Another question on winter traction

[buddyIam]

On the way to Mammoth during the 1980's I stopped to chain up on the way up Sherman Pass.. A jeep Cherokee speed past us. A 1/4 of a mile past us the Jeep took a near 90 degree left hand turn. crossed 4 lanes of road and a island and drove at least 30 feet up a incline of what may have been 45 degrees. (this was in a cutout made for the highway.)

The Jeep rolled down the embankment made an almost 180 degree reversal crossed the 4 lanes and island again and speed the same distance up the opposite embankment. It then rolled back down, facing in the right direction in almost the exact spot the accident began.

Is this just the result of the foot to the floor of a petrified driver? When we drove by them the driver was still sitting still in his seat.

Some have said it may have been the result of to much speed and a 4x4 without a locking front differential combined with patchy ice on the road. Their explanation is that one wheel began spinning at double speed while on ice. Then hit bare pavement. This makes sense also.


We were in a dually work truck with a lot of weight but the ice was patchy and bad. So we chained up.

[blt2ski]

How far can one slide down a 15% grade that is covered in snow and ice at 30F temps, and you have warm tires?

all the way!

Marty

[Grit_dog]

So what's the question?

[rhagfo]

oughtsix wrote:

jus2shy wrote:
Your post reminded me of this which happened back in 07'
Portland, OR

I spent one winter commuting in Bend Oregon on all season tires. That was just insane. I have had studded tires for winter driving ever since as do most Bend residents. Unfortunately Portland does not get enough snow and ice to warrant a second complete set of winter tires for most residents.

That video was just crazy. Take your foot off the accelerator for goodness sake!

It is not clear in the video, but the street is on a hill! Same for the Seattle video, both Seattle and Portland have some very nasty hills, but with Ice and Snow it doesn't take much once you get going.

[Fixed_Sight_Tra]

I can have the tires at full steer and be plowing straight ahead. You almost never want to have your front differential locked. You have to have gotten yourself in really deep doodoo to need your front differential locked. Of course there isn't much that is more fun than finding that really deep doodoo with a couple of buddies... where you are grateful that you have the option of locking your front differential.

This is true. I was driving a Ford Bronco with an optional front diff positraction around a wet cloverleaf. The front posi kicked in and I became a passenger and went straight off the road. Luckily I wasn't going very fast and there wasn't anything there to hit. I'd never have anything that locks automatically in the front. A manual locker is great, tho.

[oughtsix]

jus2shy wrote:
Your post reminded me of this which happened back in 07'
Portland, OR

I spent one winter commuting in Bend Oregon on all season tires. That was just insane. I have had studded tires for winter driving ever since as do most Bend residents. Unfortunately Portland does not get enough snow and ice to warrant a second complete set of winter tires for most residents.

That video was just crazy. Take your foot off the accelerator for goodness sake!

[coolbreeze01]

Simply bad driving, or a medical issue, or even a mechanical problem. We'll never know at this late date.

I ordered a 1979 Ford F150 with front and rear positraction. Worked very well, but required a bit of skill to keep it going in the direction you wanted to go.

[buddyIam]

Redrocket

No I don't. Not trying to be rude here. But that's why I didn't make a statement. I asked asked a question.

[RedRocket204]

jus2shy wrote:
Your post reminded me of this which happened back in 07'
Portland, OR

Yes, I was living on the north OR coast commuting into Beaverton during that storm. Portland is filled with drivers that have very little experience driving on conditions like that. Every single one of those drivers in the video should not have been on the road that day.

I drove from Beaverton, 75 miles to home that day without a single issue. Difference being...I have lots of experience driving in those types of conditions. You should have seen the overwhelming amount of white knuckled, paranoid drivers on Hwy 26 that day. They were an absolute danger on the road.

[P_Kennedy]

Distracted driving has now exceeded the #1 cause for fatalities and motor vehicle incidents over impaired drivers. Multi tasking has been not just accepted but the preferred type of person to hire for productivity and promotion. Unfortunately these same people and technology have created a need to focus with priority on anything except the task at hand driving. High tech vehicles with enhanced built in skills allow drivers to be less skilled while driving and more protected. The combination has created a situation when there is incidents the results are more drastic. In Alberta distracted driving is a $172 fine but the officer is not allowed to check or confiscate your phone and they are not willing to subpoena phone/text records. Just a rough stat shows 14-15000 MVI fatalities in Canada and the United States for every 1 firearm related fatality but the number of people still driving after guilty of the incident is over 95%. Something to think about next time your driving and you just have to do something other than look ahead assessing the road in the varying conditions.

[RedRocket204]

OP,

Do you even know if the driver had the vehicle in 4x4? Some assumptions here unless you asked them...certainly not trying to be rude here.

Just too many inexperienced drivers driving in adverse roads conditions with an invincible attitude. You seem to find a higher percentage of these types in areas where driving on snow/ice is not as common.

[Lessmore]

Sinterior wrote:
Where I live, 95%+ of the vehicles in the ditch after Winters first snow, are 4X4's or AWD's
My thoughts? Driver over confidence and lack of proper Winter tires.

Many of the modern vehicles are much better than what we had 25, 30, 40 years ago. But many more vehicles and drivers out there now.

I note there are a lot of bad drivers, who make things worse for them and others, by distracting themselves when driving by using cell phone, eating, trying to find classic hits on the radio, etc.

I've been driving since the 1960's and find that in the past decade or so, sometimes it's like 'driving' in a video game out there.

I find in city driving, I usually don't have the radio on....too busy driving around the.....as Bugs Bunny used to say...'the maroons'.;)

[Sinterior]

Where I live, 95%+ of the vehicles in the ditch after Winters first snow, are 4X4's or AWD's
My thoughts? Driver over confidence and lack of proper Winter tires.

[jus2shy]

Your post reminded me of this which happened back in 07'
Portland, OR

[oughtsix]

buddyIam wrote:
Some have said it may have been the result of to much speed and a 4x4 without a locking front differential combined with patchy ice on the road. Their explanation is that one wheel began spinning at double speed while on ice. Then hit bare pavement. This makes sense also.

It is pretty much impossible to drive with a locked front differential. A differential allows the outside tire to spin faster in a turn than the inside tire because the outside tire covers more distance. Locked differentials, front or rear, almost always produce wheel slippage around corners in slippery road conditions because of the lack of differential action. Once a tire has broken loose traction and control goes down hill rapidly from there.

I have a 76 International Scout with ARB selectable locking front and rear differentials. With the rear differential locked steering is a bit more difficult depending on the terrain. With the front differential locked, depending on the terrain, I can have the tires at full steer and be plowing straight ahead. You almost never want to have your front differential locked. You have to have gotten yourself in really deep doodoo to need your front differential locked. Of course there isn't much that is more fun than finding that really deep doodoo with a couple of buddies... where you are grateful that you have the option of locking your front differential.