Buying a rig, help with truck choice pls.

[UKMark]

Hi all
I am from the UK and looking to spend winters in US South West. Provided the visa application goes well (we only get 90 days in US as standard so need a B2 visa) we will buy a 5er and truck for our winter stay and store it over the summer whilst we go back to the UK each year.
We have looked at 5s and so far we are leaning towards a 38ft Montana which seems to have a dry weight of about 13,000lbs. At least that what I have been told by the (not too helpful) guy at Camping World. We are out 'house hunting' again tomorrow.:) as we are over here (In AZ at present) in a rented motor home until March. So we will have a clearer idea of the 5 then. But it will be in that ball park. Anything smaller will not suit is for such a long period.
What seems to be a total minefield of decision is the tow truck. I have read hundreds of posts on the subject here and have at least formed a list of questions to start with so I am hoping that the great brains of the forum can clear things up a bit and help me decide.
First off, pls understand, being from the UK I don't really have any particular 'team' I follow. But I would want a U.S. truck (IE Ford, Dodge or Chevvy). Nothing from overseas.
Also, the truck will be our only transport whilst here so something usable/park able/drive able to get the shopping as well is needed 🙂

So here are some of the questions I have to help make a decision. Sorry for such a long post.
1. 2500/3500. Sales guy at GMC said only difference is an extra leaf on the rear springs....
2. Short or long bed
3. Gas or diesel. This is a big one. General view so far seems to be diesel. I personally don't like diesel vehicles being an owner of a diesel SUV in the UK. But that is just a personal thing and won't impact the purchase if diesel is the way to go.
4. Engine size, if there are options
5. Transmission options?
6. Rear axle ratio. Looked at a Ford truck but the axle was 3.3. Salesman assured me that would be fine but not so sure.
7. Colour 🙂 Only joking...
8. Anything else to be considered....

Many thanks, sorry again for such a big post
Mark

[Bedlam]

My suggestion is to find a fifth wheel that you like which has a gross weight rating under 15,000 lbs. this is typically the limit of 350/3500 SRW trucks due to the pin weight that is being carried on the rear axle.

Some new fifth wheels have an extended pin box and tapered corners up front allowing you to tow them in a short bed with a fixed hitch. This will take about 1.5' off the length of your tow vehicle and reduce the cost and complexity of your hitch.

If you forgo the crew cab with four full doors and select an extended with suicide half doors in the rear half, you will save another foot in length (short bed extended cab trucks are typically under 20' long). Although the SRW truck will still be wider than what you are used to driving in the UK, it will be very maneuverable in this shorter configuration.

If you plan to stay on flats, the new gasoline engines will not have trouble pulling a 15,000 lb FW. If you plan to visit the Rocky Mountains, the elevation height will derate a normally aspirated engine by up to 30% and will make your drive fatiguing. This is why most people suggest a turbo diesel for this amount of weight. Fuel cost is higher for diesel in the US than for gasoline, but typically the mileage benefit of diesel will cancel out fuel expenditures while giving you a longer cruising range on the same size tank.

If you are buying a new truck and cannot find the configuration you want, test drive the ones closest to your wants. If they do not meet your expectations, you can custom a order a truck and have it built for you in 10-12 weeks.

[mountainsam]

A huge plus for the diesel is the engine brake in the newer models. It makes driving in mountains much easier and safer.

[ib516]

For that trailer a 2500 will be just fine. That is pretty much exactly the weight mine is. I have been to the weigh scales with mine and I am under all of the truck's ratings.

Diesel vs. gas is up to you. Ultimately, the Cummins will be a better "tow vehicle" than the 6.4L Hemi. I only rarely use my truck for towing, so I had other factors to throw into the decision.

[donn0128]

With a fiver of under 12000 pounds GVWR a 2500/250 series truck will be fine. But for the few dollars difference 3500/350 series still makes better sense to me. Bit more carrying capacity instead of marginal capacity. Gas vs diesel? Huge debate. Personally I would still go diesel for the longevity, durability, towing power. Especially at higher altitudes that you might experience in places like the Rocky mt regions in the west. More expensive? Yes, better resale value? Oh yes.

[jerem0621]

There is certainly nothing wrong with the cummins motor...yes, the 3/4 ton Ram "should" be up to the job.

A Ram with the 6.4 Hemi will pull it just fine (as in, with power to spare) and depending in what year Cummins, out pull a cummins.

IMHO. If it was a new 6.4 Hemi vs an older Cummins, (03-10 ish) then I would hands down go Hemi. You don't need a diesel for those weights. But if a Cummins is what you want then don't settle.

Either platform will serve you well at these weights so it mostly comes down to your preference.

Diesel does give you the option to fill up where the big rigs fill up...that may make fueling easier while under tow. Gas trucks HAVE to fill up with four wheelers zipping around and jockeying for space at the fuel stations.

Thanks and enjoy the new rig if you buy it..no matter your choice.

Jeremiah

[UKMark]

Hi again all
Firstly, huge thanks to everyone for the really useful info. Thought I would post an update.
Wifey and I went out today just to look at RV fivers to get a better feel for what we might want to go for. We came across a unit we both really liked, a Palamino Sabre loaded up with just about every option the manufacturer had. 2010 model, looks like it has been really cherished in really as new condition. It is a 32 ft model CKDS floor plan. So a little shorter/lighter than we had initially aimed at but I think will suit us better. It is just the two of us and we like to move around to see your beautiful country. So it will be easier to manage, especially as our first RV.
We are very tempted to buy it. Just wanted to revisit the whole truck thing based on this unit.
GVWR is 11,954, Hitch weight is 1,794. Length 32ft
So now being a bit more specific on the fiver in tow, can I ask again (sorry) for towing beasties that will do the trick.
Will a 2500 be man enough now? And SRW?
I am leaning toward Dodge Ram with Cummmins Diesel, mainly because I keep hearing how great they are. But that could be me falling for the marketing.
And if anyone has any views on the Sabre Pls tell me your thoughts.

Thanks for all the help, what a fantastic site this is!
Cheers
Mark

[Turtle_n_Peeps]

1. Get a 3500 dually with a trailer that big.

2. Long bed unless you want to mess around with a slider.

3. Get a diesel for a trailer that big.

4. There will be no options for a US diesel unless you buy used.

5. There will be no options for a tranny unless you buy used. (I take that back, with a Ram you can get the Aisin transmission. Both the standard automatic and the Aisin transmissions are great trannys; take your pick.) (Get an automatic though)

6. With 6 speed trannys it doesn't really matter anymore. Some will argue the matter, but if you do the math it won't really matter.

7. The one your wife wants. :B

8. Make sure you can handle such a large rig. Towing over here is a far different experience than towing in the UK.

9. Have a great time here and be safe. 🙂

[donn0128]

Maybe you should reconsider your ideas. Maybe a motor home and a small car for running around. Having less than comfortable truck with a large fifth wheel in tow is going to end up biting you in the rear end eventually. A dually truck is no harder to handle than an equally long SRW. You must remember, the mirrors are the widest part of any truck, not the dually fenders.

[ib516]

Hi Mark.

I own a Ram 2500 with the 6.4L Hemi/4.10 combo as mentioned above. Now that you know what that means....

I have been very happy with the performance of the truck hauling our RV.
The RV is 37' long and weighs about 12,000#. When weighed together, my truck and trailer weigh 9500 Kg (20500#). The truck is rated for a combined weight of 10,227 Kg (22500#).



I would suggest at least a 3500 SRW for that RV. It will add some capacity, though in the RAM truck products, with which I am very familiar, the only mechanical difference between my truck and a 3500 SRW is the rear suspension. Mine has heavy duty coil springs, the 3500 has traditional leaf springs, and an accompanying higher rear axle weight rating. The axles, tires, brakes, etc are all the same.
It's more marketing than solid mechanical differences (other than the aforementioned rear suspension). In tests I have done, the 3500 SRW does sag about 2 cm less with a 3000# load than my truck did.

Here are some pictures. Mine is the silver, petrol powered 2500, the darker colored one is a diesel 3500 SRW. The RV is the same unit. It is 41 feet long and weighs in at 14000# by itself (6360 Kg). It belongs to a friend who owns the 3500 SRW truck in the pictures, also a 2014 model.





I also did some comparison pulls which I posted on YouTube.

LINK TO VIDEOS
Check the description for which truck is which and what we are testing in each video.

As far as which brand to purchase, I happen to like RAM, but really, you can't go wrong if buying new. We are all about trucks here and these things are tested, tested again, and reviewed. There isn't one I wouldn't buy, but they do have different "personalities". You have to find the one you like best by driving them. The capacities are all very similar as well, with RAM having a slight edge generally, but that's somewhat thanks to the marketing department rather than huge mechanical variations between brands.

One other note: The 3500/350 DRW trucks will have more towing and hauling capacity than their SRW twins. That is because lower rear axle gear ratios (higher numbers such as 3.73 and 4.10) are offered in the DRW versions that are not offered in the SRW versions, which are usually 3.31, 3.42, etc. The exception to this is GM/Chevy which are 3.73 no matter what the truck. If it has a diesel engine and it's a GMC or Chevy 2500HD or 3500HD truck, it has a 3.73 rear axle ratio.

Hope that helps.

[APT]

Diesel dually. You will be every bit of 15000 pounds loaded with 3000 pounds of pin weight. 15000 pounds puts you over every 1-ton gas tow rating I believe. I don't think you'll be happy towing that much weight with a gas engine anyway. And the extra stability of the dual rear wheels with 3000+ pounds in the bed is something every driver enjoys.

[C-Bears]

I started with a used 38' long Montana. Got a F350 6.7 diesel SRW. Weighed truck fully loaded then weighed truck/Montana fully loaded and hooked up. Under on all my weight limits....perfect!

Then we traded it in for a 39' Montana. Now I am right on the bubble with my weights and have to monitor it constantly. Wish I would have went with the same F350 6.7 diesel but with DRW instead of SRW. If I had I wouldn't be worrying about my weights all the time.

The downside is using a 1-ton truck for regular daily driving when it has DRW as compared to a 1-ton shorter bed with SRW.

[phillyg]

At 13,000lbs dry weight, you're in the 350/3500 truck range regardless of the GMC salesman's thoughts. You can get by with a short bed if you get a slider hitch, thus making it easier to drive and park about town when you're not towing. An automatic slider is best but at more cost. It might be difficult to find a gasser that will have the tow rating you need. The newer diesels and gassers have five-speed transmission which is good, but I think you'll find that a 3.73 axle will be the lowest that will fit your weight needs. Red, definitely red.

[UKMark]

dballentine wrote:


3500 = Model number for GMC/Chevy/RAM 1-ton trucks. Equivalent Ford model is F-350.

SRW = Single Rear Wheel (per side). As opposed to DRW, dual rear wheel, commonly called a "dually".

RAM 6.4/4.10 = RAM (Dodge) brand, 6.4 liter motor, 4.10 rear end ratio.

Ford 6.2 and Chevy/GMC 6.0 both refer to engine size in liters.

Hope this helps!

Thata a big help thanks. I will get used to the jargon eventually!

I have read a couple of posts about the dodge engine have more pulling power than the other two. Any views on how true that is. It will be kinda hard to feel that kind of thing in a road test. I doubt the sales guy will let me hitch up my 5 and head off to a mountain road to compare them!

Regards
Mark

[UKMark]

misterpowertools wrote:
if you are not planning on travelling with the trailer, you may as well hire someone to move it 2x a year for you and buy or rent a car.

Yes we did consider that as an option but I think we will move around more often than that. On this trip we have rarely stayed anywhere longer than 2/3 weeks and usuall a week is our average. We just like to see different places...
Thanks
Mark