7500 lbs tow rating in a 2wd crew cab Bighorn... its 305 HP will easily handle that load. Plus when not towing you will get 20 plus MPG's around town 23 ish MPG on the highway.... and that 8 speed keeps the Pentastar well in the Powerband. When I test drove the Pentastar Ram it felt like a V8 from not too long ago as the power felt low in the RPM range and immediatly started pulling.. Unlike Fords 3.7 V6 F150 that needs 6,000 rpm to move... (not throwing stones, just seat of the pants and tach needle observations)

And the Pentastar is a pretty good sounding motor from the Cab.

I think Chrysler is approaching the 2 million mark on the Pentastar motors produced and they have proven pretty reliable.

Thanks and good luck no matter what you decide,

Jeremiah

[NinerBikes]

boocoodinkydow wrote:

jerem0621 wrote:
I had an experience today that kind of reminded me of this thread. I was getting my Town & Country serviced at our local dealership and they told me it would be about an hour. I said no problem...I'll go check out the Rams.

As I'm checking out all these shiny trucks I see an EcoDiesel badge and say "EcoDiesel" outloud... I hear someone respond and say "EcoDiesl POS"... I look up to see another customer who claimed that he has a friend that owns one and it's been in the shop for a month because the fuel pressure sensor is on back order...

He then points to his truck.... A Cummins Megacab 2500...then it all became clear to me.... The EcoDiesel isn't a Cummins therefore it's a "POS".

So I replied, "I have a Pentastar in my Van and if I were to buy a Ram it would probably have a Pentastar"... Fella didn't want to talk anymore, lol.

This thread has been entertaining for sure.... But I'm not sure anyone spends $35-50k on a truck purely for MPG.... EVERY SINGLE diesel owner I have known appreciated the extra MPG that a diesel Nets, but that wasn't THE reason they bought a diesel... They needed or wanted power that diesel provides.... Yes, the EcoDiesel isn't as fast as the pentastar, I don't think that's in dispute. But when you drive this Ram the power always seems to be right where you need it.. No crazy shifting and 5,000 RPM wind up to get to the power... It's just there... Depress the pedal slightly and 420 lb/ft of tq are right there low in the powerband...

For Half ton loads the EcoDiesel is a great choice, it gets great MPG towing and the torque is down low in the rpm band and remains fairly constant to 3000 RPM's where the TQ starts to fall off...

Interestingly at 3000 rpm the EcoDiesel is pulling about 400 lb ft and 215 HP....

Thanks!

Jeremiah

A fair assessment, Jeremiah. Thanx. Interesting encounter at the dealership. As an Ed owner, I would be remiss in not admitting to some trepidation over the various maintenance issues that are occurring. I take a bit of resolve in the fact that reports of problems are prevelant on any brand specific forum. Only time will tell if my concerns are founded or not. What is even more alarming, however, are the many instances of non available repair parts. I've actually seen factory buy backs & lemon law settlements simply because of delays in repair parts.

This is a common occurence on German and Italian imported cars and parts, to this day. The Japanese have figured out Just In Time inventory control, so it is much less of a problem for them.

More trucks are being built out of "parts bin" specials from subcontractor vendors, such as engine and engine components, transmissions, etc, that are located abroad. So spare parts will be something you wait for. Get used to it, don't abuse your truck while working it, and hopefully it won't break.

My experience at Hunter Dodge yesterday with a salesman was not the best. All he seemed to care about was me driving home in a new RAM ecodiesel off of his lot, that he had in inventory, that afternoon. Very obnoxious and high pressure closer type of guy. No dealership trades, and he swore up and down that you'd be lucky to get $4000 off on a 2014 Ecodiesl truck. Funny, I have a signed piece of paper with a VIN number on it, that says differently. Go figure. I would not feel comfortable giving them my business. YMMV.

As a tow vehicle, and being on vacation and possibly breaking down far from home, with no parts availability due to lack of spares near by, for weeks, it's really making me rethink if this is something I want to take a chance with.

[boocoodinkydow]

jerem0621 wrote:
I had an experience today that kind of reminded me of this thread. I was getting my Town & Country serviced at our local dealership and they told me it would be about an hour. I said no problem...I'll go check out the Rams.

As I'm checking out all these shiny trucks I see an EcoDiesel badge and say "EcoDiesel" outloud... I hear someone respond and say "EcoDiesl POS"... I look up to see another customer who claimed that he has a friend that owns one and it's been in the shop for a month because the fuel pressure sensor is on back order...

He then points to his truck.... A Cummins Megacab 2500...then it all became clear to me.... The EcoDiesel isn't a Cummins therefore it's a "POS".

So I replied, "I have a Pentastar in my Van and if I were to buy a Ram it would probably have a Pentastar"... Fella didn't want to talk anymore, lol.

This thread has been entertaining for sure.... But I'm not sure anyone spends $35-50k on a truck purely for MPG.... EVERY SINGLE diesel owner I have known appreciated the extra MPG that a diesel Nets, but that wasn't THE reason they bought a diesel... They needed or wanted power that diesel provides.... Yes, the EcoDiesel isn't as fast as the pentastar, I don't think that's in dispute. But when you drive this Ram the power always seems to be right where you need it.. No crazy shifting and 5,000 RPM wind up to get to the power... It's just there... Depress the pedal slightly and 420 lb/ft of tq are right there low in the powerband...

For Half ton loads the EcoDiesel is a great choice, it gets great MPG towing and the torque is down low in the rpm band and remains fairly constant to 3000 RPM's where the TQ starts to fall off...

Interestingly at 3000 rpm the EcoDiesel is pulling about 400 lb ft and 215 HP....

Thanks!

Jeremiah

A fair assessment, Jeremiah. Thanx. Interesting encounter at the dealership. As an Ed owner, I would be remiss in not admitting to some trepidation over the various maintenance issues that are occurring. I take a bit of resolve in the fact that reports of problems are prevelant on any brand specific forum. Only time will tell if my concerns are founded or not. What is even more alarming, however, are the many instances of non available repair parts. I've actually seen factory buy backs & lemon law settlements simply because of delays in repair parts.

[jerem0621]

I had an experience today that kind of reminded me of this thread. I was getting my Town & Country serviced at our local dealership and they told me it would be about an hour. I said no problem...I'll go check out the Rams.

As I'm checking out all these shiny trucks I see an EcoDiesel badge and say "EcoDiesel" outloud... I hear someone respond and say "EcoDiesl POS"... I look up to see another customer who claimed that he has a friend that owns one and it's been in the shop for a month because the fuel pressure sensor is on back order...

He then points to his truck.... A Cummins Megacab 2500...then it all became clear to me.... The EcoDiesel isn't a Cummins therefore it's a "POS".

So I replied, "I have a Pentastar in my Van and if I were to buy a Ram it would probably have a Pentastar"... Fella didn't want to talk anymore, lol.

This thread has been entertaining for sure.... But I'm not sure anyone spends $35-50k on a truck purely for MPG.... EVERY SINGLE diesel owner I have known appreciated the extra MPG that a diesel Nets, but that wasn't THE reason they bought a diesel... They needed or wanted power that diesel provides.... Yes, the EcoDiesel isn't as fast as the pentastar, I don't think that's in dispute. But when you drive this Ram the power always seems to be right where you need it.. No crazy shifting and 5,000 RPM wind up to get to the power... It's just there... Depress the pedal slightly and 420 lb/ft of tq are right there low in the powerband...

For Half ton loads the EcoDiesel is a great choice, it gets great MPG towing and the torque is down low in the rpm band and remains fairly constant to 3000 RPM's where the TQ starts to fall off...

Interestingly at 3000 rpm the EcoDiesel is pulling about 400 lb ft and 215 HP....

Thanks!

Jeremiah

[Bionic_Man]

womps wrote:
As for the comment that diesels hold a higher resale across the board except a 6.0 Powerstroke, good luck on getting rid of a used 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee with the Ecodiesel engine. I know, I have one. Dealers in Canada are quite reluctant to have one sit on their lot.

Maybe Canada is different, but that is not the case here. I have been looking. Very few around, and the ones that I am finding are about the same price as brand new.

[boocoodinkydow]

ib516 wrote:

APT wrote:
I feel so much better now that I've blocked HybridHunter. Happy Friday!

x2

Uh-Oh, HH, looks like you may be losing your audience. Do you suppose your incessant rhetoric is beginning to bore?!? Don't worry, though; I'll stick with you until the end. I find the egotistical idiocy superbly entertaining!

[Hannibal]

NinerBikes wrote:
HybridHunter needs to change his name to "EcodieselHater" I just skip the post and piss on the dribble.

Nah. I'm sure he's one of the juvenile dorks that giggles while blowing smoke as he passes me in my Prius thinking it bothers me. The funniest one was on East Bay in Largo a few months ago. Peewee pulled up behind me in his big boy truck about .040" from my rear bumper. I was soo skeered! Then when he got the chance he nailed it to pass as I was only doing a little over the speed limit. It sounded pretty good and was rolling good coal and alluva sudden bang wrap wrap wrap as he limped to the center lane and stopped. It was a 6.0psd by the silver badge. Hopefully just the intercooler hose blew off as his mom would surely be peaced if she had to pay for an expensive repair. I laughed and went on. I could have been nice and stopped to help as I probably have more tools in my Prius than he owns. But I didn't.

[womps]

As for the comment that diesels hold a higher resale across the board except a 6.0 Powerstroke, good luck on getting rid of a used 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee with the Ecodiesel engine. I know, I have one. Dealers in Canada are quite reluctant to have one sit on their lot.

[NinerBikes]

HybridHunter needs to change his name to "EcodieselHater" I just skip the post and piss on the dribble.

[ib516]

APT wrote:
I feel so much better now that I've blocked HybridHunter. Happy Friday!

x2

[APT]

I feel so much better now that I've blocked HybridHunter. Happy Friday!

[rjstractor]

NinerBikes wrote:
I admire the efficiency of rolling my foot into the throttle slowly and feeling that rubberband acceleration effect to pass, going from 60 to 80 mph. That's what a TDI does so well. To me, it is well worth the premium.

The newer direct injected turbo gas engines feel exactly the same way. With newer technology you can have that great driving experience with either diesel or gas.

[NinerBikes]

Hybridhunter wrote:
also....
"Another way to look at this is with respect to fuel energy (the classic engineering approach) - because a gallon of diesel has 12.5 % more energy than a gallon of gasoline. MPG(gasoline-equivalent) = MPG(diesel) / 1.125

Based on energy, the RWD Dodge Ram 3.0 L with 23 MPG (diesel) combined rating would be equivalent to 20.4 MPG (gasoline-equivalent) combined rating.

The RWD Ford (2.7 L turbo gasoline) with a 22 MPG combined rating is slightly better.
"
Ya

How I choose to look at it... I've owned diesel almost continuously since 1981. VW jetta, '83 Audi5000TD, '88 Ford F250 w 7.3 Navistar/IH, '96 passat tdi, '98 jetta tdi, 2002 jetta GLS TDI, 2012 passat tdi se 6 manual, 2012 Touareg sport tdi, 2013 Touareg Sport TDI, 2014 Passat TDI tdi se 6 DSG.

I don't care what it costs new, or what the maintenance costs are, nothing compares to driving the torque of a turbo diesel, I pay gladly for the premium in maintenance to do so. I admire the efficiency of rolling my foot into the throttle slowly and feeling that rubberband acceleration effect to pass, going from 60 to 80 mph. That's what a TDI does so well. To me, it is well worth the premium.

Choose your poison, but don't rag on another for their choices. Their money, they are free to spend it as they choose.

Turbodiesels aren't for everyone... they don't need to be.