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I have a weight dilemma.. what would you do?

upsfella
Explorer
Explorer
2500 Silverado Diesel GVW 10,000
Rushmore Washington 5ver 15,500
I have 20" rims on pickup 20% of 15500 is 3255 +8380= 11635
Would you look at trading pickup for dually or spend money to beef up my current unit?
I'm not sure if this is the place to put this but I'm looking for as much input on this forum as I can get. Thanks for you help. By the way pickup only has 1000 miles on it!! Ouch.
I know, I know probably should have done more research. I would love to here some thoughts and suggestions.
42 REPLIES 42

CWSWine
Explorer
Explorer
travelnutz wrote:


Nearly 4 decades (now retired) of doing vehicle engineering, component design, testing, etc contract or by invite for GM, Ford, and Chrysler Corps with my owned engineering operation. Mostly trucks, vans, and SUVs. Also our 51st year of RVing ourselves. Just want to help RV'ers enjoy and be safe.


Maybe you can verify information I got from a retired vehicle engineer that now teaching engineering at the college level. He said there are test done with plate between the 5er hitch that can measure weight changes while towing. He stated the scale weight is a static weight and that while towing the pin weight can vary by 30% or more. Hitting the dip in road or going down steep hill and applying the brakes shifts weight forward onto the pin. Is this true? So that 3,000 lbs pin weight can jump up to 3900 lbs or more. That is why you should leave a margin between max axle/tire ratings and stay close to the CC of the TV.
2017 Discovery XLE 40 D DP
Sold Grand Design Solitude 310GK-R
Sold 2016 GMC Denali 1 ton Diesel 3722 CC
5er 13,600 - 3100 pin - Truck Weight 11380 Truck GVWR 11,500
Only 180 lbs below my trucks MAX GVWR

Lantley
Nomad
Nomad
Based on your initial post you already realise you purchased the wrong truck. The only right way to correct this issue is to purchase the correct truck, which for me would be a dually. The sooner you trade your current truck the more it will be worth. The longer you delay the more it will cost in the end.
Of course you could ignore the whole issue however your post indicates you know better than that.
19'Duramax w/hips, 2022 Alliance Paradigm 390MP >BD3,r,22" Blackstone
r,RV760 w/BC20,Glow Steps, Enduraplas25,Pedego
BakFlip,RVLock,Prog.50A surge ,Hughes autoformer
Porta Bote 8.0 Nissan, Sailun S637

upsfella
Explorer
Explorer
Thank you travelnutz and everyone else. Some great info!!!

coolbreeze01
Explorer
Explorer
upsfella wrote:
I know what I have to do. Maybe if I trade for same color vehicle with dually DW won't notice!! hehe:B


What could go wrong? Well played :B
2008 Ram 3500 With a Really Strong Tractor Motor...........
LB, SRW, 4X4, 6-Speed Auto, 3.73, Prodigy P3, Blue Ox Sway Pro........
2014 Sandsport 26FBSL

08UltraRider
Explorer
Explorer
I think travelnutz gave some excellent advice and allow me to add my experience.

My last truck (2500 HD) and a bit lighter 5er than yours. Quoting from CRS memory but once I added in the hitch weight, people, gear & fuel including a transfer flow tank I was over the GVWR of the truck by about a 1000 pounds. Truck was near the RAWR of 6000 pounds which is pretty much the limits for the two E rated tires.

Truck pulled it well but.... Stability wasn't good especially in a side wind. Air bags helped but still not where I liked..

I upgraded to a dually where it made a night and day difference in stability and braking ability... Peace of mind that I'm way under on the TV capacity is nice too.

upsfella
Explorer
Explorer
Yes the 11,000 pounds on the rear axle was a misprint. I should have said 11000 on TV

travelnutz
Explorer II
Explorer II
Must be a drastic misprint or false info.

I totally doubt the rear axle of the 2500HD truck weight actually weighs 11,000 lbs with the empty 5th wheel pin on it. The unloaded rear axle of your GM 2500HD truck weighs approx 3,000 lbs as I have the same GM Diesel Crew Cab Long Bed 4X4 truck and have scale weighed it unloaded more than once. Your 5th wheel couldn't possibly have an 8,000 lb pin weight as NO production made 5th wheel pin weight even goes as high as 5,000 lbs unloaded even in the luxury very high end 42' long 5th wheels. Most are even well below 3500 to 4,000 lbs pin weight.

LOOK at the Rushmore Washington brochure specifications as it clearly lists the pin weight as 2892 lbs empty. Add that 2892 lbs to your 2500HD rear axle unloaded weight and you have roughly 6,000 lbs total before you load any cargo in the RV or persons in the truck of which over 50% of their (persons) weight is on the truck's front axle. Your entire truck's total weight with the 5th wheel attached including 2 adults and a full tank of fuel may weight close to 11,000 lbs on the the total 4 tires.

Your real concern is the max tire capacity of the 2 rear tires at max inflation as that should not be exceeded. Tire capacities and inflations are almost always the weakest link in truck/vehicle loading. Simple to replace the tires with a higher carrying capacity or add airbags etc or an edditional spring leaf. If you have a 4x4 truck, you must have all 4 tires being the same size as in circumference or you'll ruin your transfer case unit prematurely.

Also, best to have all 4 tires be at the same inflation so tire squash is minimized due to the weight they carry maintains the same road surface to centerline point of its axle actual dimension so that each tire revolution of all tires freely moves the truck/vehicle the same distance which doesn't put immense pressure on the transfer case unit which causes heat and premature wear. A squashed tire will travel less distance in one revolution than a non-squashed tire of the same carcas size because the squashed tire has less distance to the road;s surface creating a smaller effective tire circumference. It's the effective circumference that controls the distance made good with each 360 degree tire rotation. Tires fighting each other for distance gained in rotations increases heat, wear, and premature tire failure plus lower MPGs while allowing it.

Doubtful that in real life travel use, you will be at the max GVWR of the 5th wheel and that is something you can control and also the location placement of those items added. Food for thought: 100 lbs added in the rear of an RV averages approx 75 lbs less tongue or pin weight. While 100 lbs added in the front of an RV averages 80-90+ lbs of additional tongue or pin weight. Help yourself! However, do not ever get your tongue or pin weight below the minimum RV unit weight required. 10% to 12% for TT's and 15% to 20% for 5th wheels.

Nearly 4 decades (now retired) of doing vehicle engineering, component design, testing, etc contract or by invite for GM, Ford, and Chrysler Corps with my owned engineering operation. Mostly trucks, vans, and SUVs. Also our 51st year of RVing ourselves. Just want to help RV'ers enjoy and be safe.
A superb CC LB 4X4, GM HD Diesel, airbags, Rancho's, lots more
Lance Legend TC 11' 4", loaded including 3400 PP generator and my deluxe 2' X 7' rear porch
29 ft Carriage Carri-lite 5'er - a specially built gem
A like new '07 Sunline Solaris 26' TT

Kayteg1
Explorer II
Explorer II
The calculations posted in 2 replies don't add up.
If the 5th added 3250lb and the GVW 10,000 truck should put +- 5000lb on the rear, that makes 8200 lb on the rear.
So was the 11,000 lb actual scales reading?
While you can make SRW handling 8000 lb on the rear axle, I am pretty sure you need dually for anything above that number.

nevadanick
Explorer
Explorer
What was the weight on the rear axle ? And what are the tire ratings ?

Cloud_Dancer
Explorer II
Explorer II
Excellent plan! Genius,....blaming the wife for having to buy the truck you always wanted...:B
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Miko & Sparky
2003 41 ft Dutch Star Diesel Pusher/Spartan
Floorplan 4010
Blazer toad & Ranger bassboat

upsfella
Explorer
Explorer
I know what I have to do. Maybe if I trade for same color vehicle with dually DW won't notice!! hehe:B

upsfella
Explorer
Explorer
rhagfo wrote:
upsfella wrote:
I do own both units. Rear axle weighed 11000 pounds with 12,800 pound empty 5ver attached. Plan On doing some full-time in about a year. Thanks all for the input. I really don't want o have to worry about weight if I'm going on a longer trip. Bought truck first and DW fell in love with camper. I know I know


Well if the rear axle weighed 11,000# you have a real issue!! :B

If it bothers you like I said before get a bigger TV.

Otherwise post some scale weights!

TV ratings
Front GAWR =
Rear GAWR =

Weigh empty TV
Front axle =
Rear axle =

Weigh Package ready to go on a trip.
TV
Front axle =
Rear axle =
Trailer axles =


haha my bad on rear axel weight. meant to say tv

rhagfo
Explorer III
Explorer III
upsfella wrote:
I do own both units. Rear axle weighed 11000 pounds with 12,800 pound empty 5ver attached. Plan On doing some full-time in about a year. Thanks all for the input. I really don't want o have to worry about weight if I'm going on a longer trip. Bought truck first and DW fell in love with camper. I know I know


Well if the rear axle weighed 11,000# you have a real issue!! :B

If it bothers you like I said before get a bigger TV.

Otherwise post some scale weights!

TV ratings
Front GAWR =
Rear GAWR =

Weigh empty TV
Front axle =
Rear axle =

Weigh Package ready to go on a trip.
TV
Front axle =
Rear axle =
Trailer axles =
Russ & Paula the Beagle Belle.
2016 Ram Laramie 3500 Aisin DRW 4X4 Long bed.
2005 Copper Canyon 293 FWSLS, 32' GVWR 12,360#

"Visit and Enjoy Oregon State Parks"

Cummins12V98
Explorer III
Explorer III
With that size RV you need a newer 3500 for sure at a "MINIMUM" if you want to hook and go and feel completely relaxed while towing in ANY conditions and situations go Dually.

The fact is when you go full time the GVWR of the RV is easily exceeded! I know. Also the 20% number is more for weekend warriors and the 25% rule is more likely as you are constantly adding weight while fulltiming. I know.

So your 15,500# and most likely more RV will turn into one with 3,875 pin or more. I know.

Weigh your trucks rear axle ready to tow with you both inside take that from your rear axle rating. That is your available pin weight. 100# +- will only transfer to your front axle.

My advice get the Dually, most likely after 3 years of fulltiming she will want a larger RV. I know. :B
2015 RAM LongHorn 3500 Dually CrewCab 4X4 CUMMINS/AISIN RearAir 385HP/865TQ 4:10's
37,800# GCVWR "Towing Beast"

"HeavyWeight" B&W RVK3600

2016 MobileSuites 39TKSB3 highly "Elited" In the stable

2007.5 Mobile Suites 36 SB3 29,000# Combined SOLD

Walaby
Explorer II
Explorer II
I'd have to side with the folks who suggest a bigger truck. It's an endless debate and either way you want to go, you can find folks who will give you info and opinion that you can justify a decision against.

I personnally try to live within ALL the numbers, and not let myself try to rationalize exceeding truck GVWR because my tires or axle ratings are not exceeded. Is there some safety margin in manufacturers numbers??? Im sure there is and recently on a short trip with grand kids, bikes, firewood etc, I did exceed GVWR but not axle or tire. But it was a short trip and I will probably not do it again.

Whether or not you need a dually is another question all together. But, I would tend to believe you need a full ton truck. BUT, I would also weigh it all first, since you own them both already. Based on your numbers, assuming you do get to that pin weight, your nearly 2K over GVWR... that's a lot.

Mike
Im Mike Willoughby, and I approve this message.
2017 Ram 3500 CTD (aka FRAM)
2019 GrandDesign Reflection 367BHS