Oct-13-2014 02:27 PM
Oct-15-2014 04:08 PM
Oct-14-2014 06:52 PM
Oct-14-2014 06:50 PM
Oct-14-2014 06:45 PM
Buck50HD wrote:
The weakness of the 6.4's 1st and 2nd gear have been exposed. It's not a mystery.
My favorite part of the video is the 6.7 Super Duty with a trailer blowing by like they're standing still (21:52).
When the air is thin and grade gets steep, it's all about gear ratios. A 4.30 Ford 6.2 would most likely dominate this test.
On the other hand, there are combinations of loads and grades where the 6.4 will dominate.
Oct-14-2014 06:16 PM
ScottG wrote:RCMAN46 wrote:ScottG wrote:blderman wrote:ordually wrote:
TFLTruck did a Ike Gauntlet tow test of a 2015 Ram 6.4L 4.10.
Identical axle ratio and load (12.5K) to the 2015 Chevy 2500 they tested a few months ago. The Chevy gives up ~50hp and lb-ft. Surprising outcome.
I don't read the article as they weighed the same. I read it as they were within 100lbs of their GCVW. If that is actually the case then the Ram weighed 2,000lbs more. It still doesn't justify that 2nd gear is inadequate but it would definitely make a big difference.
That's a good point. If they weren't loaded the same then the results are meaningless.
It would be nice if everyone would take the time to view the video and pay attention. If you did you would know both trucks were towing the same load with in 100 lbs.
I did watch the Video but I missed that point. So what? That's why we have civil discussions - or at least try to.
Oct-14-2014 06:06 PM
Oct-14-2014 02:50 PM
Oct-14-2014 02:40 PM
ordually wrote:ib516 wrote:
Here's what was added by the guys from TFL in the comments:
Ram Truck “invented” the first gear hold feature – and calibrated it – to avoid gear hunting and driving at excessively high rpm’s.
Ike is a variable grade and we worked hard to develop a calibration that appropriately manages torque on the run and other grades.
We don’t want the truck to rev high for extended periods of time and purposely hold 4,200 rpm.
Seems like there's some designed in limiting by the PCM/ECM going on here.
Interesting. I wonder what the Ram powertrain engineering folks would say about needing to avoid more than a sustained 4200RPM. Cooling limitation? BMEP? Transmission limitation? Rating a motor at 5600 RPM and only using 3/4s of the HP is surprising. I wonder how the PCM would know to enforce limit, as it would be too obvious to do it on the 1-2 upshift, and way too obvious to just pull fuel from the driver when holding in first to bring RPM from say 5000 back to 4200. Perhaps only on the 2-1 downshift then it applies the 4200?
IB516--have you noticed any PCM/ECM limitations along the lines of what Ram described in your towings?
Oct-14-2014 02:02 PM
ordually wrote:ib516 wrote:
Here's what was added by the guys from TFL in the comments:
Ram Truck “invented” the first gear hold feature – and calibrated it – to avoid gear hunting and driving at excessively high rpm’s.
Ike is a variable grade and we worked hard to develop a calibration that appropriately manages torque on the run and other grades.
We don’t want the truck to rev high for extended periods of time and purposely hold 4,200 rpm.
Seems like there's some designed in limiting by the PCM/ECM going on here.
Interesting. I wonder what the Ram powertrain engineering folks would say about needing to avoid more than a sustained 4200RPM. Cooling limitation? BMEP? Transmission limitation? Rating a motor at 5600 RPM and only using 3/4s of the HP is surprising. I wonder how the PCM would know to enforce limit, as it would be too obvious to do it on the 1-2 upshift, and way too obvious to just pull fuel from the driver when holding in first to bring RPM from say 5000 back to 4200. Perhaps only on the 2-1 downshift then it applies the 4200?
IB516--have you noticed any PCM/ECM limitations along the lines of what Ram described in your towings?
Oct-14-2014 01:54 PM
katoom400 wrote:dreeder wrote:
Huh, other than the cylinder deactivation, I can't see a reason to choose the 6.4 over the 5.7.
I have not driven a 5.7 Hemi, but I do have a Tundra with the 5.7 and it did a awesome job pulling my ~7000lb trailer up a very steep grade leaving the campground last weekend. I was holding 60mph @ ~3000rpm and nobody felt the need to pass me even though I was in the slow lane.
if the Hemi is as good as the I-Force 5.7 then I think it would be a fine choice for a gas motor in a 2500.
The reasons I'm looking at the 6.4 would be the cylinder deactivation when empty (95% of the time for me) and the torque coming on 1000 rpm earlier than the 5.7, leads me to believe it would not have to rev as high climbing grades or off the line.
I did test drive a new 6.4 with 3.73's and I was not impressed with off the line torque compared to the Tundra (4.30's). 4.10 gears probably would have changed that for the Ram.
It's a tough call on the 6.4...fairly new motor, possibly better mileage/torque. the 5.7 is a known commodity and seems to be up to the task. However someone coming off a diesel would likely want as much torque as they could get in a gas motor and I would think the 6.4/4.10 combo would be the better choice for the $1500 difference.
Would I like the 6.7 oil burner? Absolutely, but not for the $8k cost of admission given I'm running unloaded 95% of the time and live in the cold north east. I had a f250 with the 7.3 and it was great when I was towing, but really it was just loud, expensive and a general PIA in the winter months. If I lived and a warmer area, or towed heavy loads more often it would be different.
Oct-14-2014 12:49 PM
Oct-14-2014 11:12 AM
Oct-14-2014 10:17 AM
Oct-14-2014 09:32 AM