Broken Frame

[Raften]

Discovered today my passenger side frame rail Is fully severed. No idea how long it has been like that. Big TC's and rough roads don't mix well. Oh well, take it to a frame shop and splint it then sell the TC and get a small fiver.

[jmckelvy]

jimh425 wrote:
I'm not sure why there is an assumption that a different feel means bad. .......

I was thinking the same thing. The truck had a BROKEN FRAME that is now fixed. 🙂

It should feel different. Perhaps as it felt before the frame broke?

[jimh406]

I'm not sure why there is an assumption that a different feel means bad. I was thinking different as in more stiff.

As far as the auto industry engineers go, what makes people think that every part is made with the most reliability in mind? My experience tells me that those engineers like every other engineer makes a tradeoff, and there will almost always be potential improvements that are possible.

[Reality_Check]

silversand wrote:
...

As Travelnuts elaborates, there is no intuition involved in the design and engineering of today's vehicles (or satellites, or space shuttle, or nuclear power plants, or aircraft, etc) , so the same level of engineering, technology and procedure absolutely has to go into a structural repair -- guess-work and pure "experience" with no substantial technical connection to the vehicle manufacturer will have nothing to do with a successful vehicle frame repair or structural repair on a building or an aircraft or subway car or ship; only engineering and a detailed procedural write-up {like Ford and GM have} followed absolutely to the letter by a repair venue, will work. Anything else: and you are playing with your life.

Good luck,
S-

And the world would come to a grinding halt... sounds great, like a utopia of clinical lab coat folks, thinking that the worlds repair shops have the knowledge and equipment available to the manufacturer's (actually, it sounds expensive, time consuming and painfully slow...but that's only based on life experience).



To each his own..

[silversand]

...glad the OP's truck is back in business. The only thing that would worry me about such a frame repair is the reported substantial change in the repaired truck's driving characteristics. This would worry me immensely. The post repair feel in my estimation, should behave like a new vehicle (barring any suspension and wheel modifications the owner may have made post-purchase). I would have applied for an insurance claim for a potential write-off if it were me (but it wasn't me). wonder what kind of guarantee the repair facility has offered the OP ???? Was there a liability release in the guarantee ?

As Travelnuts elaborates, there is no intuition involved in the design and engineering of today's vehicles (or satellites, or space shuttle, or nuclear power plants, or aircraft, etc) , so the same level of engineering, technology and procedure absolutely has to go into a structural repair -- guess-work and pure "experience" with no substantial technical connection to the vehicle manufacturer will have nothing to do with a successful vehicle frame repair or structural repair on a building or an aircraft or subway car or ship; only engineering and a detailed procedural write-up {like Ford and GM have} followed absolutely to the letter by a repair venue, will work. Anything else: and you are playing with your life.

Good luck,
S-

[okan-star]

Raften wrote:

bka0721 wrote:

Raften wrote:
Repair is done, time will tell how well it holds up. One thing is for sure, I will be doing a creeper roll around under the truck often from now on. As would be expected, the truck has a different driving feel going down the road unloaded. Tomorrow I will move my boat and TC 130 miles so should get a feel for loaded driving. Thanks for all the interest and advise.

And all this was done without pictures?

This tough group of TC posters let an OP go without ever posting a pic?

Well, then I say it never happened and it was just a really good story.

With a happy ending, as all good tales end in.

b

Yep, just a good story to help pass the time, smiles all around. But wait, my bank balance seems to have gone down.

I could email someone my pictures and they can post them. I can't figure out how to get them to post from a iPhone .

Just nice to hear your going to put the TC back on

Can you e-mail the pics to yourself ,save them to your computer, use tiny pic or somthing to up-load them ,love to see them since I have that truck also

[Raften]

bka0721 wrote:

Raften wrote:
Repair is done, time will tell how well it holds up. One thing is for sure, I will be doing a creeper roll around under the truck often from now on. As would be expected, the truck has a different driving feel going down the road unloaded. Tomorrow I will move my boat and TC 130 miles so should get a feel for loaded driving. Thanks for all the interest and advise.

And all this was done without pictures?

This tough group of TC posters let an OP go without ever posting a pic?

Well, then I say it never happened and it was just a really good story.

With a happy ending, as all good tales end in.

b

Yep, just a good story to help pass the time, smiles all around. But wait, my bank balance seems to have gone down.

I could email someone my pictures and they can post them. I can't figure out how to get them to post from a iPhone .

[bka0721]

Raften wrote:
Repair is done, time will tell how well it holds up. One thing is for sure, I will be doing a creeper roll around under the truck often from now on. As would be expected, the truck has a different driving feel going down the road unloaded. Tomorrow I will move my boat and TC 130 miles so should get a feel for loaded driving. Thanks for all the interest and advise.

And all this was done without pictures?

This tough group of TC posters let an OP go without ever posting a pic?

Well, then I say it never happened and it was just a really good story.

With a happy ending, as all good tales end in.

b

[sleepy]

BlueCoyote wrote:
From the Blue Oval factory:
https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas/non-html/Q18.pdf

Thanks Blue coyote,

Your link has very interesting reading.... it is very specific for the "how-too's"

I picked up on something else... by reading it the reader can understand how different truck camper system tie-downs actually function with their trucks flexible frame... maybe which system is the best for theit T/TC combonation.

sleepy

[BlueCoyote]

From the Blue Oval factory:
https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas/non-html/Q18.pdf

[Raften]

Repair is done, time will tell how well it holds up. One thing is for sure, I will be doing a creeper roll around under the truck often from now on. As would be expected, the truck has a different driving feel going down the road unloaded. Tomorrow I will move my boat and TC 130 miles so should get a feel for loaded driving. Thanks for all the interest and advise.

[travelnutz]

Don't abruptly end the boxing added plate with vertical end especially in or near a high stress area nor should you weld in a highly stressed area. That's why you taper both ends of an added plate that forms the box. A frame rail must flex a little rather than fracture or propagate a crack. Abruptly ending the boxed area simply chases the solid non-flexing area to where the frame's now weak point will now be. If you don't realize or know where the high stress areas are, go to someone who actually does. I hope that helps you to understand better.

Few cowboy welding shops will know either but will tell you about the thousands of frames they've welded before if you believe them.

[ticki2]

54suds wrote:
properly done it disperses & spreads the stress over a larger area

Ticki2 did you fix that dent ????

I understand the advantage of boxing a frame , I used that method on the old Dodge , I was puzzled by the statement not to do it in a high stress area . Perhaps I'm reading it incorrectly .


Ah yes , the dent . I had hoped to get to it this past winter but that didn't happen . Made some good progress this summer . Exterior panels are on , rib replaced , spayed insulation replaced and working on interior aluminum . Should be finished this fall , too late for camping this year as truck goes into plow mode . Will be giving a full report on the Avion thread , with pics , when done . The thread has gotten so big I want to keep it all in one place .

I passed through your stomping grounds last week coming back from a friends camp near Old Forge .

[54suds]

properly done it disperses & spreads the stress over a larger area

Ticki2 did you fix that dent ????

[ticki2]

travelnutz wrote:
of the same metal thickness that closes the "C" into a box can be a real help as long as the added metal doesn't end abruptly but rather tapers away and doesn't occur at a high stress area.

Now I'm confused . What would be the advantage of boxing the frame in a low stress area ?

[travelnutz]

Yes, boxing a "C" frame can be a big help for strength but the original "C" frame metal must be up to snuff in strength first as in NO strength compromising cracks or fatigued areas. It's the vertical metal cross section (some refer to it as the "web") that provides most of the strength and adding another vertical wall (edge metal/web) of the same metal thickness that closes the "C" into a box can be a real help as long as the added metal doesn't end abruptly but rather tapers away and doesn't occur at a high stress area. There's more to it also.

Welding a crack closed and going beyond the visible crack length and then grinding the surface level and plating over both sides and the using of puddle holes about 1" dia spaced out on the centerline along the added plates and welded 360 degrees in the puddle holes along with the welding of the outside edge of the added plates will nearly accompolish the same strength as the one added plate to close the "C" shape into a box. The boxing is usually a lot less work. There's no perfect way to repair a broken frame as it depends on so many factors as to where and why it even had broken or cracked.

Red, of course I know hydroforming and its advantages and disadvantages. Liquid used is not compressable and forces sheetmetal walls to move to the mold/die female shaped surface within reason. Any expansion in the root metal's shape/linear circumference results in thinning of the root wall thickness but allows shapes to be made that can or will increase the structural integrity of the formed section. Some steel compositions and/or alloys do not do well when hydroformed.