Tight nuts

[pigbike]

I took my Dodge 3500 to the local Dodge dealer for a tire rotation today. They said that they couldn't get the lug nuts loose on the rear duallies. They tried soaking them with penetrating oil but they wouldn't break loose.

They never got them off and told me to make an appt. so they could heat them up and try again.

Has anyone every had this problem? I was there when the tires were put on and the tech tightened them with a torque wrench to my surprise.

Any suggestions on how to get them loose. They said they tried a breaker bar and air tool but no go.

[fj12ryder]

Me Again wrote:

fj12ryder wrote:
The OP said he was there when they put the tires on and they used a torque wrench, not an air wrench.

Just seems very odd. I'd love to know exactly what happened and how.

Drove it on the beach one to many times at high tide!!!!

Chris

I would never have thought of that. That's what happens when you live in the beachless Midwest. 🙂

[Me_Again]

toolman1 wrote:

Me Again wrote:

toolman1 wrote:
Having run a front-end and alignment shop for a number of years I have seen this all too many times. The aluminum alloy lug nuts interact with the steel studs that they are threaded on to. Not corrosion, but something similar to electrolysis. I don't care how large of an air impact a person use's those lug nuts will usually destroy the threads of the studs. So a torch might be necessary, but that is usually a last resort. The bottom line will be stud replacement, as well as new lug nuts, and a good coating of "Antiseize Compound" will prevent future problems. Yea, it'll cost ya now, but there isn't any other option. Sorry.

What vehicles of which you speak use such lug nuts. I have owned quite a few vehicles in the last 55 years and have never seen that. Chris

Do a GM service bulletin search my friend, somewhere in the 1995-2005 decade. Thread corrosion on lug nut threads was a HUGE issue on C,K, and G series vans.

And they used aluminum alloy lug nuts????? Chris

[fj12ryder]

toolman1 wrote:

Me Again wrote:

toolman1 wrote:
Having run a front-end and alignment shop for a number of years I have seen this all too many times. The aluminum alloy lug nuts interact with the steel studs that they are threaded on to. Not corrosion, but something similar to electrolysis. I don't care how large of an air impact a person use's those lug nuts will usually destroy the threads of the studs. So a torch might be necessary, but that is usually a last resort. The bottom line will be stud replacement, as well as new lug nuts, and a good coating of "Antiseize Compound" will prevent future problems. Yea, it'll cost ya now, but there isn't any other option. Sorry.

What vehicles of which you speak use such lug nuts. I have owned quite a few vehicles in the last 55 years and have never seen that. Chris

Do a GM service bulletin search my friend, somewhere in the 1995-2005 decade. Thread corrosion on lug nut threads was a HUGE issue on C,K, and G series vans.

But the OP has a Dodge dually pickup, not a GM van. :h

[Me_Again]

fj12ryder wrote:
The OP said he was there when they put the tires on and they used a torque wrench, not an air wrench.

Just seems very odd. I'd love to know exactly what happened and how.

Drove it on the beach one to many times at high tide!!!!

Chris

[fj12ryder]

The OP said he was there when they put the tires on and they used a torque wrench, not an air wrench.

Just seems very odd. I'd love to know exactly what happened and how.

[toolman1]

Me Again wrote:

toolman1 wrote:
Having run a front-end and alignment shop for a number of years I have seen this all too many times. The aluminum alloy lug nuts interact with the steel studs that they are threaded on to. Not corrosion, but something similar to electrolysis. I don't care how large of an air impact a person use's those lug nuts will usually destroy the threads of the studs. So a torch might be necessary, but that is usually a last resort. The bottom line will be stud replacement, as well as new lug nuts, and a good coating of "Antiseize Compound" will prevent future problems. Yea, it'll cost ya now, but there isn't any other option. Sorry.

What vehicles of which you speak use such lug nuts. I have owned quite a few vehicles in the last 55 years and have never seen that. Chris

Do a GM service bulletin search my friend, somewhere in the 1995-2005 decade. Thread corrosion on lug nut threads was a HUGE issue on C,K, and G series vans.

[Wes_Tausend]

...

The "hurry-up" shop mistakenly used an air wrench to install them. This is a common problem. The correct way is to maybe use a power screwdriver, or very loose air setting, to spin the nuts on and then hand-tighten them with a real static torque wrench, or simply the talented feel of an experienced mechanic. Air wrenches get tighter the longer they are held on to hammer.

Don't fool around and wreck the studs. Use a nut splitter. Chase the stud threads with a die, then oil, or anti-seize, the threads to re-apply new nuts. Take care to not overtorque them back on or let anyone else do it either. They only need be tight enough to keep from coming loose... no more. Recheck for tightness after the first few miles. That's it.

Wes
...

[Me_Again]

http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/tech/techpage.jsp?techid=107&

Torque settings are based on clean dry threads!!!

Chris

[pigbike]

I believe the nuts are steel as well as the studs. They did mention that they may need to heat them up. I use anti seize on everything and will put it on the studs if I get them off. I have been spraying them with Liquid Wrench since I came home.

So for right now I am just soaking my nuts, hoping for good things to happen.

[Peg_Leg]

Man I've done it all loosening lug nuts. Stood and bounced on the lug wrench, blah, blah, blah. The best tool in my box is an old Craftsman L shaped solid steel with a 1/2" drive on each end. I can stack extensions on the end or even get out Big Bertha the 4' cheater pipe.

Some of the old Dodge's had left hand threads on the left side. I've had to replace a few broken studs when I worked at a tire shop because someone didn't check for " L " stamped on the end of the stud.

[Vulcaneer]

Me Again wrote:
How is rim heating done without burning up the clear coating? Chris

Oh...it will burn up the clear coat. But if your problem is to remove the wheel, this will remove the wheel and retain the studs.

If you want to keep the clear coat? Don't use heat. Get a 4 foot cheater pipe over your breaker bar. Take the handle off your floor jack and use that. Don't ever use a torque wrench to REMOVE tight nuts. Unless you want to replace your torque wrench.

If the nuts are rusted onto the studs. You may break the studs. And so just replace them. Then once the wheel comes off with the broken studs, if the nuts are galvanized into the lug holes, use a punch to punch out the studs and lug nuts. It will take a big punch and a bigger hammer. Chance are you'll need to buy new lug nuts. You'll never get those studs out of the lug nuts.

Not smart to use anti seize on the threads. But it is smart to use anti-seize on the outside diameter of the nuts. So they don't seize on the hole in the alum rim.

I have never seen an Aluminum lug nut. But I'll bet they are out there, with good hardfacing technology. I just cannot figure out why anyone would need them. Certainly not for cosmetics. Or economics. Or strength.

[D_E_Bishop]

Maybe toolman1 was speaking of lugnuts for Aluminum Alloy Wheels. I believe the lug nuts for my Suzi have a different angle to the seating face. By the way, we just bought a newer(2006) Suzi towed and when I was checking lug nuts for tightness, found to break the nuts loose I had to set the torque wrench to 160 ft lbs. The new tires on the Suzi must have been installed by a shade tree tire shop. Two of the studs and nuts were ruined and I had all of them replaced. Even took my anti-seize with me to the guy who replaced the studs and he told me no need to do that and they would use theirs. Turns out they removed all the lug nuts and applied anti-seize before re-torqueing. I like them.

[C_Schomer]

I used to run into nuts that tight when I had a station/garage. My impact hammer w/chisel bit would remove any tight nut w/o additional thread damage and I'd run a die on the bolt threads. Craig

[Me_Again]

How is rim heating done without burning up the clear coating? Chris

[Water-Bug]

Vulcaneer wrote:
I think the problem might be that the rims are aluminum. And the nuts are steel. As are the studs. The problem is not the nut being too tight on the stud. But the hole in the aluminum rim galvanizing (as said above, Galvanic action... is kinda like electrolisis)
to the OD of the nut.

It does take heat to break the nut loose from the lug holes in the rim. But really, all they need to do is apply a small (as in just warm) the area of the rim around the lug nut. The heat opens up the hole enough so an impact wrench can loosen the lug nut. A good shop should know that. A bad shop would apply way too much heat, and screw things up even worse. But the shop you took it to should know that. So find a good shop.

You're probably right. I do have aluminum wheels. My 2006 Ridgeline came from the factory with chrome plated caps on the valve stems. They froze on and the dealer had to replace all the valve stems and TPM sensors. An expensive fix because of some 10 cent valve stem caps. The new valve stems came with caps that were silver colored plastic.