The Official unofficial CPE 2000i Generator Thread

[pritch272]

8/1/2010 edit: Thread renamed at the suggestion of the Professor.
Renamed from: Champion Inverter and Remote Gens Promo on CPE's web site)

3/22/2011 edit: Thread renamed ...
Renamed from: Official CPE 2000 Watt Inverter Generator Thread

3/23/2011 edit: Thread renamed at the suggestion of the Professor.
Renamed from: (Un)Official CPE 2000 Watt Inverter Generator Thread

Inverter Available August 2010



Remote Available July 2010

[bikendan]

canadiankid wrote:
Can anyone else comment on a 2000 Honda or Yamaha and a microwave please.Thanks.

my Honda 2000 runs my Magic Chef microwave without any problems. don't know the model #. it's in my '07 Rockwood Roo 23SS.

[Old___Slow]

Ah, shucks, I just looked up the Honda EU3000ISU, It has the Honda GX200 engine with only 3000w surge/2800w running. My Champion KO Chonda GX200 can run circles around this big boy. I sware to the most high, I peaked the Champion C46540 @ 49.2 amps on the clamp on meter. Maybe only for a fraction of a second. Can an Inverter come close to the old fuddy duddy and his Champ. $25 in material (soundboard) and some 1 x 2's from HD cut 15 dBA off the noise. Where's the beef?

Not with the EU2000i:)

[Old___Slow]

I read it on the internet somewhere:). It must be true. The 2000i Yahama spins @ 5600?
What about the CPE 2000 watt Inverter? What is it's max rpm? Anyway, for the small Inverters, I think I get the idea, it's the higher RPM to get max from the Inverter and more noise. Except I finally kinda understand why the Honda EU3000i running at 3500 max rpm might be the 'most efficient' and most quiet of the Inverters. Here's hoping we will have a winner with the new Champion Inverter.

[professor95]

Wayne Dohnal wrote:
IMO the inverter generator is getting more power from the same displacement engine by spinning it faster. The eu2000i, for example, runs at a top engine speed of 5,000 rpm instead of being constrained to 3,600.

WOW - I did not realize the upper RPM was 5,000! For some reason I thought it was 4,000. I just cannot imagine running a small generator engine over 5,000 RPM and having it hold up without a full flow pressurized lubrication system along with stronger rods and bearing construction.

I've got one of those solid state single cylinder tachometers that you only need to hold close to the spark plug wire to measure RPM. It even has a built in divide-by-two switch if the engine has a waste spark or is a 2 stroke engine.

I need to get the Kipor out on the driveway and load it down to see what RPM it is running. The speed really picks up, but I was "thinking" it was 4K. Maybe not?

I'll let you know.

[Wayne_Dohnal]

Engine/Electronics efficiency.
Take for example the Champion 80cc engine. With the common AC alternator their model 40048 is listed as 1500w/1200w and their model 73531i is listed as 2000w/1600w ~ The question is, through the process of first DC then AC and the power module (Inverter) one can increase the efficiency of a given displacement???:? Or is this, playing with the numbers? Both models are direct drive so no way to say the difference is in the transmission.

IMO the inverter generator is getting more power from the same displacement engine by spinning it faster. The eu2000i, for example, runs at a top engine speed of 5,000 rpm instead of being constrained to 3,600. The eu3000i by comparison uses a engine with twice the displacement for 50% more power, but its run speed tops out at 3,500 rpm. I don't see that CPE or Yamaha publish the engine speed for their inverter generators. When I crunched fuel consumption vs. power output numbers I concluded that when running at full power output, the inverter generators have a very small efficiency advantage, but it's so small that I'd just call it even. My guess if that the inverter generator's alternator is more efficient, but that gain is lost in the rectifier/inverter circuitry. I assume it's pretty well known by now that at less than full power the inverter generator just stomps the conventional generator, efficiency-wise. Part of that would be due to being able to use a smaller displacement engine, and part due to spinning a lower mass and/or spinning it at a lower speed.

The eu2000i's displacement is 98cc. If CPE or Yamaha don't run the 79cc engine faster than 5,000 rpm, I'd seriously question if it can provide as much power as the eu2000i.

[professor95]

byates wrote:
I think the answer lies in the quality of the breaker switch, not whether it is thermal push button, thermal/magnetic switch, or solid state switch.

Not to get into a long discussion, but this is a big issue with me. I DO NOT like the thermal breakers and never have. I consider them unsafe for use with generators. There response time to a fault or over current situation can be as long as 15 minutes before a trip. The more expensive thermal/magnetic responds in seconds to an over current situation or fault.

I tolerate the thermal push button breakers because I am generally feeding power into a breaker panel on the RV with magnetic breakers. I know they react quickly to faults.

You may or may not know that I also use a GFCI with any generator and have advised others to do the same. The reasoning is wrapped around the issues of neutral identification and bonding or choosing not to bond - the latter IMPO being much safer for a RV.

As an Electrical Engineer, Master Electrician and long-time teacher of electricity/electronics there are many issues concerning electrical safety with a generator people without such knowledge do not understand or simply ignore.

My comment/response was simply to point out that CPE's election to use a switch type fast response breaker over a push button thermal was a positive decision for personal safety.

I agree with you totally on quality materials. I simply hate cheap stuff that breaks or fails causing the frustration of replacement and the time and energy lost. I NEVER buy the 48 cent switches or outlets. I prefer to spend more and buy a quality specification or commercial grade device. Same is true for power tools, hand tools, lawn care equipment, etc. Cheaply made junk that breaks or falls apart is not a cost savings. I prefer metal to plastic whenever possible.

Not all items made in China are junk. But, that said, there are boat loads of junk being imported from China. You do have to be selective and have some trust/experience with the brand. As an example, Harbor Freight is a Chinese tool mecca. If you do not know what you are buying there beforehand it is easy to get junk. 🙂 I love to shop in the store but am extremely selective about what I purchase.

[byates]

I think the answer lies in the quality of the breaker switch, not whether it is thermal push button, thermal/magnetic switch, or solid state switch. Any switch can cause problems if they are poorly made. You can buy a light switch at Home Depot for less than a dollar, and replace it in a couple of years. I choose the $3 dollar switches, which in my opinion are better quality and will last.

My Onan Homesite has the push button breaker in the panel, as does the breaker panel in my G3 boat. Some would say that I paid too much for the Homesite because of the Onan brand, when compared to other Chinese made generators-but it is a well built generator and has served me well with no problems. Others would say that I paid too much for my G3 Eagle 175PF, when compared to a similarly equipped BassTracker-but I believe it is a better made boat and will be used by my kids and grandkids long after I'm gone.

How well a product is made is the number 1 factor in whether I buy or not buy the product.

[professor95]

The push button breakers are generally thermal. They have a slow overload response time and are IMHO more dangerous to a person should a fault occur.

The switch type breakers are generally much faster response magnetic/thermal. Much safer for people in a fault situation.

I can see your concern about breaking off the switch. Metal guards are available to protect the handle (switch). If it is an issue with the user, a guard can be added. Your local "home store" should have them (Lowe's or HD). If not, electrical supply specialty stores will, such as this one..

[Old___Slow]

Engine/Electronics efficiency.

Take for example the Champion 80cc engine. With the common AC alternator their model 40048 is listed as 1500w/1200w and their model 73531i is listed as 2000w/1600w ~ The question is, through the process of first DC then AC and the power module (Inverter) one can increase the efficiency of a given displacement???:? Or is this, playing with the numbers? Both models are direct drive so no way to say the difference is in the transmission.

One other question about the Inverter gens. They have the loss of some rotational mass for the peaks. My dear ol' Champion C46540 once showed (by using a clamp on meter and a capture the peak red button) 49.2 amps when the Coleman 13,500 btu A/C cycled. The load had been running 18.7 amps. Electric fridge, converter/charger, plus some other items. After 30 miutues I could no longer reach those nunbers. From all I read, no GX200 class Inverter can equal that peak. And BTW, I have been reading some reviews of the Yamaha 2000i (79cc engine) that it will not fully power a 1000w microwave. Maybe someone with superior knowledge will give us the real scoop.

[dro1984]

Don't shoot the messenger but this is my personal opinion and personal experience... You can disagree if you'd like.

It's at Sam's Club in Michigan. Auburn Hills to be exact. $499. I picked it up off the shelf and played with it a-bit. It's definitely heavier than the Honda EU2000I by about 7 lbs. (53 lbs dry according to the tag and box it's in/on.) and it feels like it too. Honestly folks, the build quality of the panels and switch knobs, the entire Gen-set is not impressive. Felt flimsy to me. Instead of a push-to-reset breaker, there appears to be an actual switch knob (like a light-switch) that sticks out. I'm assuming it's a breaker or something as it's not clearly labeled on the darn thing???? No manual in display to look at either. What ever it is, it's not what I would want protruding from the side of my generator. I'm as careful as can be, and I still bang my Generator around loading and unloading or just moving it around. I'd be afraid that switch knob would be the first thing to get broken off.
Basically my opinion is you'll get what you pay for! The old adage holds true again. It is $499 and that's cheaper than Honda or Yamaha, but having used both of them, they are very solidly built including their cover panels.
Conclusion: If you can't afford H or Y, and your going to use it for light duty, this will probably do the trick. If your going to use it alot or as in a contractor situation, pass this one up!
I highly encourage those of you to take a look for yourself side-by-side. I too would like to see how it compares electrically. Doesn't anyone have a $24 meter handy?

[5akman]

I'm still looking for the Champ 2000i here in CA or for that matter in the US. I've seen it a few places for 699.00 but I'd pay the extra 220.00 and get the Honda if the price is that close. I just called Champion and they said 6-8 months for Cabelas to have it or Sams Club has it now. I just checked the Sams Club website and they don't even show it listed. Anyone have a update?

Lance

[Old___Slow]

Why is there such silence about the true operation of the new Champion Inverter. With sight and sound and a Kill-A-Watt meter?

[McZippie]

If anyone is interested, I added some bench test pictures, without the plastic covers, to my "LIFAN 2200 Watt Inverter Generator, Electric Start Video" topic. I have it now running from an auxiliary fuel tank and extended the exhaust pipe.Clicky

[Old___Slow]

SurfaceDreamer wrote:

Old & Slow wrote:

S.Dreamer,

You seem willing to share all your knowledge of Champion and Sam's Club. This Inverter has been on the market for about a month now with no 'It's a marvel reports' Maybe you can pass along some knowledge as to real facts. What is the output in watts after 30 minutes. Maybe 1200w? Will two of them together operate a 13,500 btu A/C for more than 30 minutes on a Arizona 100 degree day? Howabout the noise. At full bore of 80cc @ 4000 plus rpm, is it as quiet as the Honda EU2000i? Do we have real competition with this New Champion Inverter to H & Y. If so, we will add to the CCC's less than quiet chant. I already belong.

BTW: Please don't leave us like several other posters after droping in and out with only two or three posts. Some came and went with less.:h

I'll share what I can when I get the first chance to test things. Between work, school and family my time is at a premium and I probably won't have time to really look at things for at least a few more weeks.

My family and I are on a lot of firsts here; our first trailer, our first generator and our first camping trip in 2-3 weeks (the plan as it stands today). As for the CPE 2000 unit - I know I took somewhat of a leap of faith based on overall CPE views on many boards. Considering the price of other units I was looking at (Kipor, Boliy and Yamaha) I'm hoping it works out. I will keep you posted on what I find.

P.S Without digging around and having not looked at the documentation for the unit - what is the easiest way most people determine power output for a generator? I have no experience with any other generator so I'm not sure I'll be able to help with the noise comparison except of my interpretation of how it sounds. I'll do my best though 😉

It should not be to time consuming or difficult to plug your new 2000w Champion Inverter into your TT. Congrat's on all your forth coming, hopefully happy travel days with all the new equipment. Have no fear, we are always here. Now, this is the momnent we have been waiting. The Micro test. Please take that leap of faith. As of now, I can not find one owner of the new Champion Inverter who will come on and say, hay, I have given it the mirco and the true 1600w test and all is well. With something like a P3 meter, only about $25. The idea is it must prove the test for more that 30 minutes. My Champion C46540 has a decrease of output after that period of time. Like operating the A/C with other loads. Anyway, it's the 'mirco test' many have been waiting. Either it will or it won't, cook my goose.

[SplashDancer]

And for anyone looking for it, the paralleling kit for 2 units is available on Costco Canada website, Item 238112 foro $95 Cdn.
I'm seriously considering one of these; figure for how much I'd use it, if it lasts 5 years or so, it's still a great deal.

Has anyone actually tried a 1500 watt load like a hair dryer or other pure resistive load, and did it work. I'd like, but am not panicked, it to start a microwave, but if not, not a huge deal. Gotta watch them anyway, I've seen 1000-1200 watt output microwaves with 1300-1400 watt inpu; these larger units are sometimes LESS input wattage than the cheap little units at 8-900 watts. Guess it's an efficiency thing.