Smoking wheels

[KAYAKFISH]

Towing my 2012 26 ft. Jayco tt from Pa. to SC. After traveling @150 miles I stopped at a red light and a truck pulled up along side and the driver yells(YOUR WHEELS ARE SMOKING!) To make a long story short, we pull over and called Good Sam & they sent some one out.
The guy thinks it is a wheel bearing but the bearing looks good. He pulls the wheel and the brakes fall out, pieces of metal, brake shoes, springs, electric brakes. He replaces everything. He checks the other wheel on the same side,same thing. The adjustment screw came apart and jammed the brakes. The other side was okay. Has anyone else experience anything like this?

[Gdetrailer]

BenK wrote:

Gdetrailer wrote:

BenK wrote:
Why I check the trailer brakes (how warm/hot, how they sound rolling to a stop,
manually adjust the self adjusters, etc) at every stop

Even carry rebuild kits and have had to rebuild them out there

Now that is just plain silly...

Okay, if you say so, but that is for you, not me

I can not imagine that anyone is willing to tear apart or roll under the trailer and "adjust" the bakes manually.

I would suggest that you stop this practice, rest stops, parking lots and the such are a TERRIBLE place to attempt these kinds of preventative maintenance items. It is an extremely dangerous to do this even while on level land without adding public traffic.

Guess you never go to the places I do, so you are right for those
places you visit that is correct, but again, not for me

Your brakes even if you don't have auto adjusters WILL not require any adjustments to be done for 10,000-12,000 miles or one year. This IS the industry standard.

Agree for 'some' vehicles and for
the general folks out there and of which you must be...the fat part
of that herd

I am NOT part of that herd

Adjusting them needlessly using the "inspection" hole only will wear out the shoes at a faster rate at the least and at the worst OVER TIGHTEN the shoes causing extreme heat and possible loss of brakes.

Nope...not on the stuff I have or borrow...you must be buy cheap to
have that kind of wear and tear

Or your overly forcing, but you say you know HOW2...weird and goes
back to most likely buying cheap

The ONLY WAY to SAFELY "adjust" the brake shoes is to REMOVE the drum.

Maybe for you, but I've never lost a finger nor got hurt using the
shop manual's instructions to use that 'hole'

Simply put, you want only a SLIGHT amount of "resistance" felt when removing the drum. The brakes should not drag on the drums very much, only VERY SLIGHTLY. There is no way you can perform that while using the inspection cover and not jacking up the wheel.

I do jack that tire off pavement 'most' times. Can also adjust it
without jacking it up and am perfectly good for that and must be your
experience over tightening, but that is not needed by me

Or that some trailers I borrow has the drum groved and doesn't come
off that easily, but I don't manually adjust them by taking the drum
off, so don't encounter that

Or that putting back a drum that is groved, will have the only way
to get the shoes right is to manually adjust. Lucky for you that
you never have to work on a groved drum

I have many years experience with drum brakes, cut my driving teeth on 1970s vehicles with DRUMS on ALL FOUR WHEELS. You learn in a hurry to ensure the front brakes are set CORRECTLY dead on EVEN, otherwise you WILL be pulled left or right when you stomp on the brakes...

Ditto...decades of experience wrenching, but not for money but just
because love anything automotive. Though did for money working as
a mechanic paying for college...also a tire monkey at that tire
dealership. Ranged from mud hen econo to super cars to hot rods.

OBTW...cut my teeth on 50's era vehicles and designed industrial
brakes from multi floating discs on the same shaft, to drum (but the
shoes were not expanding but came in onto the drums external surface)
One disc was 48" dia with 8 calipers on it (all designed my
me...castings, calipers, the hydraulic system and the computer control system)

Do you have a super tune regime for shoe/drums? You understand why
some cut a slot in the friction material of shoes? While others have
tried drilling holes in the drum and failed ?

You know why parts wear a grove on the backing plate?

You know OEMs moved away from shoe/drum? Or that some OEMs managed
to have ABS tone rings on shoe/drums...while Detroit could not?

Do you stop the whole setup with just the trailer brakes 'most' of
the time in stop and go traffic?

Oh well, guess you think no one else should have an opinion...

:h

Oh well, I guess I am just a poor back yard mechanic that don't know nothing..

For some reason I seem to have no problem with brakes so I guess I will continue on the way I do it.

You are more than welcome to continue on with your method.

Potatoes, potaaatoes...

[BenK]

Sorry Barney...blocked that guy now and won't have to read nor tempted to respond again...

you can remove my comments on this post...the OP deserves a decent answer but
I'm done on this one

[BenK]

Gdetrailer wrote:

BenK wrote:
Why I check the trailer brakes (how warm/hot, how they sound rolling to a stop,
manually adjust the self adjusters, etc) at every stop

Even carry rebuild kits and have had to rebuild them out there

Now that is just plain silly...

Okay, if you say so, but that is for you, not me

I can not imagine that anyone is willing to tear apart or roll under the trailer and "adjust" the bakes manually.

I would suggest that you stop this practice, rest stops, parking lots and the such are a TERRIBLE place to attempt these kinds of preventative maintenance items. It is an extremely dangerous to do this even while on level land without adding public traffic.

Guess you never go to the places I do, so you are right for those
places you visit that is correct, but again, not for me

Your brakes even if you don't have auto adjusters WILL not require any adjustments to be done for 10,000-12,000 miles or one year. This IS the industry standard.

Agree for 'some' vehicles and for
the general folks out there and of which you must be...the fat part
of that herd

I am NOT part of that herd

Adjusting them needlessly using the "inspection" hole only will wear out the shoes at a faster rate at the least and at the worst OVER TIGHTEN the shoes causing extreme heat and possible loss of brakes.

Nope...not on the stuff I have or borrow...you must be buy cheap to
have that kind of wear and tear

Or your overly forcing, but you say you know HOW2...weird and goes
back to most likely buying cheap

The ONLY WAY to SAFELY "adjust" the brake shoes is to REMOVE the drum.

Maybe for you, but I've never lost a finger nor got hurt using the
shop manual's instructions to use that 'hole'

Simply put, you want only a SLIGHT amount of "resistance" felt when removing the drum. The brakes should not drag on the drums very much, only VERY SLIGHTLY. There is no way you can perform that while using the inspection cover and not jacking up the wheel.

I do jack that tire off pavement 'most' times. Can also adjust it
without jacking it up and am perfectly good for that and must be your
experience over tightening, but that is not needed by me

Or that some trailers I borrow has the drum groved and doesn't come
off that easily, but I don't manually adjust them by taking the drum
off, so don't encounter that

Or that putting back a drum that is groved, will have the only way
to get the shoes right is to manually adjust. Lucky for you that
you never have to work on a groved drum

I have many years experience with drum brakes, cut my driving teeth on 1970s vehicles with DRUMS on ALL FOUR WHEELS. You learn in a hurry to ensure the front brakes are set CORRECTLY dead on EVEN, otherwise you WILL be pulled left or right when you stomp on the brakes...

Ditto...decades of experience wrenching, but not for money but just
because love anything automotive. Though did for money working as
a mechanic paying for college...also a tire monkey at that tire
dealership. Ranged from mud hen econo to super cars to hot rods.

OBTW...cut my teeth on 50's era vehicles and designed industrial
brakes from multi floating discs on the same shaft, to drum (but the
shoes were not expanding but came in onto the drums external surface)
One disc was 48" dia with 8 calipers on it (all designed my
me...castings, calipers, the hydraulic system and the computer control system)

Do you have a super tune regime for shoe/drums? You understand why
some cut a slot in the friction material of shoes? While others have
tried drilling holes in the drum and failed ?

You know why parts wear a grove on the backing plate?

You know OEMs moved away from shoe/drum? Or that some OEMs managed
to have ABS tone rings on shoe/drums...while Detroit could not?

Do you stop the whole setup with just the trailer brakes 'most' of
the time in stop and go traffic?

Oh well, guess you think no one else should have an opinion...

[ford_truck_guy]

I carry a thermometer that I use at each stop to check.. I point it at each tire , wheel , and shoot for the drum area...If I see Any excessive numbers then I know that there may be a problem with that particular area...

[Gdetrailer]

KAYAKFISH wrote:
Did I mention that the two plugs for the adjustment slot were
missing on the bad side. Also I had the trailer inspected at the Rv
dealer where I bought it. Also why would I pull the wheels every time I stop on a brand new unit

kayakfish

Someone may have ATTEMPTED to adjust the brakes using the inspection hole. Most likely the RV dealer mechanic and as per my above post/rant, a very bad idea.

I would suggest that you find a NEW inspection station, do not go back to that dealer, the mechanic most likely was being lazy and was checking the brakes via inspection hole. At the same time cranked the adjuster a couple of notches. The result of this laziness is what happened to you...

You could try to see if the RV dealer that inspected it would be willing to reimburse your cost of repairs although I would not hold my breath on that.

[Gdetrailer]

BenK wrote:
Why I check the trailer brakes (how warm/hot, how they sound rolling to a stop,
manually adjust the self adjusters, etc) at every stop

Even carry rebuild kits and have had to rebuild them out there

Now that is just plain silly...

I can not imagine that anyone is willing to tear apart or roll under the trailer and "adjust" the bakes manually.

I would suggest that you stop this practice, rest stops, parking lots and the such are a TERRIBLE place to attempt these kinds of preventative maintenance items. It is an extremely dangerous to do this even while on level land without adding public traffic.

Your brakes even if you don't have auto adjusters WILL not require any adjustments to be done for 10,000-12,000 miles or one year. This IS the industry standard.

Adjusting them needlessly using the "inspection" hole only will wear out the shoes at a faster rate at the least and at the worst OVER TIGHTEN the shoes causing extreme heat and possible loss of brakes.

The ONLY WAY to SAFELY "adjust" the brake shoes is to REMOVE the drum.

Simply put, you want only a SLIGHT amount of "resistance" felt when removing the drum. The brakes should not drag on the drums very much, only VERY SLIGHTLY. There is no way you can perform that while using the inspection cover and not jacking up the wheel.

I have many years experience with drum brakes, cut my driving teeth on 1970s vehicles with DRUMS on ALL FOUR WHEELS. You learn in a hurry to ensure the front brakes are set CORRECTLY dead on EVEN, otherwise you WILL be pulled left or right when you stomp on the brakes...

[Gdetrailer]

mkirsch wrote:

KAYAKFISH wrote:
I had the trailer inspected in the late fall of 2012 and went to Fl this year and returned in march.

In other words, YOU have never actually inspected the brakes yourself.

Just because you "had {it} inspected" does not mean that the person doing the inspection pulled the wheels and actually looked inside. That's a lot of work and a lot of garage time for a $21 inspection.

You can pretty much rest assured that since the wheel was still firmly attached to the trailer, the inspector simply assumed everything was fine, passed the trailer, and collected your $21 or however much it was.

Your out of line.

To answer your question, YES THE MECHANIC MUST remove the drum and INSPECT the brakes. They MUST measure the brake lining left on the shoes. They MUST check the shoes for cracks, uneven wear. They MUST check the drum surface for any signs of excessive uneven wear.

Myself, I always stand near by and watch and observe the mechanic.

And NO, it isn't $21 now days, closer to $30.

To further answer your suspicious mind, in PA you take a vehicle or trailer to an INDEPENDENT MECHANIC (these are often garages which do tires and or basic repairs like brakes, shocks, and such)who has taken specific inspection courses AND PASS those courses, ALL paid by the mechanic. The mechanic is not required to be a "member" of any state or local government.

The Mechanic MUST take additional refresher courses (which is paid out of the mechanics pocket) in order to keep up to date with any changes.

This mechanic puts his/her name on the line, they must sign the inspection sticker and maintain very good inspection records which at any time CAN BE inspected by the state at any time.

As mentioned, not all garages/ inspection mechanics take trailers, one of the requirements needed to inspect trailers is the garage must have a paved outside "skirt" or a garage large enough to accommodate trailers. But there is no shortage of places to take a trailer.

[KAYAKFISH]

Did I mention that the two plugs for the adjustment slot were
missing on the bad side. Also I had the trailer inspected at the Rv
dealer where I bought it. Also why would I pull the wheels every time I stop on a brand new unit

kayakfish

[BenK]

Why I check the trailer brakes (how warm/hot, how they sound rolling to a stop,
manually adjust the self adjusters, etc) at every stop

Even carry rebuild kits and have had to rebuild them out there

[gparrow]

@mkirsch don't assume that everyone that has an RV has the ability to assess when a part is near failure. From what the OP stated his failure probably happened at some point on this trip so even if he had done the inspection himself last fall he probably would'nt have seen any signs that failure was eminent. I'm not saying that we don't need to be vigilant with the upkeep of our units but i don't think we need to be telling people to pull their axles apart every time they make a trip either.

[mkirsch]

KAYAKFISH wrote:
I had the trailer inspected in the late fall of 2012 and went to Fl this year and returned in march.

In other words, YOU have never actually inspected the brakes yourself.

Just because you "had {it} inspected" does not mean that the person doing the inspection pulled the wheels and actually looked inside. That's a lot of work and a lot of garage time for a $21 inspection.

You can pretty much rest assured that since the wheel was still firmly attached to the trailer, the inspector simply assumed everything was fine, passed the trailer, and collected your $21 or however much it was.

[BenK]

I've also seen and fixed smoking disc brakes. On both cars and TV's...stuck caliper
piston and some where the frame clip holding the brake hose rusts to pinch off
the hose and not allow the caliper piston to back off

[gkenworth]

As a mechanic, I've seen it on many vehicles with drum brakes, either hydraulic, electric or air brakes. The culprit on a brake that is adjusted properly is likely a broken spring. The one that holds the shoes tight onto the self adjuster. It's very odd for a spring to break on a '12 trailer. There are many culprits on brakes that aren't adjusted properly.
Never seen two brakes on one side fail and other side good.

[Airstreamer67]

A couple of years ago I was in the process of greasing my axle bearings and found what you did: the brake on one wheel was falling apart. In my case, it was the brake adjuster and related springs that were rolling around the wheel housing. I was able to just replace the badly damaged adjuster mechanism with no other apparent damage.

I suspect my problem began with a broken spring on the adjuster.

This can happen at any time. The only solution I know of is to be cognizant of how the rig is running and to take apart and inspect all wheels ever so often. How often depends on how much energy or money you have and how lucky you feel.